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Your opinion on Jehovah's Witnesses

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MissKitten Luminescent Blush Since: Jul, 2012
#401: May 30th 2013 at 9:29:06 PM

Well, I know I don't agree with their beliefs but I still appreciated their politeness and the fact that they weren't pushy.

Scrounge (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#402: May 30th 2013 at 9:38:46 PM

YMMV. I feel going door-to-door to convert people is in itself kinda pushy, but I understand where you're coming from.

0dd1 Just awesome like that from Nowhere Land Since: Sep, 2009
Just awesome like that
#403: May 30th 2013 at 9:46:07 PM

They don't stay if you just ask them politely to leave. I can understand calling them pushy if they refused to go and insisted on staying, but as it stands, they don't do that and are very humble and respectful if you want them to leave or if you disagree with them. Proselytizing is just a part of their religion (with, mind you, no malicious intent at all), and they're very devoted to their religious duties, which I can respect (especially as someone who has tried to adhere more strictly to my own religious duties in the past and has consistently failed).

edited 30th May '13 9:46:56 PM by 0dd1

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resetlocksley Shut up! from Alone in the dark Since: May, 2012 Relationship Status: Only knew I loved her when I let her go
Shut up!
#404: May 31st 2013 at 10:15:03 AM

with, mind you, no malicious intent at all

That's absolutely right. It's completely the opposite, in fact.

Thanks, 0dd. smile

Well even though my friend nor I were very religious at all, we decided to go to one of their sermons the next night. It was pretty cool, and I learned that Cleanliness is Godliness.

That's cool, Bellacide. Glad to hear you enjoyed yourself.

It is unusual that they never came back, though.

Fear is a superpower.
Scrounge (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#405: May 31st 2013 at 2:50:32 PM

Religion thrives by cultivating shame and fear, and I don't like it one bit.

ATC Was Aliroz the Confused from The Library of Kiev Since: Sep, 2011
Was Aliroz the Confused
#406: May 31st 2013 at 3:02:16 PM

That's enough, Scrounge.

If you want any of my avatars, just Pm me I'd truly appreciate any avatar of a reptile sleeping in a Nice Hat Read Elmer Kelton books
resetlocksley Shut up! from Alone in the dark Since: May, 2012 Relationship Status: Only knew I loved her when I let her go
Shut up!
#407: May 31st 2013 at 3:04:58 PM

[up][up]I can tell you from personal experience that Jehovah's Witnesses don't operate that way. We aren't motivated by a morbid dread of the God we worship, or by the belief that we'll go to hell if we do bad things, or anything like that. There are religions out there that do operate on the basis of shame and fear, but we are not one of them.

edited 31st May '13 3:05:33 PM by resetlocksley

Fear is a superpower.
ATC Was Aliroz the Confused from The Library of Kiev Since: Sep, 2011
Was Aliroz the Confused
#408: May 31st 2013 at 3:12:31 PM

And, for the record, neither do us Mormons.

And neither do Seventh Day Adventists.

And neither do Buddists or Hindus or Taoists or many other religions I could name.

If you want any of my avatars, just Pm me I'd truly appreciate any avatar of a reptile sleeping in a Nice Hat Read Elmer Kelton books
Scrounge (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#409: May 31st 2013 at 3:15:09 PM

[up][up][up]Opinions were asked for. I'm giving mine.

[up][up] Convince me I'm wrong then. Show me acceptance. Show me social progression. Tell me how you're actually making the world a better place. I'd like to be proven wrong, really I would. But I've een the works of "righteous" men, and oftentimes they're pretty ugly.

edited 31st May '13 3:15:54 PM by Scrounge

ATC Was Aliroz the Confused from The Library of Kiev Since: Sep, 2011
Was Aliroz the Confused
#410: May 31st 2013 at 3:23:34 PM

Alright.

Personally, the woman who teaches my Sunday School class has spent much of her life in Niger, offering aid and relief. My ward, once a week, donates soap, towels, underwear, clothes, books, pencils, and food to Niger.

