TVTropes Now available in the app store!
Open

Follow TV Tropes

Following

Marvel Cinematic Universe

Go To

Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
  • Spoilers for new releases should not be discussed without spoiler tagging for at least two weeks. Rather, each title should have a dedicated thread where that sort of conversation is held. We can mention new releases in a general sense, but please be courteous to people who don't want to be spoiled.

If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#141801: Apr 30th 2022 at 2:24:16 AM

In her first solo she time traveled, and changed the past by capturing a villain she had previously punched away. The effects on the present were… unclear. The changes didn’t appear to affect anyone’s memories or decisions over the following days. Such was her solo. tongue But I guess that means she can get away with some time changes without poofing out of existence.

dmcreif Vault Dweller from Vault 33 (Troper Knight) Relationship Status: Robosexual
Vault Dweller
#141802: Apr 30th 2022 at 4:09:34 AM

The Marvels and Ant-Man and the Wasp: Quantumania have had their release dates switched.

Okey Dokey!
TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#141803: Apr 30th 2022 at 5:46:38 AM

Due to the decades-long many-writers zero-direction nature of the Marvel Universe, continuity is pretty fluid. Pretty much any blanket statement that can be made will have some examples crop up that disprove it. Marvel continuity runs on a shrugging "This is what's canon now, just go with it," philosophy.

This comes up a lot with "power levels". Thor is always holding back, even those times when he's pushed to his limit and isn't powerful enough to push through. Spider-Man has never been physically challenged by the Kingpin except for all of those times he was physically challenged by the Kingpin. Wolverine can regenerate from anything except when he can't, and there are a few guaranteed 100% methods to kill him that sometimes fail.

But it comes up with other stuff too. Like how Avengers don't kill people, not ever, except when Avengers totally kill people without hesitation or remorse. America Chavez's uniqueness is that. There are no variants of America Chavez, except for when there's sometimes variants of America Chavez.

Because no matter how many blanket statements you write, at the end of the day, you're just some writer. And the dozens of other writers playing in this sandbox might have different opinions than you do.

Edited by TobiasDrake on Apr 30th 2022 at 5:48:11 AM

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
Forenperser Foreign Troper from Germany Since: Mar, 2012
Foreign Troper
#141804: Apr 30th 2022 at 5:51:56 AM

I still think "America" as a literal first name for a Captain America is so on the nose it hurts.

Certified: 48.0% West Asian, 6.5% South Asian, 15.8% North/West European, 15.7% English, 7.4% Balkan, 6.6% Scandinavian
Weirdguy149 Former King from Lumiose City Since: Jul, 2014 Relationship Status: I'd jump in front of a train for ya!
Former King
#141805: Apr 30th 2022 at 6:05:53 AM

Why is her name America anyway?

The legend has returned.
Nightwire Since: Feb, 2010
#141806: Apr 30th 2022 at 6:34:09 AM

That's why I never like it whenever writers decide to make up and retcon a character to be a "Multiversal Constant". Especially when you write for a multimedia company. Because adaptations will evitably fuck all that up.

There is only one Darkseid in the entire multiverse. There is only one Unicron in the entire multiverse. There is only one Shuma-Gorath in the entire multiverse. Except for all the time when it's not the case.

It just never makes any sense and always overcomplicates things to an absurd degree.

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#141807: Apr 30th 2022 at 6:42:20 AM

It makes a character sound important until you have to try to keep it up, then people point and laugh

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
HasturHasturHastur from Wheah the fahkin baby wheel is, Jay Since: Nov, 2010
#141808: Apr 30th 2022 at 6:53:56 AM

Realistically speaking, why couldn't this just be the same America from the comics, and have Shuma be the same Shuma from the comics? If it truly is a multiverse and some characters are pan-universal and exist independent of any universe, then it stands to reason that at least some of them have visited Earth-616 or originated from there.

Nightwire Since: Feb, 2010
#141809: Apr 30th 2022 at 6:57:47 AM

[up][up]I also find it supremely arrogant on the writer's side.

"Hey, just so you know, there's only one legit take on Guy, and it's my take. All of the Guys who come after are just facets of my Guy, because my Guy is the best Guy and the coolest Guy. You think you can beat Guy. Fools. Guy can never be defeated because Guy is multiverse. You just beat up a Guy-avatar."

Edited by Nightwire on Apr 30th 2022 at 6:58:26 AM

HasturHasturHastur from Wheah the fahkin baby wheel is, Jay Since: Nov, 2010
#141810: Apr 30th 2022 at 6:59:32 AM

It makes sense for some characters, like the Many-Angled Ones and the Living Tribunal. Being a multiversal conqueror or judge makes less sense when there are multiples of you running around.

Edited by HasturHasturHastur on Apr 30th 2022 at 7:00:00 AM

chasemaddigan I'm Sad Frogerson. Since: Oct, 2011
I'm Sad Frogerson.
#141811: Apr 30th 2022 at 8:08:33 AM

Why is her name America anyway?

There are people who are named America in the real world. I don't think it's a common name, but it's not unheard of.

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#141812: Apr 30th 2022 at 8:10:42 AM

Hell, the continents North America and South America were actually named after a guy called Amerigo Vespucci.

Edited by PushoverMediaCritic on Apr 30th 2022 at 8:10:57 AM

MatthewWayne The Tapestry Weaver from Camp Echo One Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
The Tapestry Weaver
#141813: Apr 30th 2022 at 8:32:05 AM

[up] Fun fact: Amerigo Vespucci was born on March 9th, the same day as Oscar Isaac. I only found this out after finding out I also shared my birthday with them.

