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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
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    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

Demongodofchaos2 Face me now, bitch! from In a Cultivation World (Ancient one) Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
Face me now, bitch!
#126476: Apr 1st 2021 at 1:50:30 PM

If he has Rapid-Fire Fisticuffs, they could animate them like that.

That, or a Buddha Palm as an homage to Kung Fu Hustle.

Watch Symphogear
ArthurEld Since: May, 2014
#126477: Apr 1st 2021 at 3:32:14 PM

I think Kung Fu Hustle is exactly the kind of tone they're trying to avoid.

Gaon Smoking Snake from Grim Up North Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#126478: Apr 1st 2021 at 3:44:12 PM

Which would be a stupid thing to avoid. Kung Fu Hustle is literally one of the best films ever made.

"All you Fascists bound to lose."
ArthurEld Since: May, 2014
#126479: Apr 1st 2021 at 3:51:02 PM

It's also a slapstick comedy, which Marvel is almost certainly not going to try to do with their first Asian led project.

It'd be like making Black Panther with a Coming To America sensibility, and that's a great movie.

Hodor2 Since: Jan, 2015
#126480: Apr 1st 2021 at 3:59:52 PM

Although I wouldn't expect it to be quite that zany, I kind of think/hope that the movie will be fairly comedic.

While of course, he doesn't necessarily "have" to be playing a similar character, Simu Liu's character in Kim's Convenience is a somewhat dense "gym bro", and it makes me think of obvious parallels with Chris Pratt playing Any Dwyer in Parks and Rec and then later Starlord.

And while she can play serious roles well, Akwafina is definitely a comedic actress.

And as illustrated by Kung Fu Hustle, the wuxia genre itself can be kind of zany.

Edited by Hodor2 on Apr 1st 2021 at 6:03:24 AM

AlleyOop Since: Oct, 2010
#126481: Apr 1st 2021 at 4:20:18 PM

Having a male East Asian lead who can pull off good comedy and without an accent would be kinda refreshing actually. Although Randall Park is also doing that sort of thing, I can't think of any example where it's on the big screen and the main character.

Gaon Smoking Snake from Grim Up North Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#126482: Apr 1st 2021 at 4:23:33 PM

Well, I don't know if you've seen KFH (or if you remember it, it was released basically 20 years ago), but Kung Fu Hustle actually isn't that far from a "Marvel film" in some points. It's just a lot more violent (rated r after all) and a lot zanier, but the film is also incredibly dramatic and serious. Kung Fu Hustle includes this as one of the main centerpieces of its soundtrack after all:

It is both incredibly zany and also incredibly touching and sad at times.

Kung Fu Hustle is also part of a long, storied tradition of Hong Kong comedy since the days of theater, and Kung Fu films in particular have always had an outlandish and mildly-self-referential nature. I'd find a lot more insulting if they just decided to do a plastified, idealized pale shade of Kung Fu Cinema rather than an actual look at the genre, but then again, the CCP is backing this so it's possible (Kung Fu Cinema has gone down the drain since the Hong Kong film industry is in the CCP stranglehold).

"All you Fascists bound to lose."
Beatman1 Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: Gone fishin'
#126483: Apr 1st 2021 at 4:24:45 PM

It really comes down to if the character is the butt of the joke. Heroes and fighters can be part of comedy but still feel important and threatening as long as the joke isn’t that they’re the morons. Shang Chi could pull that off, the straight man to a more comedic foil.

Of course, a lot of that depends on the film itself.

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#126484: Apr 1st 2021 at 4:34:37 PM

Having recently watched a Bruce Lee movie or two, imo that kind of 70's "Bond movies but with martial arts" would be an interesting avenue to take. That style was campy but intense, character focused but still maintained decently sized casts, and works pretty well for the concept of Fu Manchu they're going to be adapting the Mandarin to.

Jettison the sexism and such, and I think it'd make a nice medium between a grim and gritty brutal martial arts film and something wild and unfettered like Kung Fu Hustle.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Apr 1st 2021 at 4:34:54 AM

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#126485: Apr 1st 2021 at 4:44:43 PM

What kind of supporting cast does Shang-Chi have? It just occured to me that all I know about the film is that the protagonist is Shang-Chi and the antagonist is the True Mandarin, who we're assuming is his father.

AlleyOop Since: Oct, 2010
#126486: Apr 1st 2021 at 4:44:45 PM

The director is of Asian descent, albeit not necessarily experienced with kung fu movies in particular. I do think it'll at least fare better than the Mulan remake which was both joyless and inauthentic.

Hong Kong kung fu films are known for having a lot of physical comedy, and the Cantonese language in particular lends itself naturally to wordplay-based humor and absurdist comedy. Because the MCU is so infamously reliant on being a World of Snark (or its more deadpan equivalent in the case of the Captain America sub-franchises), then if it can get a handle of any of these three forms of typical Cantonese humor, then it will get points in my book for genuine efforts at authenticity and for diversification of its content.

Gaon Smoking Snake from Grim Up North Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#126487: Apr 1st 2021 at 4:50:56 PM

From Bruce Lee Enter the Dragon would probably be the best basis. Bruce Lee is pretty restrained when it comes to mysticism though, so that's more of an open question. I'd like something like the films by the "Venom Mob" allá Five Deadly Venoms and Crippled Avengers, films that usually did feature more overt superpowers (Five Deadly Venoms borders on a superhero film with its laser-focus on the clash between a bunch of superpowered individuals) and extraordinary figures.

Hell I'd like to see The Five Venoms in the film (probably not the actors, most of them are dead, but it'd be awesome to see if they could get the living ones). Bring me the whole nine yards of The Five Venoms, The Axe Gang, a drunken master somewhere, chambers of Shaolin, Pai Mei, just all the classic elements.

