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Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM

Silasw A procrastination in of itself from A handcart to hell (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
A procrastination in of itself
#242126: May 14th 2018 at 9:07:45 AM

I'd argue that there is a place to discuss the kind of people who use social justice as an excuse to engage in campaigns of harassment and abuse, thing is it's not here, because the biggest expression of such people has been limited to either anti-fandoms or some of the counter GG groups who engaged in harassment and death threats against anyone they felt could be linked to GG (which unsurprisingly included people who had been trying to address actual videos games journalism issues for years).

Here's the thing, none of this is relevant to US politics, they're not a political force, they don't mobilise on the streets, they don't form a coherent voting block, they're not active in internal Democrat Party politics, they're just a bunch of social media bullies who decided to use social justice as their excuse to bully rather than racism.

They are relevant only when it comes to discussing how the uncivilised internet spaces of Twitter, Reddit and Tumblr have created some horrific sub-cultures that exist only to hate, harass and bully. That and they're relevant when specific instances come up of them attacking someone. If you see them in the world tell them to go away, if someone has been harassed by them show the victim genuine sympathy, but don't for a moment think that they're an actual force in US politics.

edited 14th May '18 9:10:02 AM by Silasw

“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran
megaeliz Since: Mar, 2017
#242127: May 14th 2018 at 9:07:50 AM

[up] Personally I think the bigger threat is how many people would be okay with these views, if they were dressed in a more respectable and socially acceptable fashion.

I guarantee you have them in your life. They could be the nicest people in the world, and aren't Alt-Right, but share a concerning amount of views.

This is most of the people who voted for Trump. Although they may not endorce the crazy stuff, they are still complicit.

edited 14th May '18 9:21:14 AM by megaeliz

AmbarSonofDeshar Since: Jan, 2010
#242128: May 14th 2018 at 9:09:03 AM

It's usually not just Tumblr these people rage against. It's college campuses with their safe spaces and trigger warnings and whatnot.

Of course, that's still just some dumb kids at a college campus. Some of them are overzealous but they are hardly an existential threat to the nation or the Leftist cause, which is usually the argument.

The right-wing criticism of "college campuses" usually has zero basis in reality anyway. Inevitably when you look at what the people wanting "trigger warnings" and "safe spaces" actually asked for, versus what the right-wing and their dutiful parrots on the brocialist left reported it as, it usually turns out that it was far more reasonable than claimed.

University is usually the first time in a right-wing white man's life that he's forced to interact with people who don't share his views, and he usually responds by having a meltdown about how he's being oppressed and marginalized. They never get over it either; Joe Scarborough, who as Republicans go, is relatively sane, is just one of the many who has never recovered from being outnumbered by lefties, and each time he brings it up on his show, I am reduced to tears of hysteria.

edited 14th May '18 9:09:43 AM by AmbarSonofDeshar

Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#242129: May 14th 2018 at 9:11:25 AM

[up] This. For all that the right complain about the left being pansies who can't handle adversity, they're the ones who melt down whenever they leave their insulated thought bubbles.

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
AmbarSonofDeshar Since: Jan, 2010
#242130: May 14th 2018 at 9:17:30 AM

Campus Conservative Clubs tend to be places that radicalize with ease, because they are, irony of ironies, a safe space for not only traditional Christian Conservative types, but for various other misogynist dude bros who were too sexist and creepy, or virulently racist, for even the frat boy atmosphere that pervades most universities.

That's the other irony too. Anyone who claims universities are bastions of progressive thought, has never had to listen to some frat douche white boy, (joint in hand optional), expound to his bros (and the "not like other girls" girls who hang out with them) on how sexism and racism are totally over and done with and all that's left is to fight the rich, man.

There's a reason women and minorities at universities sometimes felt like they needed a safe space. I sometimes felt like I needed one, just to wash off all the bro douche.

megaeliz Since: Mar, 2017
#242131: May 14th 2018 at 9:24:13 AM

[up] That's one of the reasons my School doesn't have Fraternities (or sororities, for that matter).

edited 14th May '18 9:26:14 AM by megaeliz

AmbarSonofDeshar Since: Jan, 2010
#242132: May 14th 2018 at 9:25:19 AM

"Frat douche" is sadly a mentality as much as an actual descriptor. My university was too small to have fraternities...but the scenario I described above played out again, and again, and again.

CrimsonZephyr Would that it were so simple. from Massachusetts Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
Would that it were so simple.
#242133: May 14th 2018 at 9:39:26 AM

"Gaming culture has always been a refuge for toxic masculinity, and #GG is still a banned topic."

