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DEATH BATTLE- By Screwattack

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JRads47 OHOHOHOHO from Emperor Palpatine Surgical Reconstruction Center
OHOHOHOHO
Feb 10th 2020 at 11:19:52 AM

Leo fighting Zitz makes that episode feel really dated now.

"You know what they say about broken clocks: they're wrong one thousand four hundred thirty-eight times a day." Jon Bois
chasemaddigan Kirby's Triple Deluxe Sundae
Kirby's Triple Deluxe Sundae
Feb 10th 2020 at 11:26:59 AM

It's neat that they had Shao Khan do the "FIGHT!" announcement, like they used to do in season one. I know that was a Mortal Kombat thing before hand, but it's a nice touch.

About the next fight, they did plan on having Leo fight a Power Ranger back in season one. But his original opponent was going to be Tommy instead of Jason. It would've been cool to see the all the turtles fight the original Power Rangers, but there would've been an obvious disadvantage in numbers.

JRads47 OHOHOHOHO from Emperor Palpatine Surgical Reconstruction Center
OHOHOHOHO
Feb 10th 2020 at 11:51:10 AM

Battletoads is a series with so little to work with, and with later seasons' greater focus on fancalcs, it doesn't seem like a property the current DB would touch.

"You know what they say about broken clocks: they're wrong one thousand four hundred thirty-eight times a day." Jon Bois
FlutterFire Ugh, please don't make me talk about my feelings from the Dragon Lands Relationship Status: Non-Canon
Ugh, please don't make me talk about my feelings
Feb 10th 2020 at 12:00:17 PM

You say that and yet Mortal Kombat has so little to work with that feats are still being decided by the minigames.

Is this another part of pony friendship? Telling each other what you learned all the time?
FlutterFire Ugh, please don't make me talk about my feelings from the Dragon Lands Relationship Status: Non-Canon
Ugh, please don't make me talk about my feelings
Feb 10th 2020 at 12:06:10 PM

These are gonna be the rules for Leonardo vs. Jason in deciding what each of them get for the fight.

  • No Zords for Jason, for a few reasons. One being Zordon's rule about not using them unless the fight escalates (A.K.A the enemy hitting the big time). While there have been instances of some exceptions, particularly in supplementary material, it's still been a consistent part of the main canon (i.e the original show).
    • Beyond that, we really didn't want to do another Zord episode. We've already had three, and we want to focus on what a Ranger themselves can do for once. Bringing in the T-Rex would force us to dedicate a lot more of the analysis to another Zord since the question is no longer "can Leo beat Jason" but "can Leo beat the T-Rex".
  • Red Ranger Jason only. No Gold Zeo powers. He also isn't getting the Dragon Dagger or Dragon Coin as that was only temporarily his, it's more-so Tommy's, and it was mostly used for summoning the Dragonzord rather than actually being used in combat regardless. I don't believe that there's a rule against Omega powers in the episode, but we didn't focus on them. A similar thing happened with Leo (i.e. we can't cover everything)
  • Leonardo is a difficult character to bring into Death Battle because every version of him we see throughout the franchise is canonically a different character in a different timeline (evidenced by Turtles Forever and the 2012/1987 crossovers). We can't do "everything" with him, but if we focused on just one version like 2012 then we would alienate a HUGE portion of the TMNT fanbase who know the Mirage comics, 1987 cartoon, etc.
    • We're looking at a generalization of what's standard for different versions of Leonardo provided they aren't too contradictory to other canons. So he gets the Odachi for instance since that's standard equipment in Rise, as well as other misc. weapons he uses in 2012, but no dragon transformation, no future weapons, no turtle mechs, no secondary mutations, no possible future timelines like Mutant Apocalypse, Same as it Never Was, Future Mirage, etc., and no OVA feats.

Is this another part of pony friendship? Telling each other what you learned all the time?
Feb 11th 2020 at 4:33:41 AM

Jude Mathis (Tales of Xillia) vs Tifa Lockhart ( Final Fantasy VII).

Two fist fighters from beloved RPG franchises.

Kham (The Protector) vs Rama (The Raid)

Two heroes from martial arts movies.

Edited by windleopard on Feb 11th 2020 at 4:37:01 AM

Feb 11th 2020 at 5:53:31 AM

I want to vote Tifa because I know little about Jude.

Let's start with "can German Suplex a kaiju" and work from there.

Edited by Soble on Feb 11th 2020 at 1:15:07 AM

Always a student.
Feb 11th 2020 at 9:59:32 AM

I guess that broken leg meant nothing for Canary.

TobiasDrake Exposition Dragon from Colorado, USA Relationship Status: She's holding a very large knife
Exposition Dragon
Feb 11th 2020 at 11:48:43 AM

I guess that broken leg meant nothing for Canary.

I mean, it's a Mortal Kombat X-Ray move broken leg. MK characters regularly stab characters through the eye, run large blades through their brain, grind every bone in their body to dust, puncture all of their organs, and then the X-Ray ends and the other fighter gets right back up like nothing happened.

