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Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#248676: Jul 9th 2018 at 5:48:46 AM

[up] Paul Krugman noted recently that Trump is seemingly going out of his way to ensure that his own voters are harmed by this trade war. He's imposing tariffs on intermediate goods used to make products in the U.S., increasing prices for U.S. consumers; and the countries he's targeting are retaliating by imposing their own tariffs on finished goods, which directly hurts U.S. producers. It's like a perfect storm of stupid.

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
Kayeka (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#248677: Jul 9th 2018 at 5:53:39 AM

[up]"Perfect Storm of Stupid" is an accurate description of Trump's presidency and everything connected to it.

Maybe Trump is actively looking to get fired.

Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#248678: Jul 9th 2018 at 6:04:33 AM

Trump cant be fired because there's no one above him in terms of authority,you've got congress and the people outside congress,they're the ones who can 'fire' Trump when it comes to voting.

I rather have Trump voted out along with the rest of Republicans,instead of Trump being replaced with someone like Pence

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
Kayeka (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#248679: Jul 9th 2018 at 6:07:22 AM

[up]That's the bit, though; as president, he is servant to the people, so if he wishes to get fired, he must piss off the people. And he's been doing a jolly good job of that, so perhaps six months from now we get to sing "Hooray for democracy!" and forget about this whole sodding business.

Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#248680: Jul 9th 2018 at 6:13:12 AM

Trump is not a servant of people,you have people in his Government who are effectively like that,but Trump himself is the authority

and yes if people are pissed they'll need to show it by V O T I NG

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
megaeliz Since: Mar, 2017
#248681: Jul 9th 2018 at 6:37:23 AM

[up] In a Government "for the people, by the people" the president must answer to us, the people. That's a fundamental principal of our Government.

That is why impeachment powers are with congress.

Edited by megaeliz on Jul 9th 2018 at 9:41:37 AM

Larkmarn Since: Nov, 2010 Relationship Status: Hello, I love you
#248682: Jul 9th 2018 at 6:50:51 AM

I mean, that's cute sentiment but, you know, not actually the case.

Found a Youtube Channel with political stances you want to share? Hop on over to this page and add them.
megaeliz Since: Mar, 2017
#248683: Jul 9th 2018 at 7:36:52 AM

The founders were skeptical of having putting too much power into any one person, even as they recognized the need to have some type of executive authority. (In fact some of the alternate proposals for the executive branch, included a executive committee made of two or three people.)

So, and here's the legitimately radical bit, instead of making the president accountable "to God alone", like in the Divine Right of Kings, he is accountable to the elected legislature.

Edited by megaeliz on Jul 9th 2018 at 10:53:59 AM

Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#248684: Jul 9th 2018 at 7:53:48 AM

The point is that we are supposed to have government that's accountable to the people, but that only works as long as the people make responsible use of that power. We've seen how tragically easy it is to manipulate the information and opportunities available to people and thus dissuade them from exercising their franchise responsibly.

Edited by Fighteer on Jul 9th 2018 at 10:54:15 AM

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
Fourthspartan56 from Georgia, US Since: Oct, 2016 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#248685: Jul 9th 2018 at 7:57:40 AM

[up]Quite, while the idea of democratic accountability is not completely a myth it is heavily mythologized. In reality most people are too ignorant and irrational to really hold their leaders to any strong degree of accountability, they more or less have to be forced to experience it and then they tend to forget it rather quickly.

Edited by Fourthspartan56 on Jul 9th 2018 at 10:59:31 AM

"Einstein would turn over in his grave. Not only does God play dice, the dice are loaded." -Chairman Sheng-Ji Yang
Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#248686: Jul 9th 2018 at 7:59:00 AM

As an example, it took the Great Depression to get us to demand that the government provide a social safety net, and it took maybe 30 years for people to start to forget because how dare those black people get to be equal?

Edited by Fighteer on Jul 9th 2018 at 11:02:44 AM

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#248687: Jul 9th 2018 at 8:00:03 AM

Trump is supposed to answer to the people and Congress, but he frankly doesn't care and goes about his business as if they are supposed to answer to him.

Fourthspartan56 from Georgia, US Since: Oct, 2016 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#248688: Jul 9th 2018 at 8:01:38 AM

[up]Absolutely, but lets not mistake this for a strength. He does it because he's a delusional moron that cannot accept information that hurts his pride, something that's liable to make him and the Republicans suffer.

"Einstein would turn over in his grave. Not only does God play dice, the dice are loaded." -Chairman Sheng-Ji Yang
CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#248689: Jul 9th 2018 at 8:13:24 AM

He does it because the people hate the Republican party but a large chunk of it love him.

So the Republicans have formed a wall of toadies and cronies about him.

