Troper Fencing Academy

EDIT: Okay, so to avoid further shitfits, "fencing" refers to all swordsmanship. By claiming that something is not a martial art, I am not devaluing it, mainly stating fact.

Swordsmanship is pretty cool. You'll be hard-pressed to find a fantasy work that doesn't include it, and even sci-fi doesn't escape its steely grip.

That said, media that portrays it accurately is pretty rare and misinformation is rife. Many Japanese sources are extremely happy to erroneously claim that they reached the apex of swordsmithing and martial arts, and most international audiences are happy to believe them.

Not that I want to discredit kenjutsu or anything. It's pretty sweet.

So in this thread, myself and anyone who cares to will be providing resources on how, exactly, to wield a sword and why it works that way. BLACKMOON GET IN HERE I NEED YOUR HELP.

Here's a short FAQ:

Why are katanas so much better than other swords?
They aren't. The short explanation is that the Japanese had awesome quality control, but otherwise made swords of comparable quality to other places. A katana is a really, really safe bet if you're after a good sword, though, as long as you know how to pick out a proper specimen.

In that case, who made the best swords?
No-one really did. Each sword was adapted to the environment in which it existed, and few of them were optimal outside of that context. Objectively speaking, the closest anyone came to "best" was the Scandinavians. They used a technique called pattern-welding in combination with insanely high-quality imported Indian steel. These were probably the "best" swords, but "best" doesn't count for much more than "especially good".

Who would win in a fight? X or Y?
Whoever's the better swordsman.

Okay, so compare their martial arts.
It still doesn't matter. It's just whoever's personally better.

I want to take up the sword. What do I do?
First, you need to know what kind of swordsmanship appeals to you. What's your inspiration? Swashbuckling, mustached heroes? Mighty knights? Disciplined samurai? Pirates?

The most common form of swordsmanship in the West is Olympic or classical fencing. It will teach you the handling of a sword, but it's not a martial art. In the true martial arts, you'll be trained to be ruthless, using every aspect of the martial art to learn killing techniques.

Kendo suffers from similar restrictions, although the bokken they use are nice and meaty in comparison to fencing foils. Learning kenjutsu is a better bet if you want to know how to use a sword or sword-like object in an actual combat situation.

Apart from that, there's a pretty major resurgence of Western swordsmanship martial arts going on right now, whether you want to learn European two-handed longsword, short sword, rapier as a martial art or saber. It really comes down to what's in your area.

Just keep in mind what inspires you the most and the answer will come easily.

All that remains is to contact the place that teaches this stuff and ask about it. Most places like to check to see if you've got a record of violent crime, though. But as long as you don't have that, you're pretty much in.

edited 13th Jul '11 8:29:52 AM by MadassAlex

I want to take up the jian, as I've mentioned often.

Not now, though.

I've always found medieval European swordmanship quite interesting. I might take a course.

edited 13th Jul '11 6:12:32 AM by MilosStefanovic

yo whadup

Here's a tip: never learn a sword art with "-do" in the name. Iaido, kendo, whatever. They are frou-frou wuss arts meant to teach you "the way of the sword" rather than "the art of the sword," and thus most of your potential sparring or technical practice will instead be replaced with philosophical jerkings-off. Go for something with a "-jutsu" in it, that'll put some fuckin' hair on your chest.

If you've already learned how to use a katana and want to branch out, learn dao. The principles of use are similar.

Sport fencing is crap for learning how to fight, but it's good for picking up the basics and for relaxation.

edited 13th Jul '11 7:11:11 AM by Blackmoon

The "way of the sword" shit is the reason why I'm put off by Eastern swordsmanship techniques. Seriosly, if I wanted philosophy, I'd read some serious books on the subject, written by true philosophers, not listen to some meditative pseudo-philosophical bullshit while learning how to use a sword. I came for a course in swordsmanship, not yoga, for god's sake.

The pseudo-philosophical crap, while tedious, does have its own merit, but I don't feel like boring everyone and sounding like some sort of weeaboo fanboy by wanking over it.

Viking swords ftw.

"Viking sword" seems like a bit of a misnomer, since the style was not constrained to use by vikings.

Yeah, a Viking sword is essentially similar to any other Germanic sword of the comparable time period. Although in media, Viking swords are characterised as having jian-like handguards rather than the cruciform or near-cruciform crossguards of the more well-known European single-handed swords.

This is Truth in Television, the Vikings did use that sort of guard, but they also used more regular crossguards.

Getting a little history/martial wanky, but:

We can't tell exactly how Vikings fought, but I'd hypothesise that their characteristic aggression in war would be translated into their fencing techniques. What this might mean is a massive influence on single-time parries and ripostes, even moreso than other forms of swordsmanship. Given that this kind of thing characterises Holy Roman Empire-era German swordsmanship, and that the Vikings and Germanic tribes that became the Holy Roman Empire are close kin, we can speculate via reverse-engineering that the Vikings might've used much the same approach to aggressive stances, attack-parries and the like that characterises later German fencing.

But that's a maybe.

edited 13th Jul '11 7:33:54 AM by MadassAlex

Alex! I challenge you to A DUEL in Dystropia.

Well it's nowhere NEAR done so we'll have to settle for REAL LIFE.

/Pacific Ocean

oh. :(

That's no good. My cock might reach you from there, but I don't have any swords that'll do it. >:( Curse your different-continentness.

On the bright side, you've got time to practise. >:3

How would that be fair? If I practice, there's no way you'll be able to keep up.

Hey, I did fencin—

-sees this is about katanas-

-leaves-

^^ Don't make me shietelhau your face, boy. You can look that word up! >:(

^ It's about all fencing... it's just that kendo and kenjutsu are the most popular alternative to classical fencing.

...really?

You had to go and say "katana" in your opening post, didn't you, Alex?

I KNOW RIGHT

This should've been a super-secret European-sword-only club. >:/

NO KATANAFAGS ALLOWED

"The most common form of swordsmanship in the West is Olympic or classical fencing. It will teach you the handling of a sword, but it's not a martial art. In the true martial arts, you'll be trained to be ruthless, using every aspect of the martial art to learn killing techniques." = weeaboo fan wank.

Seriously. This isn't my bag.

Thank god I know how to use those too.

EDIT@DG: :BG:UEOGO:Slkb MARTIAL ART =/= EASTERN

edited 13th Jul '11 7:45:30 AM by Blackmoon

Yeah, I mean, I've never properly used a katana or jian ever.

I use two-handed European longswords. And I take my techniques from Medieval German fencing manuals...

@Blackmoon: Except when they've been talking about nothing but Japanese shit, then rag on fencing for not being "a real martial art".

How could it be? You're only allowed to strike someone in a specific area in a specific way with a specific part of your sword. There's a point system, for god's sake.

@Blackmoon: I know. I did it. Doesn't stop me from getting pissed that it was waved off as the weeaboo equivalent of "not a real sport".

In my opinion, sport fencing is too constrained by rules to be considered a true martial art (emphasis on martial, so it can be used in practical situations). It's not really my cup of tea, though I understand why people could like it.