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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
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If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

fredhot16 Don't want to leave but cannot pretend from Baton Rogue, Louisiana. Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: Too sexy for my shirt
Don't want to leave but cannot pretend
#127227: Apr 25th 2021 at 12:07:45 AM

AND THEN HE WAS JOHN CENA!

Trans rights are human rights. TV Tropes is not a place for bigotry, cruelty, or dickishness, no matter who or their position.
EmeraldEmperor Lies and Violence! Since: Oct, 2020
Lies and Violence!
#127228: Apr 25th 2021 at 6:23:35 AM

Couldn't you do both a Thunderbolts/Masters of Evil and a Secret Wars storyline as a two-parter, like Infinity War and Endgame?

The basis of the latter is the Beyonder making a bunch of heroes and villains fight each other, you could have the villain team be the Masters/Thunderbolts (either pure coincidence that he picks a recently-formed villain team, the Beyonder is specifically making said recently-formed team fight the Avengers instead of the more broad heroes vs. villains, or the gathered villains are formed into the Thunderbolts after being captured/helping stop the Beyonder in the second part).

Edited by EmeraldEmperor on Apr 25th 2021 at 6:23:48 AM

Whowho Since: May, 2012
#127229: Apr 25th 2021 at 9:06:03 AM

I would love to see more recurring of villains in the MCU. Makes me laugh that Batroc reappeared in Falcon and the Winter Soldier, but there's no reason for any of the characters in it to recognise him.

I wish more previous villains reappared in Avengers focused films as henchmen to allow villains to feel more traveled. Crossbones worked really well in that role for Civil War

Abomination would have been an easy addition to Avengers Assemble, given that Loki infiltrated Shield and he was in Shield custody. (Heck if Whiplash hadn't been killed he'd also fit in well in that role)

Zola (with his robot body) could have been in the hyrda base at the start of Age of Ultron.

The Obsidian Order could have been partially populated by previous cosmic villains if all of them weren't dead. Though I'd struggle to think who would empathise with Thanos' creed. Maybe Maleketh if he was the last of his kind.

Though there are a lot of wishes I have about Maleketh.

But yeah, if we're doing Thunderbolts/Masters of evil, I'd love for them to be the adversy for Avengers 5/New Avengers. "The Avengers have been defunt since Tony and Steve apparently died, so we're going to be the super team! (Ha ha were supervillains trying to control the super hero community). Plus if the New Avengers is mostly a legacy team it would be a good challenge for the new Avengers to defeat adversaries of their predecessors.

Zemo, Abomination, Justin Hammer (assuming he gets a super suit in Armour Wars, he could make a fine MARCH-1) and Ghost would be obvious inclusions. It would feel weird to have the team without Moonstone, so I'm really hoping she's in Captain Marvel 2.

If I would populate a New Avengers Team I'd have Sam Wilson, War Machine, Captain Marvel, Spider-Man and Scott Lang. I'd like Valkyrie and She-Hulk on the team as well, but it would probably vastly over populate the film.

Watchtower Since: Jul, 2010
#127230: Apr 25th 2021 at 9:07:01 AM

I just don't like it as an angel for the character. I get it, and I think it worked well enough for Civil War-Endgame, but hopefully they drop it for No Way Home.

I'll say this as someone that's been overall fine with the Tony/Peter relationship: if they somehow finagle it into No Way Home I'll call BS on it myself. It made sense in Homecoming as Peter was trying to live up to a living man's reputation and it made sense in Far From Home as he felt pressured by a dead man's legacy. At this point I don't see how you push that relationship any further short of bringing Tony back from the dead, so Peter should really truly be a solo act at this point.

I'll also call BS if they try to force Strange to be that replacement figure, as they clearly don't have anywhere close to a history or relationship.

At the end of the day it is supposed to be a Spider-Man movie.

Its like I don't know Green Lantern getting another movie but it has Kyle Raynor constantly answering to Batman.

