Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! I'm editing this OP and pinning it to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules
still apply.
- This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
- While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
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[Edited by Fighteer]
Edited by Fighteer on Dec 15th 2022 at 9:55:58 AM
I really miss the days when I didn't know this about Jackie Chan.
Anyway, what's Simu Liu been in prior to this? He isn't an actor I'm familiar with.
Edited by windleopard on Jun 22nd 2021 at 7:45:06 AM
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
Don’t Chinese audiences actually like what they see of The Mandarin thus far? I was under the impression that it was primarily Shang Chinese audiences were not positive towards.
Edited by KnownUnknown on Jun 22nd 2021 at 7:50:24 AM
"The difference between reality and fiction is that fiction has to make sense." - Tom Clancy, paraphrasing Mark Twain.
Goku Black
Yeah because of the whole slanted eyes thing.
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Queen of Good Things, Honest
Slanted eyes thing?
My Tumblr. Currently liveblogging Haruhi Suzumiya and revisiting Danganronpa V3.
Probably just referring to the whole "doesn't fit Chinese beauty standards" thing in general; the monolid is one of them.
Foreign Troper
Did you know it's been exactly 3 years since Luke Cage Season 2?
Certified: 48.0% West Asian, 6.5% South Asian, 15.8% North/West European, 15.7% English, 7.4% Balkan, 6.6% Scandinavian
@Known Unknown: From what I’ve seen and heard a lot Chinese think that the Mandarin isn’t much better than Fu Manchu. The Mandarin also began as Yellow Peril villain and that’s a stigma hard to get rid of. So, a common complain is that they replaced one stereotype (Fu Manchu) with another one (Mandarin).
Of course, modern Mandarin is no longer a stereotype, but I can understand people coming to that conclusion.
The sleepiest good boi
Unless you're Shane Black, who from comments he's made in interviews appears to think the Mandarin is still the exact same stereotypical character he was in the Silver Age, thus his reasoning to justify trying to pass off a popular villain as not existing despite being something fans had been waiting to see since he was alluded to in the first movie.
Edited by lbssb on Jun 22nd 2021 at 11:58:14 AM
Disney100 Marathon | DreamWorks Marathon
Having grown up with Chinese parents, I can safely say that the grievances of how China was treated by the Western world since the Opium War runs deep and it’s not something you can pin it all on the CCP.
I had many arguments with my dad about these issues and it’s quite evident that the resentment is too stubborn to be changed. This is something that Western entertainment fail to realize. Surface progression will not work in the long run, especially when the bigger narrative is whether China is a threat to democracy/world, which is something the Chinese people do hear on social media.
Honestly, I dread being asked of my stances on China and Hong Kong because any answer I choose will have be torn to shreds. And considering what I heard about certain interviewers asking loaded questions to people of color about the LGBT interpretations of the characters they played, I am wary about the political atmosphere regarding Shang Chi.
Don't want to leave but cannot pretend
How was the Mandarin alluded to from the first movie? Because the terrorist group in Afghanistan was called "The Ten Rings"?
The Head of the Hydra
His superpowers are literally 10 rings yes.
"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
The sleepiest good boi
Jon Favreau even outright states in the commentary that the Ten Rings was supposed to lead to a showdown with the Mandarin.
Edited by lbssb on Jun 22nd 2021 at 12:35:45 PM
Disney100 Marathon | DreamWorks Marathon
Don't want to leave but cannot pretend
Meh.
The group is called The Ten Rings and Raza has a very noticeable single ring (which he rubs in a quasi-religious manner a couple of times). The visual implication is that there were 9 other lieutenants with rings, presumably working for The Mandarin (who would thus have "The Ten Rings").
"All you Fascists bound to lose."
The Head of the Hydra
Man Hell of a build-up…….. that was completely wasted on the noxious shit-stain that is Aldrich Killian.
"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Goku Black
Shane black is also the guy who made a film where autism is the natural evolution of humanity and had 3 have a subplot where wounded Iraq soldiers were all psychos He's not a good man to trust with his opinions.
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."He also wanted Killian to rape Pepper on live-tv to wound Tony and have that played off as a gag.
Man really didn't belong anywhere near this franchise.
"All you Fascists bound to lose."
The Head of the Hydra
Well fuck him then. ![[tdown]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_down_emoticon_3571.png "[thumb down]"){kind=small}
God IM 3 really was a complete shit show.
Edited by slimcoder on Jun 22nd 2021 at 1:00:03 AM
"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
@lbssb: As I said, at least some Chinese people don’t like the idea of the Mandarin because they are worried he’ll be a stereotypical Chinese bad guy. They basically replaced Fu Manchu – a really bad stereotype – with another character that initially had very strong parallels to Fu Manchu. So for some people it feels like they just replaced the name.
Personally, I think making the Mandarin his father wasn’t a good choice. Afterall there’s a reason why M’Baku was never called Man-Ape and turned into a more heroic character.
Yes, but there is admittedly a difference between “some Chinese voices have voiced dissatisfaction for the character” and “the Chinese audience as a whole reacted negatively to the Mandarin, and that’s why the movie isn’t polling well there,” especially since we also have news confirming that the Chinese audience in general has actually reacted rather positively to the Mandarin (or, at least, to Tony Leung) and that most of the negative reaction has been directed at Limu’s Shang Chi instead.
Edited by KnownUnknown on Jun 22nd 2021 at 1:25:19 AM
"The difference between reality and fiction is that fiction has to make sense." - Tom Clancy, paraphrasing Mark Twain.
Disasturbator
God I miss those shows. I've actually been slowly rewatching them all, in chronological order. Currently in Iron Fist season 1. I'm having fun but knowing they all eventually cut off with little closure stings.
I'd write up a retrospective on them all, but I'm pretty sure there's no longer any interest in any of them.
You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
I rewatched most of Luke Cage a little while ago, and the disappointment that it's entirely in the past is absolutely real.
"The difference between reality and fiction is that fiction has to make sense." - Tom Clancy, paraphrasing Mark Twain.
Politics aside, I understand why a lot of Chinese moviegoers aren’t that thrilled about Shang-Chi.
First Marvel movie with an Asian superhero as lead and what’s his super power? Kung-Fu. Then there’s his name which isn’t even a real name. And finally, there’s the villain who is clearly based on a Yellow Peril stereotype.
If they had made a Black Panther movie with a half-white T’Challa who was really good at throwing spears and was fighting against his evil Scary Black Man father it probably wouldn’t have been popular in many Africa countries, too.