X-Ray attacks are gratuitous Rule of Cool with no actual impact on a character's ability to fight despite frequently being super lethal.

Regarding the Fight

I was actually surprised that Sindel held up as well as she did, to be honest. This was one of those fights where experience won, but it also kinda zig-zagged. The verdict was,

  • Whose scream is stronger? Black Canary's scream is substantially more powerful than Sindel's.
  • Okay, but overall, who has the more powerful moveset and feats and stuff? In terms of ability to affect the battlefield, combat options, powers, etc., Sindel is the stronger fighter. Black Canary is absolutely the underdog in this despite beating Sindel in that one area where they intersect.
  • Okay, but who wins? Oh, Black Canary, definitely. Sindel might be above her weight class, but Black Canary is always punching above her weight class. The question isn't, "Is Sindel stronger than Black Canary?" The question is, "Is Sindel stronger than the DC Uber-Titans that Black Canary frequently defeats?" And the answer is HAHAHAHAHAHAHA NO.

Drake's Razor: Never attribute to cold unfeeling logic that which can be equally explained by emotional outburst.
Feb 11th 2020 at 9:26:17 PM

Leonardo is a difficult character to bring into Death Battle because every version of him we see throughout the franchise is canonically a different character in a different timeline (evidenced by Turtles Forever and the 2012/1987 crossovers). We can't do "everything" with him, but if we focused on just one version like 2012 then we would alienate a HUGE portion of the TMNT fanbase who know the Mirage comics, 1987 cartoon, etc.

Yeah, that's kind of a problem with TMNT, owing to the first adaptation being both extremely popular and a massive case of Adaptation Decay, leading to subsequent adaptations fighting back and forth over being more faithful to the source or being more faithful to the 80's show, with some trying to be both (like Batman vs Turtles).

But as they say, when it comes to basic powersets and feats the Turtles themselves never change too significantly, beyond story specific buffs.

If it was like Baxter Stockman or Shredder or really any of the villains, that would be a much bigger problem.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Feb 11th 2020 at 9:29:20 AM

"The difference between reality and fiction is that fiction has to make sense." - Tom Clancy, paraphrasing Mark Twain.
slimcoder Insane Religious Murderbot
Insane Religious Murderbot
Feb 11th 2020 at 9:58:46 PM

Why are they trying to be faithful to the 80s show?

Nobody is innocent, there are merely varying levels of guilt. Oh and Primus hates you.
FlutterFire Ugh, please don't make me talk about my feelings from the Dragon Lands Relationship Status: Non-Canon
Ugh, please don't make me talk about my feelings
Feb 11th 2020 at 11:44:04 PM

Because despite the Mirage comics coming first, most of the public knows the TMNT from the 80's cartoon, and it's the most iconic iteration of the turtles there is, despite the differences the show has from the comics.

What Death Battle is trying to do is get anything that Leonardo has that's standard for him, and leave out extraordinary things that only that specific iteration of Leo had, like the dragon transformation from 2003 or turtle mech suits from 2012.

Does it nerf him? Absolutely. But at the same time, they're not giving Jason his giant robots or golden suit.

Is this another part of pony friendship? Telling each other what you learned all the time?
slimcoder Insane Religious Murderbot
Insane Religious Murderbot
Feb 11th 2020 at 11:47:30 PM

How the Hell is it still the most iconic iteration of the turtles?

Its been over 30 years. Since then weve gotten movies (most bad) & several TV shows, several of which I assume is of better quality than the 80s shows like the 2000s one.

How does public perception not move on?

Nobody is innocent, there are merely varying levels of guilt. Oh and Primus hates you.
FlutterFire Ugh, please don't make me talk about my feelings from the Dragon Lands Relationship Status: Non-Canon
Ugh, please don't make me talk about my feelings
Feb 12th 2020 at 12:52:40 AM

Nostalgia and first impressions.

The 80's cartoon was a big hit and it clearly stuck with people. It's the baseline to compare other iterations to because that's the one that had the biggest impact on them. Maybe some fans grew up and worked on later official iterations to make them like how they remember, maybe they're basing it off the most popular version to give parents who grew up with it something to be familiar with, who knows?

It's like if you asked a Pokemon fan to sing a theme song from the anime. Chances are they're gonna start with "I wanna be the very best". Cause Indigo League stuck with people, and people made sure it stuck around.

That's not to say that the older is always the more iconic one. I'd say the 10th Doctor in Doctor Who is a lot more recognizable than the 1st one, and doing an image search for My Little Pony will most likely land you more Friendship is Magic stuff than the original 80's show or toys.

But then again, the 10th Doctor didn't try (at least to my knowledge) to be like the 1st one, and even though Friendship is Magic referenced characters from past generations like Tirek or the Smooze, they made them more their own thing rather than strictly follow the original.