"I'm Mr. Blue, woah-woah-ooh..."
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#141814: Apr 30th 2022 at 8:39:37 AM

We couldn’t possibly rename the continents after Oscar Isaac

Or could we

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
TargetmasterJoe from Velocitron Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: I like big bots and I can not lie
#141815: Apr 30th 2022 at 8:59:48 AM

RE: Jon Watts leaving the MCU Fantastic Four movie:

Not gonna lie, I felt my heart drop after reading the headlines. But then, we're talking about a guy who directed three Spider-Man movies in a row and the last one had to deal with pandemic-related circumstances and being a three-hour-long multiversal-ripping romp on top of that. So I guess Watts more than deserves a chance to just breathe.

I still wonder if we'll see Spider-Man make a plus-sized cameo (like how we saw Falcon in Ant-Man 1 or Doctor Strange in Thor: Ragnarok or the GOTG in Love and Thunder, is there a better term than just "cameo"?) in the F4 movie as an homage to Amazing Spider-Man #1 from 1963. (Probably not, but it's still fun to think about. Plus it'd give us a chance to see that final suit from NWH in some more action.)

Synchronicity (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#141816: Apr 30th 2022 at 9:12:33 AM

Why is her name America anyway?

America Ferrera for Guardian

The name America has definitely grown on me. I wish there was a big patriotic story behind it, but the truth is that my grandfather was a librarian who knew all sorts of random facts. When my mother was born on 14 April, he named her after a Latin American holiday, the Day of Americas, that nobody knew about. My due date also happened to be 14 April.

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#141817: Apr 30th 2022 at 11:37:54 AM

Huh, this was a pretty disappointing fight.

Huh yeah they should have emphasized that Tasky was fighting exactly like Captain America, could have given Guardian the opportunity to prove himself by having the chance to fight the closest instance he can to his fabled rival.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Gaon Smoking Snake from Grim Up North Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#141818: Apr 30th 2022 at 11:46:55 AM

Red Guardian is my favorite character of the film but the film misses a real step with him in the third act. His shtick is that he's formidable but also comically bumbling, and that comedy is lined with some tragedy (we get a glimpse of this with the brief scene in the prison he looks at a doll of his likeness and is genuinely sad at how forgotten he is), but he lacks a both a genuine Let's Get Dangerous! moment and a moment of genuine pathos in the third act (he tries with a speech to his daughters only to be undercut with the "you're not wearing a communicator" punchline, and then tries again with a It Has Been an Honor with his wife but she leaves him hanging mid-speech). His role is largely to just be a punching bag for Taskmaster.

"All you Fascists bound to lose."
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#141819: Apr 30th 2022 at 11:54:47 AM

I think maybe the creative team were worried about sympathizing with him too much given what he’s complicit in and the less than ideal compromise they found was to use him for jokes throughout so the audience doesn’t have to seriously grapple with him as a flawed man who gave his surrogate/state assigned daughters over for what was essentially abuse and torture

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
Gaon Smoking Snake from Grim Up North Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#141820: Apr 30th 2022 at 12:16:35 PM

There's a general underlying problem that the film gives very little information about the Red Guardian. The fact the Soviet Union successfully recreated the super-soldier serum is In-Universe a gigantic revelation after the MCU hammered on so much how hard it is to do so, so the circumstances of his origin (and why the Hell he's the only one) are a giant cypher. Even his age is a mystery, as the fact he comments already meeting Captain in the 1980's as a full-fledged super-soldier would make him several decades older than his performer (Harbour was born in 1975), so how old is he? How complicit he is with Red Room is also left deliberately foggy, as he clearly knows the Red Room trains killers but he expresses some genuine surprise at how traumatized Natasha and Yelena were by it. Is he just that stupid or does it not register to him because he was himself the product of a similar system? The movie gives a moral basis of that sort of Melina (his wife), who states she herself was a product of the Red Room and thus doesn't quite work out the trauma of her daughters until they push her into confronting it.

It's a great character pitch and performance but a lot of him feels underexplored.

"All you Fascists bound to lose."
Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#141821: Apr 30th 2022 at 12:57:22 PM

Why is her name America anyway?

In-universe, it’s because her parents named her after where the Demiurge (AKA Billy Kaplan) who created the Utopian Plane was born.

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#141822: Apr 30th 2022 at 12:59:52 PM

Has there been a post retcon explanation?

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#141823: Apr 30th 2022 at 1:10:21 PM

To my knowledge, nope.

Maybe in that version her parents loved Real Women Have Curves? tongue

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#141824: Apr 30th 2022 at 1:11:29 PM

Well… it apparently was a real crowd pleaser

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
HasturHasturHastur from Wheah the fahkin baby wheel is, Jay Since: Nov, 2010
#141825: Apr 30th 2022 at 1:13:39 PM

[up]x5 My guess is he met A Captain America - wouldn't be surprised if William Burnside had held the mantle during the Cold War and had tangled with him. He's old and the formula probably slowed his aging, but I don't think he's old enough to have originated in WWII. I'm guessing we'll see more about the Soviet supersoldier program and other clandestine Cold War weapons and tech efforts in future works, with Omega Red very likely being one of their old experiments that didn't go quite as well.

Edited by HasturHasturHastur on Apr 30th 2022 at 1:14:13 AM


Total posts: 186,763
Top