[up] The strange choice is that the director is of Japanese ancestry. The screenwriter at least is of Chinese ancestry, but he's worrying for more obvious reasons (namely that his track record is abysmal and he was once sued for falsely claiming credit for the script of The Expendables)

Edited by Gaon on Apr 1st 2021 at 4:56:02 AM

"All you Fascists bound to lose."
Beatman1 Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: Gone fishin'
#126488: Apr 1st 2021 at 4:58:10 PM

[up]The scriptwriter really did that?

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#126489: Apr 1st 2021 at 5:09:31 PM

What kind of supporting cast does Shang-Chi have? It just occured to me that all I know about the film is that the protagonist is Shang-Chi and the antagonist is the True Mandarin, who we're assuming is his father.

From what I remember about his original series (which the movie is an adaptation of), his cast is largely composed of the detectives who are trying to bring his father to justice, and sometimes fellow agents of his father whom either, like Shang Chi himself, realizes the error of their ways and became allies, or just pretended to to manipulate him.

That said, the characters on those toys are more recent. In fact, several of the characters listed for the film (including Xialing, who is on one of the toys) seem to be original. But then, particularly with Xialing, since a bunch of Shang's supporters are secret agents, it could be Leiko Wu under an assumed name (or just a composite).

Edited by KnownUnknown on Apr 1st 2021 at 5:20:49 AM

Gaon Smoking Snake from Grim Up North Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#126490: Apr 1st 2021 at 5:13:22 PM

It's a long and tortuous story, but the short of it is that Stallone may or may not have based his Expendables script on a old script of Callaham (the writer in question), but the similarities are reportedly rather minimal and part of the court battle involved emails in which Callaham apparently admits they were rather minimal. It's hard to tell here, but while I think Stallone's Republican ass can go fuck himself, it's more likely that he is right from the looks of thing. It's certainly not a good look for Callaham, particularly considering he lost the case in the end.

But aside from that legal mess, Callaham's track record is:

  • The Doom adaptation which needs no introduction (with Wesley Strick).
  • Forgettable thriller Horsemen.
  • A thriller I legitimately had never heard of called Tell-Tale.
  • Zombieland: Double Tap (with Reese and Wernick).
  • Wonder Woman 1984 (with Patty Jenkins and Geoff Johns).

The upcoming Mortal Kombat movie is also by his hand but that's a bleak record right there.

"All you Fascists bound to lose."
Beatman1 Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: Gone fishin'
#126491: Apr 1st 2021 at 5:34:24 PM

[up]He’s doing the new MK film, the one where they exorcised Johnny Cage and added a random OC as the main character?

We’re in trouble.

Synchronicity (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#126492: Apr 1st 2021 at 6:05:41 PM

I liked Zombieland 2, at least......

ClancyGardener life is a state of mind from 53 miles west of Venus Since: Jun, 2020 Relationship Status: Can't buy me love
#126493: Apr 1st 2021 at 8:41:18 PM

What kind of supporting cast does Shang-Chi have?

In the original '70's comics, there's four major recurring characters. Sir Denis Nayland Smith, the guy who pursued Fu Manchu in the books, now elderly an in a wheelchair; Black Jack Tarr, Smith's burly right-hand man and something of a Noble Bigot; Clive Reston, a dashing secret agent who is implied to be the son of James Bond and the nephew of Sherlock Holmes; and Leiko Wu, Clive's ex and Shang-Chi's romantic interest.

Sir Denis Smith is unlikely to be included in the movie, naturally. Maybe Clive Reston will make an appearance, but they'd likely have to cut the whole business about his relatives.

Trope Editor (he/him)
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#126494: Apr 1st 2021 at 8:46:16 PM

Presumably Death-Dealer there will be Mandarin’s Dragon.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Cortez from Parts Unknown (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#126495: Apr 2nd 2021 at 1:15:54 AM

I hope Shen Kuei shows up in the Shang-Chi film.

Robbery Since: Jul, 2012
#126496: Apr 2nd 2021 at 9:52:32 AM

It occurred to me the other day that, if Thanos's plan had remained unchanged, we'd just be facing the same problem he attempted to fix within 60 years or so. Right now, the world's population is approximately 8 billion, and it was less than half that as recently as 1950.

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#126497: Apr 2nd 2021 at 9:56:51 AM

The funny thing is that he went to go hide on a farm planet with little apparent technology after he did the snap, just assuming everything would be good forever

He had no real plans for follow through

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
Synchronicity (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#126498: Apr 2nd 2021 at 9:56:58 AM

Yeah, the fact that it just buys time and doesn't actually solve the scarcity problem was a whole thing in the "was Thanos right?" debate.

C105 Too old for this from France Since: Jan, 2012 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Too old for this
#126499: Apr 2nd 2021 at 9:57:18 AM

I keep wondering how much deaths were indirectly caused by the Snap (such as the crashing helicopter in the Infinity War stinger), and whether Hulk counted them as victims of the Snap when he brought them back. There is an awful mine of Fridge Horror there...

Whatever your favourite work is, there is a Vocal Minority that considers it the Worst. Whatever. Ever!.
DeathsApprentice The Ultimate Lifeform from The Ark Since: Aug, 2011 Relationship Status: Is that a kind of food?
The Ultimate Lifeform
#126500: Apr 2nd 2021 at 10:00:25 AM

I'm not even sure how he'd make sure the gauntlet also brought back all the lives lost from collateral damage from the Snap.

When we're done, there won't be anything left.

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