Kinda like how the TMNT 80's cartoon did with the original comics, making Baxter Stockman a white whiny nerd, changing it so that Hamato Yoshi turned into Splinter rather than just having his pet rat mutate into Splinter.

How is it still the most iconic? Because people still remember it and like it, too.

Is this another part of pony friendship? Telling each other what you learned all the time?
Feb 12th 2020 at 11:48:28 AM

Why are they trying to be faithful to the 80s show?

The same reason Teen Titans adaptations keep trying to be reminiscent of the 2000's show, even though like 80's Turtles it wasn't a particularly good adaptation of the source material and doing so prevents them from exploring a lot of really cool things from the Teen Titans' history.

Nostalgia sells and public perception sells, and lots of networks and studios would rather make a safe copy of an old adaptation than take any risk on a different one. This gets worse when people who grew up with the classic adaptation get old enough to start Running the Asylum, and they get upset that the thing they loved as a kid isn't being used and forcibly change it back, only for that to get changed back by later adaptors, and so on and so forth.

Hence stuff like Young Justice (which was forcibly renamed from Teen Titans by executive caveat, even though it's clearly a Teen Titans series) being an exception among a lot of 00's Teen Titans throwback attempts (and at the same time it went through hell to become so).

Edited by KnownUnknown on Feb 12th 2020 at 11:52:53 AM

"The difference between reality and fiction is that fiction has to make sense." - Tom Clancy, paraphrasing Mark Twain.
Feb 13th 2020 at 12:00:06 AM

I think the Gargoyles would have made for a good opponents for the Ninja Turtles.

They are non-human creatures who live in New York and fight human opponents. Their individual members also match each other:

Leo and Goliath - the leaders in blue.

Raph and Brooklyn - the tough guys in red.

Don and Lex - the technical geniuses.

Mike and Broadway - the goofy eaters.

Splinter and Hudson - the old mentors.

Feb 13th 2020 at 6:56:39 PM

He also isn't getting the Dragon Dagger or Dragon Coin as that was only temporarily his, it's more-so Tommy's, and it was mostly used for summoning the Dragonzord rather than actually being used in combat regardless.
Im sorry, what?

3DS FC: 1177-8200-7726
SonOfSharknado Love is Love is Love Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
Love is Love is Love
Feb 13th 2020 at 8:25:35 PM

If they had any balls, they'd give Leo any and all of his IDW feats and Jason his Boom! feats, including his explicit super-strength, super-speed, and the fact that he can survive on the moon while morphed.

My various fanfics.
Nightwire Humans inferior. Ultron superior. Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
Humans inferior. Ultron superior.
Feb 13th 2020 at 8:44:25 PM

Oh, I would be interested in seeing Lord Drakon (Tommys evil alternate universe counterpart) in DB.

Bite my shiny Vibranium ass, Avengers.
Ghilz Fight It Out! from The Moon, Or Canada Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
Fight It Out!
Feb 13th 2020 at 9:24:48 PM

and the fact that he can survive on the moon while morphed.

A) Rangers suits allow one to survive in space anyway

B) Jason actually went on the moon unmorphed several times on the show (Green With Evil, and Forever Red)

C) The moon has air in Power Rangers. Horses live on it.

Edited by Ghilz on Feb 13th 2020 at 12:25:54 PM

fredhot16 from Baton Rogue, Louisiana. Relationship Status: Too sexy for my shirt
Feb 13th 2020 at 9:43:41 PM

Horses what?

Edited by fredhot16 on Feb 13th 2020 at 9:44:04 AM

Suspension of disbelief: I can believe in time travel but it still has to make sense with it's own rules.
Ghilz Fight It Out! from The Moon, Or Canada Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
Fight It Out!
Feb 13th 2020 at 9:44:47 PM

Horses

On the moon

Robots use them as mounts in one episode.

I will say that the weird thing about Jason is that he's probably got the smallest arsenal of any rangers, since his series predates Battlelizers / Powered Up forms. He also lacks solo finishing moves (less you could swinging his sword and it glows?) common to later rangers. Ditto not having any civilian powers (ie: Unmorphed super powers), baring stuff from the comics.

That said Jason is also able to fight Goldar to a standstill unmorphed so ya know, make of that what you will.

Edited by Ghilz on Feb 13th 2020 at 12:50:57 PM

fredhot16 from Baton Rogue, Louisiana. Relationship Status: Too sexy for my shirt
Feb 13th 2020 at 9:47:56 PM

I am now more confused.

Edited by fredhot16 on Feb 13th 2020 at 9:51:01 AM

Suspension of disbelief: I can believe in time travel but it still has to make sense with it's own rules.
Ghilz Fight It Out! from The Moon, Or Canada Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
Fight It Out!
Feb 13th 2020 at 9:49:54 PM

Theres robots on the moon

The robots are riding horses while on the moon.

A bunch of humans show up.

Everyone breathes without spacesuits.

The robots get off their horses and the humans turn into red rangers and they brawl.

It's really not that complex.


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