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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
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If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

dcutter2 Since: Sep, 2013
#143001: Jun 12th 2022 at 9:32:45 AM

I don't know, making Rogue unafraid to drain people sort of takes away a large part of what the character is. The whole Blessed with Suck / Cursed with Awesome thing. Yeah she can get access to people's powers. She also gets their thoughts and memories and if she's draining bad people that's not good.

There's a reason draining people is a last resort.

Edited by dcutter2 on Jun 12th 2022 at 6:08:21 PM

Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#143002: Jun 12th 2022 at 10:03:50 AM

A Rogue who has no issue with using her draining powers would be straight up villainous,and she's not really that evil,she has a conscience

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#143003: Jun 12th 2022 at 10:42:02 AM

I agree that introducing Mystique as the main antagonist of The Marvels is a really good idea. She's a very different kind of villain than the Cree, Rogue and her interesting powerset make for a compelling physical confrontation, plus redeeming Rogue potentially would make for a good emotional conflict that meshes well with the arcs we got in the first movie, and would lastly make a good gateway for both of them to appear further into the MCU.

That said, my other number one hope for The Marvels' villain is MODOK.

RavenWilder Since: Apr, 2009
#143004: Jun 12th 2022 at 12:47:47 PM

Though, with the heroes all now having light/energy based powers, they might decide to throw the Living Laser into the mix.

Ayasugi Since: Oct, 2010
#143005: Jun 12th 2022 at 3:11:38 PM

A non-Flying Brick Rogue could take inspiration from X-Men: Evolution. They found ways for her to use her draining powers creatively but not in evil ways.

Cross (Don’t ask)
#143006: Jun 12th 2022 at 3:16:10 PM

Don’t know if it was a regular thing in the comics, but one of the cartoons had her use her draining ability to access someone’s memories.

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#143007: Jun 12th 2022 at 4:57:12 PM

One shouldn't forget that Rogue's power draining is actually incredibly dangerous for the person being drained. If the contact is longer than a few seconds there's a real chance the person can fall into a coma or even die. That's what happened to Carol Danvers in the comics and why Rogue had her Flying Brick powers for a long time.

Rogue doesn't just drain powers and memories from someone. She drains their everything.

And it was only until fairly recently in the comics that she was able to control it. For most of her comics history she drained anyone she touched whether she liked it or not.

Edited by M84 on Jun 12th 2022 at 7:59:52 PM

Disgusted, but not surprised
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#143008: Jun 12th 2022 at 6:21:02 PM

Here's a thought, Thor Ragnarok took place on Sakaar right?

Did we see any pink-skinned imperials or the grey-skinned shadow people?

Or did we see anymore bug people like Miek there?

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Guy01 Since: Mar, 2015
#143009: Jun 12th 2022 at 6:23:56 PM

A Rogue who has no issue with using her draining powers would be straight up villainous, and she's not really that evil, she has a conscience

It's been forever but didn't she more or less have control of it in Wolverine and The X-Men?

Ok, who let Light Yagami in here?
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#143010: Jun 12th 2022 at 7:27:59 PM

[up]No, she did not. There's a reason she wears gloves.

Disgusted, but not surprised
TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#143011: Jun 12th 2022 at 9:15:40 PM

The comics go back and forth with her a lot. Sometimes she can control it, sometimes she can't. I remember there was a period once where she could actually recall powersets, giving her permanent access to the abilities of every character she's ever drained - which, by that point, was practically anyone who is anyone in the X-Men franchise. Making her into more of a power mimic than her typical vampiric powerset.

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
fredhot16 Don't want to leave but cannot pretend from Baton Rogue, Louisiana. Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: Too sexy for my shirt
Don't want to leave but cannot pretend
#143012: Jun 12th 2022 at 9:25:09 PM

Isn't Rogue super beyond the whole "can't touch people" thing and it's just the multitude of animated series that keep bringing the character back to having that problem? And the movies, too, I guess?

Trans rights are human rights. TV Tropes is not a place for bigotry, cruelty, or dickishness, no matter who or their position.
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#143013: Jun 12th 2022 at 9:26:14 PM

Nope. It was only in the past few years in the comics that she gained control over it.

Disgusted, but not surprised
Kiobi20 Since: Sep, 2016
#143014: Jun 12th 2022 at 9:27:21 PM

[up][up] Just like spider-man adaptations keep putting him back in high school despite that he has been an adult for decades already in the comics who has even run his own company, it's hard to move away from something when people identify you with it so strongly, that's also most people will always know Dick Grayson more as robin than as Nightwing.