I definitely get why people are looking for a pure 100% Spidey-only affair. That corner's always been strong enough to handle it's own thing. I personally think having it interconnected has been fine enough (Spider-Man definitely works better in that department than Batman does) and think said connectedness has been overblown (let's be real, if Vulture and Mysterio are Iron Man villains in spite of everything then so is Wenwu), but I get it.

Also while it winds up underdeveloped I did always take Injustice 2 as trying to give Blue Beetle and Firestorm the same sort of "aspiring protege" role to Batman, especially in the light of Robin's betrayal. It all depends on how the stories and characters are written, y'know?

Beatman1 Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: Gone fishin'
#127231: Apr 25th 2021 at 9:09:24 AM

Considering Zemo's motivations in Falcon and Winter Soldier (that he didn't want super soldiers running around) the idea of him making the Thunderbolts as a way to ensure he's controlling the population of colorfully costumed crusaders and to ensure no one else with powers takes up the public eye or mantle works...surprisingly well.

Aleistar Since: Feb, 2018 Relationship Status: Hugging my pillow
#127232: Apr 25th 2021 at 9:14:50 AM

[up]x2 I mean, in fairness to Wenwu, we haven't seen the movie yet. It could be that he has a grudge against Tony for whatever reason, but I doubt it.

Speaking of Mysterio and Thunderbolts, IMO the former has shades of that original Busiek/Bagley team, where both are supervillains positioning themselves as the successors to the Avengers when they've been disbanded after a major event to get access to their tech.

[nja]'d

Edited by Aleistar on Apr 25th 2021 at 12:15:17 PM

Whowho Since: May, 2012
#127233: Apr 25th 2021 at 9:21:03 AM

I could see Zemo positioning himself as a fake super hero intelligence source, and purposefully sending superheroes on missions with his loyal minions where the real super heroes will end up having tragic accidents.

Heck have his operatives pose as both their fake superheroe personas and also their true identities to create traps for real heroes.

lbssb The sleepiest good boi Since: Jun, 2020 Relationship Status: is commanded to— WANK!
The sleepiest good boi
#127234: Apr 25th 2021 at 9:22:44 AM

[up][up]I do hope the Mandarin does have some grudge or other connection to Tony, perhaps even having fought him offscreen once. It just feels right, since at the end of the day he is supposed to be Tony's villain. It would be like having the Joker in a movie and never giving him any connection to Batman.

Edited by lbssb on Apr 25th 2021 at 9:22:52 AM

Disney100 Marathon | DreamWorks Marathon
Weirdguy149 Former King from Lumiose City Since: Jul, 2014 Relationship Status: I'd jump in front of a train for ya!
Former King
#127235: Apr 25th 2021 at 9:29:24 AM

Or having the Kingpin as a Spider-Man villain-oh wait.

The legend has returned.
Whowho Since: May, 2012
#127236: Apr 25th 2021 at 9:29:30 AM

I feel like the Mandarin is too big a scope villain to care about Tony.

But a previous confrontation told in a flash back would be nice. Set it during the five year time skip, would work easy enough. Tony finds a lead and tried to go for the guy he inadvertently funded prior to breaking good, and the Mandarin swats him like a fly.

miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#127237: Apr 25th 2021 at 9:32:17 AM

[up][up]Kingpin is a spiderman villain. Him and daredevil share him.

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
lbssb The sleepiest good boi Since: Jun, 2020 Relationship Status: is commanded to— WANK!
The sleepiest good boi
#127238: Apr 25th 2021 at 9:32:34 AM

Eh, Fisk is pretty equally a villain for both Spidey and Daredevil.

Edit: [nja]'d

[up][up]They could do a flashback like that even without RDJ, just keep him in the suit and don't have him say anything.

Edited by lbssb on Apr 25th 2021 at 9:34:29 AM

Disney100 Marathon | DreamWorks Marathon
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#127239: Apr 25th 2021 at 9:33:20 AM

In fact kingpin debuted in spiderman.

