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MurlocAggroB from the second-most ridiculous province of Canada
Nov 22nd 2022 at 8:58:13 PM

You're also missing Green Goblin.

EDIT: Page-topper. Missing Green Goblin for Phase 4 villains.

Edited by MurlocAggroB on Nov 22nd 2022 at 10:58:35 AM

slimcoder Carnage Rules
Carnage Rules
Nov 22nd 2022 at 8:59:36 PM

Oh my God I forgot to include Spider-Man [lol]

"You know my name. Now SCREAM it."
Bullman The 14th Doctor Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
The 14th Doctor
Nov 22nd 2022 at 9:06:18 PM

I liked Infinity Ultron, Green Goblin, and Agatha the best of the phase 4 villains.

Unrelated note, but I preferred the Sacred Timeline Version of Ultron to Infinity Ultron. The reason is honestly just a small difference. I prefer James Spader's voice to whoever did it in What if... (What is actors name I'm blanking hard) I know I am in the minority there, at least from what I have seen online. That said I did like the design of Infinity Ultron more.

Edited by Bullman on Nov 22nd 2022 at 11:07:06 AM

Fan-Preferred Couple Cleanup
uncertanSearcher THE big fat panda from Germany Relationship Status: -not set
THE big fat panda
Nov 22nd 2022 at 10:34:25 PM

Still havent seen everything of Phase four, but Green Goblin was deffinitly the best from the ones I saw. Wenwu and Agatha where also great but unfortunately didnt have the best conclusions and Wanda had a lot of messy writing involved.

Gorr was probably actually my favorite performance, but unfortunately didnt get to live up to his potential.

dmcreif from Novi Grad, Sokovia Relationship Status: Robosexual
Nov 23rd 2022 at 5:08:23 AM

Gorr was probably actually my favorite performance, but unfortunately didnt get to live up to his potential.

Honestly, there are lots of ideas in general in Love & Thunder that aren't all that bad, just not executed all that well.

Unrelated note, but I preferred the Sacred Timeline Version of Ultron to Infinity Ultron. The reason is honestly just a small difference. I prefer James Spader's voice to whoever did it in What if... (What is actors name I'm blanking hard) I know I am in the minority there, at least from what I have seen online. That said I did like the design of Infinity Ultron more.

Yeah, I too kinda prefer Spader to Ross Marquand (yeah, the guy who replaced Hugo Weaving as Red Skull for Infinity War, Endgame and the Captain Carter episode of What If...? is now voicing Ultron).

Edited by dmcreif on Nov 23rd 2022 at 8:10:18 AM

The cold never bothered me anyway
TobiasDrake Would you like to play a game? from Colorado, USA Relationship Status: She's holding a very large knife
Would you like to play a game?
Nov 23rd 2022 at 6:06:27 AM

Looking over that list of villains... Yeah, I'm gonna stick to my guns and still say Namor as best Phase 4 villain.

There are several characters such as Wenwu that I can say that I liked parts of their experience, but am lift with other issues that hamper the main experience. Some of these villains just outright sucked.

Namor's the only one on the list where I came away from the film going, "Yes, this was good. I have 0 notes. A+." He's kind of perfect? At least with regards to the role he's meant to fill, in a film where there only real criticism I can think of is that it has Letitia Wright in it. Wakanda Forever was old-school MCU GOOD, the way MCU movies were before Phase Four. And Namor fits right in and does his job excellently.

Edited by TobiasDrake on Nov 23rd 2022 at 6:08:43 AM

The Exposition Dragon, my Tumblr. Currently liveblogging blind playthrough of Danganronpa 3.
dcutter2 Relationship Status: not set
Nov 23rd 2022 at 6:19:08 AM

I'm finding Namor oddly unmemorable personally. The same for BP:WF as a whole. I don't have an criticisms but it's not sticking with me either.

That said I am wondering what Namor thought of the snap. "Hmmm, half my beloved people just vanished. Should I do something about that? Looking into it? Nah."

MatthewWayne The Man Outside Reality from TVA Headquarters Relationship Status: Not war
The Man Outside Reality
Nov 23rd 2022 at 6:51:02 AM

That's assuming that Namor himself wasn't snapped, and left Talokan without a leader for five years. Maybe that's why they caused an earthquake back in Endgame.