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
BlueNinja0 The Mod with the Migraine from Taking a left at Albuquerque Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
The Mod with the Migraine
#248690: Jul 9th 2018 at 8:35:23 AM

it took the Great Depression to get us to demand that the government provide a social safety net, and it took maybe 30 years for people to start to forget because how dare those black people get to be equal?
So when Trump's policies cause us to hit Great Depression 2.0 in 5-10 years, do you think we'll see a similar social pushback against minorities again three decades after that? Just want to know what I should be prepared for when I'm geriatric.
Trump is supposed to answer to the people and Congress, but he frankly doesn't care and goes about his business as if they are supposed to answer to him.
And sadly, it works.

That’s the epitome of privilege right there, not considering armed nazis a threat to your life. - Silasw
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#248691: Jul 9th 2018 at 8:36:14 AM

It is simultaneously a strength and a weakness, a double-edged sword, as are all other facets of Trump's personality. His sheer disregard for how he should act and treat others functionally serves as a sort of political Confusion Fu. His opponents are kept busy double-checking what he's saying against the facts and doubting their own reality. His allies are either too scared of him and his base to contradict him or they play him like the fool he is. On the other hand, he has remarkably little ability to act on (some of) his impulses, and his ignorant words are just that: words. They carry little power by themselves and only hurt his own reputation, but of course he doesn't see that.

Fourthspartan56 from Georgia, US Since: Oct, 2016 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#248692: Jul 9th 2018 at 8:36:52 AM

So when Trump's policies cause us to hit Great Depression 2.0 in 5-10 years, do you think we'll see a similar social pushback against minorities again three decades after that? Just want to know what I should be prepared for when I'm geriatric.
I don't think that would be a safe assumption, obviously racism isn't going to magically disappear but our national environment is extremely different.

"Einstein would turn over in his grave. Not only does God play dice, the dice are loaded." -Chairman Sheng-Ji Yang
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#248693: Jul 9th 2018 at 8:37:48 AM

[up][up]Honestly, I've never really liked the "double-edged sword" thing. It's not like swordsmen regularly cut themselves with said swords unless they were complete amateurs.

Edited by M84 on Jul 9th 2018 at 11:37:35 PM

Disgusted, but not surprised
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#248694: Jul 9th 2018 at 8:39:43 AM

Yeah, and Trump is a complete amateur who cuts himself all the time, then plays it off like he meant to do that while simultaneously whining and blaming the Democrats for cutting him.

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#248695: Jul 9th 2018 at 8:41:58 AM

It's just something that I never really understood. After all, it's not like a complete amateur wouldn't be any less likely to hurt themselves with a single-edged sword either.

Edited by M84 on Jul 10th 2018 at 12:23:40 AM

Disgusted, but not surprised
CrimsonZephyr Would that it were so simple. from Massachusetts Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
Would that it were so simple.
#248696: Jul 9th 2018 at 8:43:33 AM

The metaphor "all blade, no hilt" works better.

"For all those whose cares have been our concern, the work goes on, the cause endures, the hope still lives, and the dream shall never die."
Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#248697: Jul 9th 2018 at 9:23:07 AM

You asked for a knight but they sent you his squire instead!

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
sgamer82 Since: Jan, 2001
#248698: Jul 9th 2018 at 9:29:07 AM

I'd say The Jester is more apropos to Trump. He drops the dogwhistling and speaks bluntly, but everyone laughs him off as a fool until he goes too far.

Edited by sgamer82 on Jul 9th 2018 at 10:28:54 AM

TerminusEst from the Land of Winter and Stars Since: Feb, 2010
#248699: Jul 9th 2018 at 9:55:02 AM

[up]

So a shitty Sir Dagonet?

Si Vis Pacem, Para Perkele
TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#248700: Jul 9th 2018 at 11:27:22 AM

Trump is supposed to answer to the people and Congress, but he frankly doesn't care and goes about his business as if they are supposed to answer to him.

This is true. He's spent basically his whole Presidency pushing the limits of what he's permitted to do and daring anyone to push back. In theory, Congress, the Supreme Court, and the voters are meant to serve as a check on the President's power, but Trump is a walking Constitutional Crisis utterly determined to find out whether or not they truly are.

A rule unenforced does not exist. Rules are defined by their enforcement. The Constitution is a guideline; by itself, it has no power. It can only act through people. Thus, if Trump tries to claim a power he does not have a Constitutional right to and neither Congress nor the Court challenges him on it, then it de facto becomes a power he has despite the rules saying it's not. The only true limit on his power is the Legislative and Judicial branches' willingness to rebuke him.

So far, the Judicial's been pretty good about this, to the extent to which they are capable. The Legislative, however, have accepted him as the Absolute Power in America and effectively declared that he has no limits because they will never enforce those limits. Congress has declared him King Trump via omission of opposition. Now it comes to that final check, the voters, to cast their judgment on Congress's unspoken declaration.

We'll see how that goes.

Edited by TobiasDrake on Jul 9th 2018 at 12:29:55 PM

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