Yikes, okay, I'm sorry for bringing it up.

"Campus Conservative Clubs tend to be places that radicalize with ease, because they are, irony of ironies, a safe space for not only traditional Christian Conservative types, but for various other misogynist dude bros who were too sexist and creepy, or virulently racist, for even the frat boy atmosphere that pervades most universities.

That's the other irony too. Anyone who claims universities are bastions of progressive thought, has never had to listen to some frat douche white boy, (joint in hand optional), expound to his bros (and the "not like other girls" girls who hang out with them) on how sexism and racism are totally over and done with and all that's left is to fight the rich, man.

There's a reason women and minorities at universities sometimes felt like they needed a safe space. I sometimes felt like I needed one, just to wash off all the bro douche."

College Republicans were easily some of the most insufferable people I've ever encountered. They have just enough education to be pseudointellectual, and it shows. The people quoting von Mises like gospel, the ones with the Romney and Ted Cruz placards, the ones inviting actual white supremacists to speak on campus the very week a swastika gets spray-painted on a campus building, and my various political science professors regarding them with the look of deepest suffering as these morons started spouting advocacy for ethno-nationalist herrenvolk republicanism in classes about democratic theory and history. And I went to college in Massachusetts during Obama's first term.

edited 14th May '18 9:42:06 AM by CrimsonZephyr

"For all those whose cares have been our concern, the work goes on, the cause endures, the hope still lives, and the dream shall never die."
AmbarSonofDeshar Since: Jan, 2010
#242134: May 14th 2018 at 9:46:31 AM

I wish more profs would figure out what my dad figured out as a high school teacher—don't call on the fascist. Once you know what he is, don't let him talk.

DeMarquis (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#242135: May 14th 2018 at 9:52:20 AM

Or, dont be afraid to interupt the tirade, and enforce your discussion rules.

The question was whether authoritarianism as a term could apply outside of support for actual dictatorships, and also whether or not it could apply to someone with otherwise leftist beliefs. Yes to both.

edited 14th May '18 9:55:01 AM by DeMarquis

I'm done trying to sound smart. "Clear" is the new smart.
AmbarSonofDeshar Since: Jan, 2010
#242136: May 14th 2018 at 9:55:15 AM

If you've let him go on a tirade, you're too late. Part of your job as an educator is providing a safe environment, and letting the racist or neofascist or what have you rail for any length of time is too late.

Interrupt him the first time, sure, when you didn't know what he was. After that, you keep him quiet.

Nikkolas from Texas Since: Dec, 2009 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#242137: May 14th 2018 at 9:57:39 AM

I mean, was there a tirade? I'm actually pretty interested in this as I've never been to college and the idea of some random kids in a polisci class interrupting learning about democratic theory to talk about radically anti-democratic theories is pretty fascinating. Got this idea in my head of the professor trying to talk about Locke and Rousseau and Kant and some kid standing up and shouting "WHAT ABOUT EVOLA?! He had some great ideas about women and elites and...."

It's very amusing in my head although I doubt it was anything so spectacular. But then again I dunno, hence why I'm asking.

DeMarquis (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#242138: May 14th 2018 at 9:57:46 AM

Everyone has a right to answer questions. If the person is repeatedly disrupting the class, you dont ignore him or her, you apply apporpriate disciplinary action.

I'm done trying to sound smart. "Clear" is the new smart.
AmbarSonofDeshar Since: Jan, 2010
#242139: May 14th 2018 at 10:00:02 AM

No, they don't "have a right to answer questions." They have a right to an education, and they can get one by sitting there and shutting up and taking notes.

Talking in class, like so many things, is a privilege and it's one that can and should be revoked in the face of unacceptable behaviour.

PhysicalStamina i'm tired, my friend (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Coming soon to theaters
i'm tired, my friend
#242140: May 14th 2018 at 10:01:51 AM

Why do I feel like I can already tell where this conservation is headed?

i'm tired, my friend
CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#242141: May 14th 2018 at 10:02:04 AM

I'm confused as to why people keep saying, "SJ Ws aren't a real threat to the world." No duh. Did anyone think so? It was about talking about online harassment which is a real thing but in no way talks about larger non-online harassment.

I agree on the fact universities can often become cesspits of self reinforcing morality.

edited 14th May '18 10:03:19 AM by CharlesPhipps

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
PhysicalStamina i'm tired, my friend (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Coming soon to theaters
i'm tired, my friend
#242142: May 14th 2018 at 10:05:05 AM

I'm confused as to why people keep saying, "SJ Ws aren't a real threat to the world." No duh. Did anyone think so?