Also count me in on preferring Spader over Marquand. I loved the dude as Red Skull, but his Ultron voice was very non-threatening. I really have to wonder why Spader didn't come back. His voice for Ultron was glorious.

Where's your head at?
Ultimatum Disasturbator from Second Star to the left Relationship Status: Wishfully thinking
Disasturbator
Nov 23rd 2022 at 6:59:19 AM

> Maybe that's why they caused an earthquake back in Endgame.

That might have been a celestial actually.

Discord invite and..My art blog!
Bocaj Funny, but not helpful from Here Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny, but not helpful
Nov 23rd 2022 at 7:18:10 AM

I’ve been wondering about how the snap relates to Tlaloken too. Since it seems they actually have a decent information network, my guess is Namor investigated and found out the details that it was Thanos and that the Avengers killed him. Then Namor went home bittersweet that his people had been avenged but mad that he didn’t get to do it personally. He wouldn’t have heard about the time heist because the Avengers just sort of did that without much fanfare but hey his people are back now everything is good forevare people messing around in his oceans??

My original fictions and Essential Avengers liveblog
MurlocAggroB from the second-most ridiculous province of Canada
Nov 23rd 2022 at 7:24:13 AM

Is it confirmed that the earthquakes were actually something? I've always thought the point of that scene was Nat overreacting to everything, to the point where she wanted to deploy the Avengers over a natural event that didn't hurt anyone. It was showing how everyone adjusted to the Snap in their own different, unhealthy way.

Edited by MurlocAggroB on Nov 23rd 2022 at 9:24:52 AM

MatthewWayne The Man Outside Reality from TVA Headquarters Relationship Status: Not war
The Man Outside Reality
Nov 23rd 2022 at 7:29:20 AM

[up][up] Or, like I suggested earlier, he was amongst the Snap's casualties and so learned about everything that had happened after getting resurrected. By at which point he said "Eh, guess that shit happened", and picked up where he left off.

Where's your head at?
Hawkeye86 I'm the captain now. from Classified Location Relationship Status: You can be my wingman any time
I'm the captain now.
Nov 23rd 2022 at 7:33:44 AM

[up][up]That's always what I thought too.

You And I Remember Budapest Very Differently.
MurlocAggroB from the second-most ridiculous province of Canada
Nov 23rd 2022 at 7:34:50 AM

The Snap sort of exists in this liminal story space where it only happened insofar as it actually impacts the plot and/or characters. It's too much of a writing headache to have to weave it into every single narrative going forward, because realistically it would have an impact on every single person for pretty much as long as they're alive. Plus, it would get repetitive setting up everyone's altered family dynamics every single time.

That said, the COVID pandemic has shown me that people can get back to normal pretty quickly after a global shakeup. So, maybe it's not that unrealistic that it's not brought up that often.

Bocaj Funny, but not helpful from Here Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny, but not helpful
Nov 23rd 2022 at 7:36:18 AM

[up][up][up] Also entirely possible. Not hard to see how his people would be terrified to act against something that could just disappear their god to the corn field and so isolate harder during that time

Edited by Bocaj on Nov 23rd 2022 at 10:36:37 AM

My original fictions and Essential Avengers liveblog
TobiasDrake Would you like to play a game? from Colorado, USA Relationship Status: She's holding a very large knife
Would you like to play a game?
Nov 23rd 2022 at 7:43:27 AM

  • Nat: It's done?
  • Steve: I think so. I've given interviews to just about every major news network on the planet by this point. I believe the whole world knows what happened now. It won't be easy, having to move on with so many lost. But at least there won't be any misunderstandings.
  • Meanwhile, in Talokon
  • Namor: So it's decided. The four-gills are guilty of the greatest mass murder in Talokon history. They will all be executed. Your ruler has spoken.