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Whowho Since: May, 2012
#127240: Apr 25th 2021 at 12:22:19 PM

I'm contemplating which dead villains I'm annoyed got killed.

Or at least got killed in unambiguous ways. Ultron and Darren Cross died in such fantastical ways I wouldn't be surprised if they turned up again in much the same way Red Skull did.

I know Whiplash was an underserved character, but his design was original and I would be really interested to see what him fighting different avengers would look like. Also his death kind of reflects poorly on may change Tony had to improve on his father's legacy.

Ronan the Accuser might be a bit of a flat character, but he's such a big character in the comics. He is the poster child of the Kree Empire and I want to see him go toe to toe with Carol Danvers. I was kind of hoping Thanos' would use a stone to resurrect him in Infinity War.

Crossbones, I kind of just love how much he hates the Avengers. I kind of wish he was in Struckers base in Age of Ultron just for more content from him.

Killmonger is amazing, but he's in a series with a promenant afterlife aspect, so I expect we'll see him again regardless of how definative his death was.

Weirdguy149 Former King from Lumiose City Since: Jul, 2014 Relationship Status: I'd jump in front of a train for ya!
Former King
#127241: Apr 25th 2021 at 1:16:16 PM

Killmonger and Ultron are the only two villains that were killed off that I want to see come back in some way. Everyone else either died satisfactorily or are alive.

The legend has returned.
C105 Too old for this from France Since: Jan, 2012 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Too old for this
#127242: Apr 25th 2021 at 1:32:48 PM

Well, Ultron definitely died offscreen, so he's probably the easiest to bring back.

Whatever your favourite work is, there is a Vocal Minority that considers it the Worst. Whatever. Ever!.
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#127243: Apr 25th 2021 at 1:35:52 PM

Uh I like Killmonger's death. Oddly poetic and sad.

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
chasemaddigan I'm Sad Frogerson. Since: Oct, 2011
I'm Sad Frogerson.
#127244: Apr 25th 2021 at 1:36:11 PM

The Wikipedia summaries for Age of Ultron and Ant-Man claim that Ultron and Cross where "seemingly destroy[ed]" and "presumably kill[ed]" respectively, so there's wiggle-room to bring those two back.

And while it seems everyone's upset that Killmonger's dead, I'm more upset that they killed off Klaue. I wanted see Andy Serkis go all "being made of living sound" in the sequel.

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#127245: Apr 25th 2021 at 1:36:48 PM

Plus Ultron is an AI infamous for having an endless supply of backups.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#127246: Apr 25th 2021 at 1:37:11 PM

I'm in camp "Killmonger's death scene was perfect and having him reappear again would ruin it".

Thanos too, but not as many people are advocating for him to return.

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#127247: Apr 25th 2021 at 1:38:00 PM

> Well, Ultron definitely died offscreen, so he's probably the easiest to bring back.

Yep, especially with the existence of the internet and say Ultron uploaded himself to the internet at some point and it has just been waiting for the right moment

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#127248: Apr 25th 2021 at 1:38:25 PM

Plus serkis klaue is hilarious.

Seeing him in his full monster form is a sad thing well miss.

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
C105 Too old for this from France Since: Jan, 2012 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Too old for this
#127249: Apr 25th 2021 at 1:42:19 PM

I am also among those who are content with Killmonger being dead but who really would have loved to see more of Klaue. Serkis was awesome.

Then again, the MCU now has a functional time machine, with laws of time that allows to pluck anyone from the past without impacting the present (at least in this universe). So in theory any character who has died could come back, if only for a brief stint before returning to their timeline of origin (or not - ask Gamora and Loki)

Edited by C105 on Apr 25th 2021 at 10:42:42 AM

Whatever your favourite work is, there is a Vocal Minority that considers it the Worst. Whatever. Ever!.
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#127250: Apr 25th 2021 at 1:45:54 PM

Doesn't the CW DC shows do alternate universe replacements for dead characters?

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."

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