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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
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    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

DarthNoxIsCool Since: Jun, 2022
#142976: Jun 11th 2022 at 3:33:32 PM

And that's exactly why the nerf in adaptations is necessary, Carol or Thor don't need to go around destroying dimensional barriers every fight.

Edited by DarthNoxIsCool on Jun 11th 2022 at 3:33:56 AM

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#142977: Jun 11th 2022 at 5:49:28 PM

Speaking of crazy shit

Man if they brought in Jon Bernthal to play Cosmic Ghost Rider, that would be fucking epic. Thats some crazy what if shit.

Like this moment where he uses Penance to disintegrate Punisher Thanos.

Edited by slimcoder on Jun 11th 2022 at 5:49:55 AM

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#142978: Jun 11th 2022 at 7:46:32 PM

I wonder if The Marvels is going to de-power Carol Danvers.

While they'll never actually depower her permanently, I have been kicking around the theory that the movie will have a threat that takes Carol out or depowers her temporarily during the story, such that Monica and Kamala have to band together to help her so that she can come back as strong as ever in the climax of the films.

A la "holy crap, X bad guy injured Goku! Guess it's up to Vegeta / Piccolo / Gohan / whoever to fight the good fight until we get Goku back!" Or, on a more genre example, Superman having to fight Metallo or Parasite and needing his allies to fight the fight after staid villain exploits his weaknesses.

uncertanSearcher It's always Season of the Witch from Germany Since: Oct, 2017
It's always Season of the Witch
#142979: Jun 12th 2022 at 1:43:32 AM

I had the thought that the main villain of the Marvels could be Mystique, manipulating anti-villain Rogue into stealing Carols powers, leading to Monica and Kamala having to come to her aid. Mystique made her comic debut as a Ms. Marvel villain after all.

It would certenly be a way to start incorporating X-men characters into the mcu.

Edited by uncertanSearcher on Jun 12th 2022 at 5:35:57 PM

HasturHasturHastur from Wheah the fahkin baby wheel is, Jay Since: Nov, 2010
#142980: Jun 12th 2022 at 4:32:25 AM

[up]Nah, Deathbird. They share her as a rogues gallery member and Deathbird attempting a coup of the Shi'ar Empire would be an easy way to get Carol involved. You could give her an adaptational powerup to allow her to throw down with Carol too.

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#142981: Jun 12th 2022 at 4:37:41 AM

If we're talking Shi'ar then Gladiator warrants a mention as well since he's like the top war general/leader and he's a bit of a Superman expy so the dude is pretty powerful.

Edited by slimcoder on Jun 12th 2022 at 4:38:25 AM

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
uncertanSearcher It's always Season of the Witch from Germany Since: Oct, 2017
It's always Season of the Witch
#142982: Jun 12th 2022 at 5:15:43 AM

The Shi'ar are a wierd case were they are supposed to be comparible to the Kree and Skrulls but in praxis are usually complietly overshadowed by those two.

The X-men animated series and the first ultimate alliance game are so far the only non comic media were they appeared at all I think.

HasturHasturHastur from Wheah the fahkin baby wheel is, Jay Since: Nov, 2010
#142983: Jun 12th 2022 at 5:18:57 AM

[up][up]Gladiator would have to be a secondary antagonist due to his position - D'Ken and Deathbird are the ones who would make him a threat. Vulcan, if he's present, would be more of a background threat, or maybe a stinger reveal character. He's way too big a threat to make secondary in the same movie.

Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#142984: Jun 12th 2022 at 5:21:07 AM

> Mystique made her comic debut as a Ms. Marvel villain after all.

And yet she's nearly always been an Xmen villain, usually working with Magneto

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uncertanSearcher It's always Season of the Witch from Germany Since: Oct, 2017
It's always Season of the Witch
#142985: Jun 12th 2022 at 5:25:39 AM

[up][up]Then why not just make him the main threat?

HasturHasturHastur from Wheah the fahkin baby wheel is, Jay Since: Nov, 2010
#142986: Jun 12th 2022 at 5:46:48 AM

[up]Because Gladiator is the head of the Imperial Guard, ergo he serves whoever is in power. Depose D'Ken, and he's no longer Gladiator's master.

As for Vulcan, he's honestly a crossover-level villain. Easily one of the most stupidly overpowered Marvel villains, held back only by his insanity and utter lack of fighting ability (because he never has to fight because almost anyone who goes up against him gets turned into ash in one shot).

uncertanSearcher It's always Season of the Witch from Germany Since: Oct, 2017
It's always Season of the Witch
#142987: Jun 12th 2022 at 6:12:43 AM

I could still see Gladiator being the main threat of the movie, just that the goal of our heroes is to find a way to change who his superior is rather then beating him directly.

Mizerous Pet Owner from Hell Since: Oct, 2013 Relationship Status: Brewing the love potion
Pet Owner
#142988: Jun 12th 2022 at 6:38:48 AM

I think Mystique suffered from being uses too much as a henchmen rather than a cunning manipulator like in the comics. Plus when her younger actor played the hero in Hunger Games they wanted that for her character rather than the more backstabbing Mystique.