Have you not been paying attention to this entire discussion? Some people do think so-called "SJWs" are a threat to the world, simply because they criticize them for saying the n-word.

i'm tired, my friend
Fourthspartan56 from Georgia, US Since: Oct, 2016 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#242143: May 14th 2018 at 10:06:43 AM

[up][up]This thread is not a perfect manifestation of the normal political discourse. Right-wingers use SJW's as a boogeyman all the time and they are especially fond of using them as a means to downplay the alt-right through false equivalences.

So yes there is a real benefit in pointing out that SJW's as a noteworthy force do not exist.

edited 14th May '18 10:06:50 AM by Fourthspartan56

"Einstein would turn over in his grave. Not only does God play dice, the dice are loaded." -Chairman Sheng-Ji Yang
KazuyaProta Shin Megami Tensei IV from A Industrial Farm Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Shin Megami Tensei IV
#242144: May 14th 2018 at 10:06:51 AM

Yeah, this talk was all about hoe SJW are just a Regressive boogeyman.

I'm a Christian Straight Men and even I recognize that

Watch me destroying my country
AmbarSonofDeshar Since: Jan, 2010
#242145: May 14th 2018 at 10:09:11 AM

I'm confused as to why people keep saying, "SJ Ws aren't a real threat to the world." No duh. Did anyone think so? It was about talking about online harassment which is a real thing but in no way talks about larger non-online harassment.

I agree on the fact universities can often become cesspits of self reinforcing morality.

"SJW" entered the conversation when someone tried to force an equivalence with the alt-right that does not exist. The irrelevance of "SJW" to US Politics was pointed out and people started talking about bad experiences with fandoms. Bad experiences with fandoms are not, generally speaking, relevant to US Politics as a whole.

"SJW" does not belong in this thread.

Silasw A procrastination in of itself from A handcart to hell (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
A procrastination in of itself
#242146: May 14th 2018 at 10:10:10 AM

Sadly not everywhere let’s educators discipline facist for going on facist rants, so sometimes you just have to take preventative measures.

And yeah that shit really happens, when I was at uni we once had our right wing Christian guy get into an argument with a Muslim student and then loose his shit completely and call the police claiming that he was being threatened by an Islamist extremist. This was an international relations class.

I was ill that week and just found out about it afterwards, things were awkward for a white.

It was about talking about online harassment which is a real thing but in no way talks about larger non-online harassment.

Thing is this isn’t the “internet cultures and online harassment” thread, so that’s not an appropriate topic for here, if someone wants to start such a thread the issue of internet bullies using social justice as a sheild for their bullying would be on topic there, it’s not on topic here.

[down][down] Typo, but I can’t correct it now can I? grin

edited 14th May '18 10:16:41 AM by Silasw

“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran
PhysicalStamina i'm tired, my friend (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Coming soon to theaters
i'm tired, my friend
#242147: May 14th 2018 at 10:13:17 AM

Do you know what happened when the police came?

i'm tired, my friend
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#242148: May 14th 2018 at 10:14:34 AM

[up][up]

I was ill that week and just found out about it afterwards, things were awkward for a white.

...Is that a typo? Or was that intentional?

edited 14th May '18 10:14:47 AM by M84

Disgusted, but not surprised
CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#242149: May 14th 2018 at 10:14:58 AM

More ways of bilking the poor of money have been legalized.

https://www.si.com/college-basketball/2018/05/14/new-jersey-betting-supreme-court

edited 14th May '18 10:17:19 AM by CharlesPhipps

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
Silasw A procrastination in of itself from A handcart to hell (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
A procrastination in of itself
#242150: May 14th 2018 at 10:16:11 AM

My understanding is that they were less than amused at having their time wasted, the right wing nutjob disappeared from the uni shortly afterwards, I don’t think we ever got a clear answer on if he was expelled, chose to leave or had it ‘suggested’ to him that he take his education elsewhere.

Incidentally he was one of you lot, an American, catholic though, but fully convinced that some people would burn in hell forever, which I think goes against catholic doctrine.

Thinking about it this was all before my uni was revealed to have had an alumni go on to become a prominent member of ISIS, we got fun emails from the uni the day that hit the news.

[up] It’s occasionally used as cover by internet bulleis as well, my standard rule is that anyone using the term SJW gets my suspicion, as if they’re using it for others they’re normally a bigot and if they’re using it for themselves they’re normally a bully using social justice as a cover.

edited 14th May '18 10:19:59 AM by Silasw

“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran

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