TVTropes Now available in the app store!
Open

Follow TV Tropes

Following

The General US Politics Thread

Go To

Nov 2023 Mod notice:


There may be other, more specific, threads about some aspects of US politics, but this one tends to act as a hub for all sorts of related news and information, so it's usually one of the busiest OTC threads.

If you're new to OTC, it's worth reading the Introduction to On-Topic Conversations and the On-Topic Conversations debate guidelines before posting here.

Rumor-based, fear-mongering and/or inflammatory statements that damage the quality of the thread will be thumped. Off-topic posts will also be thumped. Repeat offenders may be suspended.

If time spent moderating this thread remains a distraction from moderation of the wiki itself, the thread will need to be locked. We want to avoid that, so please follow the forum rules when posting here.


In line with the general forum rules, 'gravedancing' is prohibited here. If you're celebrating someone's death or hoping that they die, your post will get thumped. This rule applies regardless of what the person you're discussing has said or done.

Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM

Swanpride Since: Jun, 2013
#248926: Jul 11th 2018 at 3:28:06 AM

So, Trump just accused Germany of colluding with Russia.

Yes, really.

His reasoning is the gas pipeline Germany has with Russia. Supposedly we are totally dependent on Russia.

Just for the record, there was trade between the European states and Russia even during the Cold war. Because it is a necessity for both sides.

The numbers Trump gave are totally overblown. The actual number of gas Germany buys from Russia is a way lower percentage of its Energie needs...I think it is something around 20-25%, which means it would take a hit if the connection is turned off, but it would hardly be a country destroying event.

I also suspect that Trump actually believes that Germans use more gas then they do. For the record, most Germans prefer oil heating over gas heating and we prefer electric stoves. Replacing the Russian gas would be a hassle, but it is not impossible.

tclittle Professional Forum Ninja from Somewhere Down in Texas Since: Apr, 2010
Professional Forum Ninja
#248927: Jul 11th 2018 at 3:29:08 AM
Thumped: Wow. That was rude. Too many of this kind of thump will bring a suspension. Please keep it civil.
"We're all paper, we're all scissors, we're all fightin' with our mirrors, scared we'll never find somebody to love."
DrDougsh Since: Jan, 2001
#248928: Jul 11th 2018 at 3:35:29 AM

Trump really seems like he's just picking a fight for the sake of it now. The timing of this kind of accusation seems especially unwise considering he's meeting Putin in less than a week.

Swanpride Since: Jun, 2013
#248929: Jul 11th 2018 at 4:36:31 AM

It's typical though..he always accuses other people of doing what he himself is doing.

Zarastro Since: Sep, 2010
#248930: Jul 11th 2018 at 5:25:25 AM

[up] What makes this even more ironic/moronic is that he criticizes a chancellor that has actually lived a good part of her life in a state under Russian dominion and thus probably knows how this really feels like... .

Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#248931: Jul 11th 2018 at 5:32:09 AM

Everything Trump does is political theatrer,his tweets,his over the top aggressive behaviour ect,his projection ect.I can ignore his tweets by not looking them up,but his other behaviour is harder to ignore,and he knows it,he knows that as President everyone will pay attention him,and everyone will talk about him constantly

There's no escape and it can feel hopeless at times,especially when you hear of abuses of Ice under his administration with children separated from their parents and confined to cages

I try to look on the bright side life,and only silver lining in all of this is that constantly being bombarded with Trump means people will have politics on their minds for a long time yet,they might have been able to safely ignore things in the past,forgot about it because it felt like nothing major ever happens in politics..well things are different now and there's incentive to vote in the next election,the undecided voter might finally pick a side

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
Swanpride Since: Jun, 2013
#248932: Jul 11th 2018 at 5:32:25 AM

[up][up] Well, Merkel's response was reminding everyone of the fact in a very classy way...while also pointing out that German troops are currently deployed on the behalf of NATO, including in Afghanistan on the behalf of the US.

Edited by Swanpride on Jul 11th 2018 at 5:32:12 AM

CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#248933: Jul 11th 2018 at 7:06:08 AM

The only thing greater than Trump's pride, greed, and racism is his ingratitude.

Edited by CharlesPhipps on Jul 11th 2018 at 7:07:57 AM

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
BlueNinja0 The Mod with the Migraine from Taking a left at Albuquerque Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
The Mod with the Migraine
#248934: Jul 11th 2018 at 7:10:16 AM

