Marvel Cinematic Universe

Seriously, is there any reason the people writing these shows would think the HAND are compelling?

They don't even have the excuse of being a simple villain for an origin movie, because they were used for a LONG ass time.

It baffles me to this day that Marvel netflix decided to use The Hand (a plot point only DD and IF have connections to) to unite the Defenders, rather than something like a New York City Mob War between, say, Fisk and Mariah threatening to drown the city in blood, with Madam Gao Playing Both Sides to justify Iron Fist's involvement. Then you just need to add Nuke working for either Fisk or Mariah and you have Jessica's involvement in there too.

Given how much Netflix Marvel loved its villains, it's a surprise they didn't do this.

Many mistakes were made in Defenders.

I still like that first fight in Midland Circle though. And I thought Jessica and Matt had an interesting rapport.

Danny and Luke too: something that continues in the formers appearance in Luke Cage S2, where he actually helps Luke figure out the in and outs of Bushmaster's powers.

Yeah Defenders still had its moments despite all. The moments the characters just got to sit down and interact were pretty solid.

Aye, Defenders was a bit underwhelming on the villain's side. To be fair, the Hand actually is interesting as a villain group in the comic, where several of their members have superpowers or are flat-out Eldritch Abominations... but I guess that would not have fitted with the "gritty realistic" approach of the Netflix series (even though they're supposed to be in the MCU), so we got a bunch of idiots disguised as ninjas with dragon immortality juice instead. And Christ was their leadership underwhelming.

Defenders had its strong points; the team interacting is good, and the fight scenes are obviously on point. But the plot is a bit of a mess.

Anyway, since it was asked last page but not answered, the villains of Punisher S2 are Jigsaw and John Pilgrim (adaptation of The Mennonite), the latter of whom works for Testament Industries.

Edited by Anomalocaris20 on Jun 18th 2019 at 2:24:14 PM

What baffles me most about Defenders is the finale. I legit do not understand how nobody involved with making this film noticed the problem here. To defeat The Hand, the protagonists successfully carry out the bombing of a city skyscraper in Post-9/11 NYC. Their explosives rip through the entire building and reduce it to rubble as police responders watch helplessly from outside. The police then immediately declare "Oh, those WACKY SUPERS!" and let all the Defenders go back to their normal lives with no legal hassle. It is never brought up again.

How did this get through each and every step of the production process without a single person going, "Um, guys, you know all of our heroes are going to jail forever for being terrorists as soon as the credits roll, right?" The best part is that right before the bombing, Luke and Jessica take Matt Murdock hostage as a ruse to escape police custody, and he's later presumed dead in their skyscraper bombing.

Edited by TobiasDrake on Jun 18th 2019 at 12:47:23 PM

The Hand probably could have been interesting if their writing had been any better, if not for the repetitive nature. They spent too long throwing the hand at us as villains while simultaneously not actually elaborating on who they were and why the hell they were important - four seasons of television - relying on vague hints and presumably the assumption that ninjas on their own are inherently exciting to keep them running. So of course, they lost their interest very quickly in.

There's a reason why a horde of ninjas is a staple mook concept: because on their own they're featureless, character-less, and only focused almost to exclusion on physical threat. Which also means that once it's established that the protagonist(s) can defeat them, they lose what makes them engaging in the first place. But that wouldn't have even been a problem if the writers had simply had the Hand evolve their threat level and find new and fresh ways to be villains, but nah. And even in the comics, the Hand are generally only as interesting as their leader, and they didn't exactly have a ton of interesting Big Bads.

Gao was pretty much the only interesting one, and it's pretty transparent that she wasn't originally intended to be a Hand aligned character. The whole thing needed rethinking.

Hell, they probably would have been better off not having the Hand be the Big Bads for all of Defenders and instead having it transition into a different villain towards the end.

On that note, a shame: the Netflix shows were pretty clearly trying to set up a Legion of Doom, and with the cancellations we never got it.

I would have liked to see Diamondback in a later Defenders show. His unsubtle, bombastic nature would have been a good fit there.

I would have liked to see Diamondback when Hell freezes over due bombardments from the pig air force.

The problem with ninjas is that despite being supposedly elite warriors, there comes a point where they are so easy to defeat that they are no different from the average mobster.

The ninjas in fiction are practically Fake Ultimate Mooks

Edited by JoLuRo075 on Jun 18th 2019 at 4:38:57 AM

Well they ain't no Snake-Eyes.

The anbu of Naruto is a perfect example, supposedly elite warriors, but in a real fight they are killed as easily as an average chunin.

Anyway, it is difficult to take the ninja seriously, if they are as easy to beat as the average mobster.

Edited by JoLuRo075 on Jun 18th 2019 at 4:44:38 AM

New Spider-Man spot.

Edited by comicwriter on Jun 18th 2019 at 5:51:37 AM

After skipping it last year because the universe got Thanos'd at the time, Marvel is primed to come back with a vengeance (pun intended, not sorry) to San Diego Comic-Con 2019's Hall H!

(For the uninitiated, Hall H is SDCC's go-to area for BIG announcements.)

As for what we'll see...that's still classified. (Spider-Man/Deadpool movie announcement maybe?)

Saw this on another site, I apologize if this was already posted.

Huh okay I can see it now.

She dyed her hair red, I have now no complaints.

...though still can't see what was the bloody point.

As for The Defenders, I sum up my feelings with the series with one word: pukes.

See, she could've been perfect. But she doesn't play Mary Jane, so I now don't care.

She’s MJ. Deal with it

At the end of the day, her character is still Michelle, so I bloody won't.

I like MJ as is and I have no problem with seeing more of her. She's cute and charming and stuff.

Oh my God they are just going with a different direction with the character.

You think Vulture is a working man class & devoted father? No he was an old-ass motherfucker who was also a scientist.

And yet we still call him Vulture regardless.

Edited by slimcoder on Jun 18th 2019 at 8:00:40 AM

Take some cocaine, man, people not liking a different version of a character is not the end of the world.