Edited by TobiasDrake on Nov 23rd 2022 at 7:45:14 AM

The Exposition Dragon, my Tumblr. Currently liveblogging blind playthrough of Danganronpa 3.
Bocaj Funny, but not helpful from Here Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
dmcreif from Novi Grad, Sokovia Relationship Status: Robosexual
Nov 23rd 2022 at 2:19:26 PM

It's interesting that Namor's probably the only good villain of the phase 4 movies. I think of the following shortcomings of the other movie villains:

  • Black Widow: General Dreykov largely works due to the implications of his work. He suffers primarily from lack of screen time.
  • Shang-Chi and the Legend of the Ten Rings: Wenwu has some potentially good stuff, but, well, there's the finale. Where, as Screen Junkies put it best, "while an emotional, expertly-choreographed martial arts showdown between father and son is cool, isn't it way cooler when a bunch of weightless polygons smash into each other? No? Then why does it keep happening?!"
  • Eternals: Ikaris is kinda middle of the road and somewhat bland.
  • Spider-Man: No Way Home: The villains do work, but that is primarily due to the nostalgia factor behind the Sam Raimi and Marc Webb movies.
  • Doctor Strange in the Multiverse of Madness: Making Wanda the villain basically derailed her character growth for shock and spectacle, and rendered everything she went through in WandaVision as pointless.
  • Thor: Love and Thunder: Gorr the God Butcher only butchers one god in the entire film, and there's a lot of potentially good stuff about him that got left on the cutting room floor.

Edited by dmcreif on Nov 23rd 2022 at 5:20:28 AM

The cold never bothered me anyway
Weirdguy149 The Genetic Pokemon from Cerulean Cave Relationship Status: I'd jump in front of a train for ya!
The Genetic Pokemon
Nov 23rd 2022 at 2:26:00 PM

I feel like Phase 3 is the only one where the majority of the villains were really good.

Who am I and why am I here?
dcutter2 Relationship Status: not set
Nov 23rd 2022 at 2:34:28 PM

[up][up] Decent analysis I think.

In regards to Dreykov, it's interesting to me at least to think that he seems to be a subversion of Villains Act, Heroes React which is why he doesn't have much presence? He's not in the middle of enact a world changing evil plan. The real instigator of the plot is the Widow who stole the cure and then Yelena and Natasha.

Edited by dcutter2 on Nov 23rd 2022 at 10:34:38 AM

Nov 23rd 2022 at 3:22:26 PM

Imo NWH’s villains - and the middle of the plot in general - also suffered from having zero connection to the protags of the film. It wasn’t so bad with Ock since they basically cliff notes reiterated his sympathetic story in the film, nor Electro since they totally reconceived the character from the ground up to be have understandable motives in any universe.

But Goblin especially suffers from ultimately just being a guy who drops into Peter’s universe, spouts some rhetoric that means nothing to this Peter, then ruins his life without much context. What he does ends up more impactful than who he is, and the story imo suffers from the need to push him as big bad over the villains they were doing a better job bringing over.

Could be worse, though. He could be Lizard or Sandman.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Nov 23rd 2022 at 3:22:41 AM

"The difference between reality and fiction is that fiction has to make sense." - Tom Clancy, paraphrasing Mark Twain.
fasoman1996 Comfy pump from Argentina (A.K.A. Naziland) Relationship Status: Baby don't hurt me!
Comfy pump
Nov 23rd 2022 at 4:51:29 PM

I can safely say the worst villain is that dude in Eternals who got his head cut by Angelina Jolie. Most pointless villain i ever seen.

Now for the best? Tricky, recency bias makes me like Namor a lot but i will have to go with Gobby cause he really killed it.

Edited by fasoman1996 on Nov 23rd 2022 at 9:51:51 AM

Comfort season
Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
Nov 23rd 2022 at 5:02:13 PM

His purpose was to have a placeholder villain whose existence hides Ikaris being the twist villain.

Like the fake Mandarin, or Talos.

Unfortunately, post-twist you still gotta deal with Kro, so he just kinda party-crashes the final battle and gets turned into a jigsaw puzzle by Thena.

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
slimcoder Carnage Rules
Carnage Rules
Nov 23rd 2022 at 5:06:30 PM

It's rather sad cause Kro and the Deviants are fairly complex characters in the comics but the movie just turns them into one-note monsters

For instance he amusingly enough has a whole star-cross lovers thing with Thena

Edited by slimcoder on Nov 23rd 2022 at 5:07:07 AM

"You know my name. Now SCREAM it."
MatthewWayne The Man Outside Reality from TVA Headquarters Relationship Status: Not war
The Man Outside Reality
Nov 23rd 2022 at 5:20:44 PM

Yeah, Kro was such a waste of Bill Skarsgård's talents. I can only hope that he gets a second chance with a different role somewhere down the line.

Where's your head at?

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