And no, she doesn't proselytize there. For her, to serve is a spiritual act in itself. She loves the culture and the people there. She speaks Hausa, the Zarma dialect of Songhay, and Kanuri, in addition to French.

She's gotten shot at, and, yes, shot, more than once.

edited 31st May '13 3:27:17 PM by ATC

If you want any of my avatars, just Pm me I'd truly appreciate any avatar of a reptile sleeping in a Nice Hat Read Elmer Kelton books
resetlocksley Shut up! from Alone in the dark Since: May, 2012 Relationship Status: Only knew I loved her when I let her go
Shut up!
#411: May 31st 2013 at 3:33:09 PM

Let me share a link you might find interesting.

Disaster Relief

We don't just go door-to-door, and when we do disaster relief we don't only help other Witnesses but also others who need help.

I'm not trying to argue, or prove you wrong, or anything. I just wanted to show you that there's more to Witnesses than preaching door-to-door.

[up] That's really cool, ATC.

Scrounge, there are many people from many other religions (and many who aren't religious at all) who do wonderful things for other peoples simply because they want to. It's people like that who make the world a better place to live in.

On another note, Tolerance.

edited 31st May '13 3:34:19 PM by resetlocksley

Fear is a superpower.
Scrounge (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#412: May 31st 2013 at 3:38:20 PM

[up][up] I meant Jehovah's witnesses in general, rather than a specific religious individual.

[up] That, on the other hand, answers my questions. Thank you. I may still not agree with you completely, but I can respect you. I'll back off.

resetlocksley Shut up! from Alone in the dark Since: May, 2012 Relationship Status: Only knew I loved her when I let her go
Shut up!
#413: May 31st 2013 at 3:47:48 PM

You're welcome, Scrounge, and thank you for listening. (You too, ATC.) If you ever have any other questions, the site I linked to (the official website of Jehovah's Witnesses) has lots of information about us.

I enjoyed this discussion. Thanks again. See you around the site.

edited 31st May '13 3:48:23 PM by resetlocksley

Fear is a superpower.
ATC Was Aliroz the Confused from The Library of Kiev Since: Sep, 2011
Was Aliroz the Confused
#414: May 31st 2013 at 5:01:45 PM

Oh, also, the COJCOLDS, or "LDS/mainstream-Mormon" faith has a very, very, very large relief fund. We were some of the first to get to Haiti when the Earthquake (you know the one) hit. We Mormons donate ten per-cent of our money to the Church, and it goes to things like that (in addition to other religious expenses, because our bishops and religious authorities are not paid for being bishops/religious-authorities).

I enjoyed this discussion as well. It was a good one.

I'm sorry if I snapped a bit at you; I've just had so many people who are unwilling to discuss and just want to yell. Thank you a lot, Scrounge. I really appreciate someone whose open-minded and willing to listen. See you next time.

edited 31st May '13 5:03:23 PM by ATC

If you want any of my avatars, just Pm me I'd truly appreciate any avatar of a reptile sleeping in a Nice Hat Read Elmer Kelton books
MissKitten Luminescent Blush Since: Jul, 2012
#415: May 31st 2013 at 5:39:52 PM

Oh never mind...

edited 31st May '13 5:40:28 PM by MissKitten

0dd1 Just awesome like that from Nowhere Land Since: Sep, 2009
Just awesome like that
#416: Jun 1st 2013 at 8:05:33 PM

I think a miracle just occurred in this thread.

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MissKitten Luminescent Blush Since: Jul, 2012
#417: Jun 1st 2013 at 8:09:15 PM

People with opposing views on religion talked to each other. Without being assholes to one another? Actually talked to each other without name-calling? And without strawman? Actually listened? And just being NICE?!!! It's a miracle!!!

edited 1st Jun '13 8:15:54 PM by MissKitten

0dd1 Just awesome like that from Nowhere Land Since: Sep, 2009
Just awesome like that
#418: Jun 1st 2013 at 8:12:33 PM

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pagad Sneering Imperialist from perfidious Albion Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
Sneering Imperialist
#419: Jun 2nd 2013 at 5:12:45 AM

Been visited a couple of times by them, and they've always been polite and friendly. Politely telling them that I'm an atheist and unlikely to have a spiritual epiphany any time soon seemed to do the trick. The poor dude who I opened the door to the second time seemed nervous as all hell, I imagine that he'd only started going door-to-door recently.