It appears Schumer has decided that Kavanaugh's appointment to the Supreme Court is a hill worth dying on.
I'm trying to decide if I'm upset about this or not. He doesn't seem like a great guy ... just a better choice than anyone else Trump was considering, and I don't know what happens if Schumer wins and the Democrats don't carry the Senate away in the midterms.
The US in general needs to get out of this mindset that the NATO is a one-sided arrangement in which the US is hovering like some lion over the poor defenceless European states. That is just a pile of nonsense.
The last page of talk about how European militaries are currently less effectively armed than my kid's Boy Scout troop kind of contradicts your point. tongue
So why is Russia relying on cyberwarfare, interfering with elections, and misinformation campaigns rather than invasions like Georgia and Ukraine if Europe isn't able to stop or restrain them?
It's far, far cheaper? They get dollars return for the pennies they spend. They don't have to worry about insurrections or paying their own troopsnote .
The Orange House is preparing for hundreds of billions in tariffs on more Chinese goods. Beijing will likely be forced to resort to non-tariff counters to match this dollar for dollar.
Wonderful. Maybe more of these Red State voters will finally realize that they can't be racist and earn a paycheck.
He thinks that, by making those goods more expensive to import, some enterprising company will start producing those goods themselves. This would create jobs and make money for Americans.
This would be nice, but he's also throwing tariffs on raw materials that said enterprising company would need to produce those finished goods he's also putting tariffs on. Seriously, there is no way for a country to be 100% self-sufficient in this world. He doesn't understand that.

That’s the epitome of privilege right there, not considering armed nazis a threat to your life. - Silasw
megaeliz Since: Mar, 2017
#248935: Jul 11th 2018 at 7:14:03 AM

The proposed Nordstream Natural Gas Pipeline, is a legitimate issue, but assuming Trump actually understands the politics of energy is honestly giving him to much credit.

It would give Russia more leverage over Europe's energy markets, which is part of could be translated into political leverage as part of their asymmetric assault on Western Democracies, and further isolates Ukraine from the rest of Europe. But as I said, this is giving him way to much credit, and should be treated as the projection that it is.

Edited by megaeliz on Jul 11th 2018 at 10:55:21 AM

math792d Since: Jun, 2011 Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#248936: Jul 11th 2018 at 7:23:25 AM

It's also extremely poor PR for any attempts at claiming the Paris Accords are being upheld.

"Oh yeah, we're totally going to uphold the Accords while we're building this massive gas pipeline. Don't worry about it, THE OIL MUST FLOW."

Still not embarrassing enough to stan billionaires or tech companies.
megaeliz Since: Mar, 2017
#248937: Jul 11th 2018 at 7:26:38 AM

[up] Actually Natural Gas is better than oil. It burns a lot cleaner, and just releases carbon dioxide and water, instead of other, more harmful, greenhouse gases, such as methane.

It's still not ideal, since we are still adding green house gases to the atmosphere, but shouldn't be ruled out as a transition fuel.

Edited by megaeliz on Jul 11th 2018 at 10:35:39 AM

Raptorslash Since: Oct, 2010
#248938: Jul 11th 2018 at 7:28:21 AM

Granted, carbon dioxide is still bad and still a greenhouse gas. It's relatively better, but it isn't a permanent alternative for green fuel.

Edited by Raptorslash on Jul 11th 2018 at 10:31:18 AM

PhysicalStamina i'm tired, my friend (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Coming soon to theaters
i'm tired, my friend
#248939: Jul 11th 2018 at 7:29:27 AM

Mike Cernovich is attempting to signal boost the Unmasking Antifa Act, a bill introduced last month in the House by Republican Rep. Dan Donovan (N.Y.) and is co-sponsored by GOP Reps. Pete King (N.Y.), Paul Gosar (Ariz.) and Ted Budd (N.C.) and is currently in the Judiciary Committee which would give a 15 year prison sentence to anyone wearing a mask or disguise who injures, oppresses, or threatens anyone in the free exercise of their rights or privileges.

I feel like we're skipping over something we shouldn't, here. House Republicans are trying to get a bill through that would basically make protesting fascism illegal.

i'm tired, my friend
megaeliz Since: Mar, 2017
#248940: Jul 11th 2018 at 7:34:51 AM

[up][up] One thing that's showed promise in places like India, is using biogas digesters that use food waste to power small appliances, such as gas stoves.

Edited by megaeliz on Jul 11th 2018 at 10:43:36 AM

CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#248941: Jul 11th 2018 at 7:47:45 AM

While not at all funny and a serious attempt to strike against protest, I do find it hilarious this law outlaws superheroes.

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
Bisected8 A casual tief of punk from Her Hackette Cave (Primordial Chaos) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
A casual tief of punk
#248942: Jul 11th 2018 at 7:53:09 AM

Vigilantism's already outlawed, I think. tongue

This law just specifically criminalises taking any steps to hide your identity at a protest (which is unfortunate, because it's written broadly enough that it basically translates to "anyone who shows up at a protest can be arrested if we feel like it").

TV Tropes's No. 1 bread themed lesbian. she/her, fae/faer
Parable Since: Aug, 2009
#248943: Jul 11th 2018 at 7:55:12 AM

Where was this guy when the KKK was terrorizing the South?

RedSavant Since: Jan, 2001
#248944: Jul 11th 2018 at 8:01:21 AM

Half-serious guess? Under the hood.