Edited by Kiobi20 on Jun 12th 2022 at 9:27:44 AM

Synchronicity (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#143015: Jun 12th 2022 at 9:55:32 PM

I think that's the benefit of a popular Legacy Character / otherwise younger character though; the status quo is forced to move to make room for them and eventually public perception should too. To use ^ as an example, the other Batboys have steadily grown in popularity since the 90s and regularly show up in adaptations now, so if Dick is present, he defaults to older Nightwing so one of the other boys can be Robin.

Give Miles enough clout and we'll see the end of the "Peter in high school" default, I think.

Edited by Synchronicity on Jun 12th 2022 at 11:56:45 AM

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#143016: Jun 12th 2022 at 10:00:14 PM

So what I'm hearing is, Marvel needs to introduce a new young mutant with uncontrollable powers that hurt people, who Rogue can then become a mentor to. And then the adaptations will eat it up.

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#143017: Jun 12th 2022 at 11:39:21 PM

Marvel's had a few of those already, and their powers are even worse than Rogue's. One of them for example has the "awesome" power of instantly breaking down organic matter with a touch.

Disgusted, but not surprised
MatthewWayne The Tapestry Weaver from Camp Echo One Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
The Tapestry Weaver
#143018: Jun 13th 2022 at 10:31:05 AM

So, I've got a thing that's on my mind that I wanted to ask you guys about.

As Phase 4 has been chugging along, I've noticed that Marvel seems more content to have its characters throw around the word "superhero" in-universe, even though they've never really done it before. While there are some moments where I think that's kinda neat (i.e: that Egyptian girl asking Layla if she's an Egyptian superhero in Moon Knight, and...well, basically everything regarding Kate Bishop and Kamala Khan), there are some people using it that kinda...irks me.

Like, is it me, or does it really feel unnatural to hear the likes of Doctor Strange, the Master of the Mystic Arts and Thor, the God of Thunder to explicitly refer to themselves as superheroes? It feels like it kinda cheapens their mystical or reverent titles just so they can lump themselves in with other characters. I get the public or more street-level characters referring them as such, but Strange and Thor calling themselves that...kinda rubs me the wrong way for some reason.

Anyone feel the same and/or differently?

"I'm Mr. Blue, woah-woah-ooh..."
dcutter2 Since: Sep, 2013
#143019: Jun 13th 2022 at 11:42:15 AM

Can't say I've noticed.

The first one to call themselves a superhero was Tony Stark in Iron Man. So it's not exactly new.

Have Strange or Thor even done so?

MatthewWayne The Tapestry Weaver from Camp Echo One Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
The Tapestry Weaver
#143020: Jun 13th 2022 at 12:52:04 PM

[up] Strange calls himself a superhero during Christine's wedding in Multiverse of Madness, and Thor states that his "super-heroing days are over" in the first teaser for Love and Thunder.

To me, Stark calling himself a superhero made sense, since he was mocking the idea of it, and also is that kind of casual person who would probably call himself and others superheroes in this setting.

I'm not sure if Thor has even heard the word "superhero" before, and given his status as a literal god, I feel like he'd find it quite demeaning.

"I'm Mr. Blue, woah-woah-ooh..."
Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#143021: Jun 13th 2022 at 1:04:35 PM

Thor ever since Ragnarok is the kind of chummy guy who would absolutely call himself a superhero. He even introduces himself as “basically I’m kind of a hero”.

MatthewWayne The Tapestry Weaver from Camp Echo One Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
The Tapestry Weaver
#143022: Jun 13th 2022 at 1:11:20 PM

Okay, fair enough, but Doctor Strange though? Does a master wizard consider himself a superhero?

It'd be like if everyone in Harry Potter is also classified a superhero since they happen to be able to use magic. Or the Jedi because they can make things move around and use laser swords. Maybe I'm overthinking things, but it feels like I'm opening up an umbrella, and seeing who fits the archetype and who doesn't. Though that's probably a whole other can of worms.

"I'm Mr. Blue, woah-woah-ooh..."
BOOXMOWO Since: Mar, 2013
#143023: Jun 13th 2022 at 1:16:42 PM

Oh yeah, Doctor Strange calling himself a superhero is a bit weird. He has a formal title/job description as a Master of the Mystic Arts, and you'd expect him to care about the distinction between that and simply "superhero" for the same reason he cares to call himself Doctor Strange.

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#143024: Jun 13th 2022 at 1:37:44 PM

The MCU's in the same boat as the comics at this point. It's been going on long enough that writers feel comfortable just having characters throw around the terms "superhero" and "supervillain" in-universe, despite the fact that these are ultimately extremely nebulous concepts that describe characters' roles within the fiction rather than real terminology with adequately defined meanings.

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Weirdguy149 Former King from Lumiose City Since: Jul, 2014 Relationship Status: I'd jump in front of a train for ya!
Former King
#143025: Jun 13th 2022 at 1:37:56 PM

Everyone probably calls him a superhero already so he is owning up to it, I reckon.

The legend has returned.

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