The only other interaction I have with them is very indirect: handling patient records marked "No blood transfusions" (I'm an NHS clerk).

With cannon shot and gun blast smash the alien. With laser beam and searing plasma scatter the alien to the stars.
joeyjojo Happy New Year! from South Sydney: go the bunnies! Since: Jan, 2001
Happy New Year!
#420: Jun 2nd 2013 at 5:32:00 AM

Jehovah's Witnesses are nice people but I really can't get over the no blood transfusion. I can respect religion up untill the point it start costing lives.

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TopographicOcean A Pathetic from the colo Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: I'm Clockwork and she's Quartz
A Pathetic
#421: Jun 2nd 2013 at 5:33:26 AM

I haven't seen any in years.

They used to be not uncommon, but they seemed to have disappeared.

YUUGI WANTS YOU FOR DRINKING BUDDY
resetlocksley Shut up! from Alone in the dark Since: May, 2012 Relationship Status: Only knew I loved her when I let her go
Shut up!
#422: Jun 2nd 2013 at 3:01:01 PM

[up][up] That's a common viewpoint, and it's understandable. There are also non-Witnesses who decline blood transfusions because of potential health risks like communicable diseases or receiving the wrong blood type. (Here's a Wall Street Journal article on the subject.) Witnesses aren't anti-medical, we simply don't accept a certain type of medical procedure. Just trying to clear up any potential misunderstandings or misconceptions, while trying to avoid arguing.

Actually talked to each other without name-calling? And without strawman? Actually listened? And just being NICE?!!! It's a miracle!!!

I know! Isn't it awesome? You guys are great. [awesome]

The poor dude who I opened the door to the second time seemed nervous as all hell, I imagine that he'd only started going door-to-door recently.

Yeah, it can be pretty nerve-wracking even if you've been doing it for a long time. It's kind of you to have noticed. smile

Fear is a superpower.
pagad Sneering Imperialist from perfidious Albion Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
Sneering Imperialist
#423: Jun 2nd 2013 at 3:05:28 PM

I'd also like to note that the level of prohibition on receiving blood products seems to depend on the Witness in question. I've seen several consent forms that indicate that a Witness might accept platelets but not haemoglobin, for example.

Not sure how it works with children under 16, though. I imagine that a doctor's medical opinion overrides parental preference in life-threatening situations.

With cannon shot and gun blast smash the alien. With laser beam and searing plasma scatter the alien to the stars.
resetlocksley Shut up! from Alone in the dark Since: May, 2012 Relationship Status: Only knew I loved her when I let her go
Shut up!
#424: Jun 2nd 2013 at 3:21:58 PM

[up] The thought behind that is that the Bible prohibits the use of blood, but doesn't say anything about blood fractions, or smaller elements that make up blood. So while all Witnesses reject transfusions of whole blood, some feel that fractions like platelets no longer count as "blood" and are therefore not prohibited in the Bible, while others feel that even fractions go against the spirit of the prohibition, making it a matter left up to individuals to decide based on their own personal feelings and conscience.

As for minors, in a legal sense I believe you're correct in some cases, but the opinion of the minor in question is also taken into account by the medical system and the legal system. Of course, the specifics vary based on the laws of the country. In many cases the issue has been taken to court, usually with the intention to prove that it's the minor's decision and not being forced on them by their parents. Different cases have had different results - sometimes the court rules that the young person is a "mature minor" and therefore allowed to make their own decisions, while other times the matter is decided in favor of the doctors wishing to perform the transfusion.

edited 2nd Jun '13 3:23:46 PM by resetlocksley

Fear is a superpower.
kay4today Princess Ymir's knightess from Austria Since: Jan, 2011
Princess Ymir's knightess
#425: Jun 2nd 2013 at 3:29:33 PM

That's pretty screwed up. To think that parents would let their children die because of something like that, it's both ridiculous and infuriating.


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