It's been fun.
PhysicalStamina i'm tired, my friend (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Coming soon to theaters
i'm tired, my friend
#248945: Jul 11th 2018 at 8:15:30 AM

...because it's written broadly enough that it basically translates to "anyone who shows up at a protest can be arrested if we feel like it"

And this is exactly the goal of the act. That it is written in such broad terms is no accident; this is a calculated attempt to clamp down on anti-fascist protests. It is yet another reminder that these people could give a damn about free speech until they need to lean on it as an excuse to oppress somebody.

i'm tired, my friend
megaeliz Since: Mar, 2017
#248946: Jul 11th 2018 at 8:26:05 AM

Since we were discussing NATO, this is worth a read. It discusses how NATO can address the asymmetric threats of hybrid warfare, and become more resilient in the face of unconventional tools and tactics. I won't put the whole thing here, but I will put the recommendations they have.

1. Allies should invoke Article 4 in response to hybrid threats.

Invoking Article 4 would mandate political consultations to develop political solutions to hybrid attacks. It would provide an opportunity for allies with differing threat perceptions to share intelligence and best practices to reach consensus about deterrent and defensive strategies to combat hybrid threats during crises. These consultations would include discussion of internal thresholds for triggering various responses by the Alliance to hybrid operations, including the invocation of Article 5. They could also facilitate requests by individual allies for support from NATO in responding to a hybrid operation; a NATO-wide hybrid response team should be established to deploy in response to allies’ requests.

2. NATO and the EU should institute a Joint Task Force on Countering Asymmetric Threats.

NATO and the EU should further improve collaboration to increase transatlantic resiliency to asymmetric tactics. Each organization has disparate elements that address individual asymmetric tools, but are not all well-funded or in sync with one another’s efforts. A Joint Task Force, led by senior officials from both organizations, could better coordinate the work of the various parts of NATO and EU bureaucracies already addressing this challenge to defend against a threat that crosses organizational jurisdictions. Moreover, the Task Force could monitor disinformation campaigns and coordinate public outreach on behalf of both organizations to advocate for the benefits of the transatlantic community in the face of efforts by Russia, China, and others to sell an alternative model for government and society.

3. NATO should further develop public-private partnerships with civil society.

NATO should increase its efforts to develop partnerships with local civil society organizations that can combat disinformation, play the role of the “watch dog” in holding political elites to standards of transparency, and advocate for democratic ideals and principles at the grassroots level. It should also devote additional resources to public diplomacy campaigns, such as the #We Are NATO campaign, and engage all member states in their coordination. New campaigns could target citizens in rural areas who do not use Facebook or Twitter by engaging them at schools, libraries, and community and retirement centers.

4. Allies should reinvigorate Article 3 — Resiliency

Much of the work to counter malign foreign interference in democracies requires strengthening member states institutions and societies to make them more resilient to these attacks. Under Article 3 of the Washington Treaty, each member state is obligated to “maintain and develop” its “capacity to resist armed attack,”35 which should include enhancing resilience and civil preparedness in the realms of cybersecurity, energy security, and election security.36 NATO should renew its focus on Article 3 of the NATO charter and define minimum standards for resilience with a verification process that does not rely on self-reporting. Such an approach is necessary for “21st century defense and deterrence.”37 Member and partner states on the frontline of this assault should receive additional assistance from NATO in order to address persistent vulnerabilities.

5. NATO should issue a declaratory statement.

Hybrid, asymmetric tactics pose a serious threat to the stability of the Alliance and its member states. NATO allies should take the opportunity of the Brussels Summit to issue a declaratory statement about the severity of the threat and allies’ commitment to appropriately respond to it.

Edited by megaeliz on Jul 11th 2018 at 11:28:33 AM

TerminusEst from the Land of Winter and Stars Since: Feb, 2010
#248947: Jul 11th 2018 at 8:29:45 AM

Somewhat ironically, if not entirely unexpectedly, yesterday Senate voted to support NATO ahead of Trump summit

Lawmakers on Tuesday overwhelmingly voted in favor of a motion supporting NATO, as President Trump continues to criticize the alliance ahead of his summit in Europe.

The nonbinding motion, which came as the Senate voted to reconcile its version of the annual defense policy bill with that of the House, expresses the Senate’s support for NATO and calls on negotiators to reaffirm the U.S. commitment to it.

Edited by TerminusEst on Jul 11th 2018 at 8:29:53 AM

Si Vis Pacem, Para Perkele
AmbarSonofDeshar Since: Jan, 2010
#248948: Jul 11th 2018 at 8:34:34 AM

Yeah, we really should not be ignoring that attempt to criminalize protest. The GOP is trying to make opposition to the Klan illegal.

CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#248949: Jul 11th 2018 at 8:35:43 AM

It'd be nice if the Klan was arrested for wearing masks at protests.

But they won't.

Separate but Unequal Law.

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
AmbarSonofDeshar Since: Jan, 2010
#248950: Jul 11th 2018 at 8:37:19 AM

The whole point of the law is to make standing up to Klansmen, neofascists, and their ilk, even more difficult than it is, if not outright illegal.


Total posts: 417,856
Top