Just Makima.
windleopard from Nigeria Since: Nov, 2014 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
#142989: Jun 12th 2022 at 6:42:10 AM

First Class came out before Hunger Games and already gave Mystique the Adaptational Heroism treatment. It was clearly their plan from the beginning and had nothing to do with the Hunger Games.

RedHunter543 Crimson Paladin Since: Jul, 2016 Relationship Status: Barbecuing
Crimson Paladin
#142990: Jun 12th 2022 at 6:49:18 AM

Yeah but then they made Mystique into the leader of the X-Men team.

That's pretty much the Jennifer Lawrence hype machine influencing Fox executives.

Like there's a difference between fleshing out a villain, and then redeeming them because their actor is hot in the general public. X-Men apocalypse was when the hype for Hunger Games was at an all time high.

Edited by RedHunter543 on Jun 12th 2022 at 9:50:28 AM

"The Black Rage makes us strong, because we must resist its temptations every day of our lives or be forever damned!"
HasturHasturHastur from Wheah the fahkin baby wheel is, Jay Since: Nov, 2010
#142991: Jun 12th 2022 at 7:05:55 AM

Mystique's most villainous traits were always greatly downplayed even before Jennifer Lawrence took over. She wasn't even an eighth as cruel, petty, and vindictive as she is in the comics and was vastly more sympathetic as a whole. Mystique becoming heroic was hardly out of character here.

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#142992: Jun 12th 2022 at 7:44:48 AM

Gladiator would be an interesting beefy boy threat because his power level is tied into how confident he is in what he’s doing

Shake his resolve and he might go down like a chump

Letting him be an unstoppable wall of muscle early on but weakened enough to beat by Plot developments

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
Forenperser Foreign Troper from Germany Since: Mar, 2012
Foreign Troper
#142993: Jun 12th 2022 at 7:52:30 AM

Yeah, Gladiator is one of the few characters who has an actual in-universe reason for why his level of strength wildly varies.

Certified: 48.0% West Asian, 6.5% South Asian, 15.8% North/West European, 15.7% English, 7.4% Balkan, 6.6% Scandinavian
RedHunter543 Crimson Paladin Since: Jul, 2016 Relationship Status: Barbecuing
Crimson Paladin
#142994: Jun 12th 2022 at 8:10:05 AM

[up][up][up] It's not about giving Mystique more heroic and sympathetic traits, it was the fact that they made Mystique of all people into an actual hero beloved by the Mutant community, someone who helped soften Mutant-Human relations, AND the leader of the X-Men.

"The Black Rage makes us strong, because we must resist its temptations every day of our lives or be forever damned!"
HasturHasturHastur from Wheah the fahkin baby wheel is, Jay Since: Nov, 2010
#142995: Jun 12th 2022 at 8:17:19 AM

[up]What I'm saying is that it was given sufficient groundwork and didn't feel like an ass pull, and she was an anti-villain at her absolute worst to begin with. It's well-established here that she's a good person at heart who sometimes makes really bad choices.

dcutter2 Since: Sep, 2013
#142996: Jun 12th 2022 at 8:22:12 AM

While I'd love to see a live action Rogue with flying brick powers and the 90s cartoon personality. I really doubt they are going to include her and Mystique as the very first mutants we see in the main timeline.

Watchtower Since: Jul, 2010
#142997: Jun 12th 2022 at 8:26:16 AM

I have thought about the idea of Mystique and Rogue being the villains of The Marvels and there's something kinda funny about Mystique engineering this plot to have Rogue steal Carol's powers just so they can, like, rob banks better or some shit. Like a cosmic sci-fi Die Hard.

That'd certainly be one way to throw in some surprisingly lower stakes even for a movie with three main heroes as powerful as they are. [lol]

MatthewWayne The Tapestry Weaver from Camp Echo One Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
The Tapestry Weaver
#142998: Jun 12th 2022 at 8:50:17 AM

I loved Mystique in the first few X-Men movies, and I really want Rogue to be redeemed after Anna Paquin got sidelined over time. So them showing up in the future would be definitely something neat in my book.

I also think it would be funny/cool to see the Skrulls encounter Mystique and lampshade how frustrating it is to be on the opposite end of fighting a shapeshifter.

"I'm Mr. Blue, woah-woah-ooh..."
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#142999: Jun 12th 2022 at 8:59:39 AM

I personally prefer Rogue as not a flying brick, to put more emphasis on the power draining.

A lot of comics had her lean more on being super tough and flying and only resort to the power draining as a last resort.

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
MatthewWayne The Tapestry Weaver from Camp Echo One Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
The Tapestry Weaver
#143000: Jun 12th 2022 at 9:08:25 AM

[up] The Fox-Men movies actually did focus more on the power draining than the Flying Brick stuff, which I thought was really cool and interesting. It's just that they made her super mousey and afraid to use those powers, which kinda hinders her as a character, and they ultimately had her give them up in The Last Stand because they didn't really know what to do with Rogue after Bobby got together with Kitty.

I hope the MCU goes the same route, but with making Rogue unafraid to drain people.

"I'm Mr. Blue, woah-woah-ooh..."

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