TVTropes Now available in the app store!
Open

Follow TV Tropes

Following

The General US Politics Thread

Go To

Nov 2023 Mod notice:


There may be other, more specific, threads about some aspects of US politics, but this one tends to act as a hub for all sorts of related news and information, so it's usually one of the busiest OTC threads.

If you're new to OTC, it's worth reading the Introduction to On-Topic Conversations and the On-Topic Conversations debate guidelines before posting here.

Rumor-based, fear-mongering and/or inflammatory statements that damage the quality of the thread will be thumped. Off-topic posts will also be thumped. Repeat offenders may be suspended.

If time spent moderating this thread remains a distraction from moderation of the wiki itself, the thread will need to be locked. We want to avoid that, so please follow the forum rules when posting here.


In line with the general forum rules, 'gravedancing' is prohibited here. If you're celebrating someone's death or hoping that they die, your post will get thumped. This rule applies regardless of what the person you're discussing has said or done.

Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM

Hodor2 Since: Jan, 2015
#239276: Apr 18th 2018 at 5:00:47 PM

Comey generally seems like a pretty self-righteous guy.

In terms of his choices, it seems like at best he made some bad political choices to deal with Trump partisans in the FBI ranks who were itching to investigate Clinton.

At worst though, it seems like besides making a calculation to not do something that would hurt Trump, both because he assumed he wouldn't win and to appease pro-Trump partisans, he was also totally cool with sabotaging the (he assumed) inevitable Hillary Clinton administration.

Like there is an argument that Comey thought he was doing something which meant that if (as he assumed) Clinton was elected, would have held the partisan ranks in check, but it seems to be more obvious that he really wanted her to be mired in scandal/bad press from the outset.

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#239277: Apr 18th 2018 at 5:23:52 PM

Comey's a self-righteous ass who refuses to take any responsibility for anything. He screwed up with the Bundys, he screwed up with Clinton, he screwed up with Trump...what an incompetent fuckwit.

Disgusted, but not surprised
Wyldchyld (Old as dirt)
#239278: Apr 18th 2018 at 5:49:30 PM

Like Fighteer said, it's very easy for us to sit there on the sidelines and claim he made a mistake. We'll never know what decision we'd make if we were in his shoes with the information he had at the time.

edited 20th Apr '18 5:50:27 PM by Wyldchyld

If my post doesn't mention a giant flying sperm whale with oversized teeth and lionfish fins for flippers, it just isn't worth reading.
megaeliz Since: Mar, 2017
#239279: Apr 18th 2018 at 5:55:30 PM

Normally, I wouldn't use something like "The New Yorker" but this confirms something that I have sort of suspected for a while.

Last week, the United States launched an act of war against a sovereign government because failing to do so would have cast doubt on the credibility of the statements that Donald Trump makes while livetweeting Fox & Friends.

That may sound like hyperbolic snark, or the premise of an Andy Borowitz column, but it is a plain description of the rationale behind last Friday’s missile strikes in Syria, according to multiple military and administration officials.

Last Tuesday — amid reports that the U.S. was considering a strike against the Assad regime, in response to an alleged chemical weapons attack against civilians in Douma — Russia’s ambassador to Lebanon Alexander Zasypkin warned that “if there is a US missile attack, we … will shoot down U.S. rockets and even the sources that launched the missiles.”

The Fox & Friends morning crew took exception to this bluster, with one host arguing, “What we should be doing is telling the Russians, ‘Every Syrian military base is a target and if you’re there, it is your problem.’”

Minutes later, one of the program’s most dedicated viewers echoed that belligerent note.

"Russia vows to shoot down any and all missiles fired at Syria. Get ready Russia, because they will be coming, nice and new and “smart!” You shouldn’t be partners with a Gas Killing Animal who kills his people and enjoys it!"

The rest of the editorial is sort of weird and I don't really agree with it, but the important part is absolute proof that Fox and Friends is his chief advisor.

edited 18th Apr '18 5:59:32 PM by megaeliz

Rationalinsanity from Halifax, Canada Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
#239281: Apr 18th 2018 at 5:58:36 PM

The fact that the Dems might be within the margin of error to unseat Ted Cruz...if nothing else watching that bastard go down will be worth it.

Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.
Raptorslash Since: Oct, 2010
#239282: Apr 18th 2018 at 5:58:50 PM

Isn't it generally pretty common knowledge that Trump pretty much decides to do whatever the last thing he heard on Fox was or the last thing his inner circle suggested he do?

edited 18th Apr '18 5:59:21 PM by Raptorslash

ironballs16 Since: Jul, 2009 Relationship Status: Owner of a lonely heart
#239283: Apr 18th 2018 at 6:08:04 PM

With Comey announcing what he did when he did, there's an argument to be made that he did so in order to prevent damage to a Clinton Presidency - if that information came out after she'd been elected, and there was new information in the emails they sorted through, that would have risked harming her Presidency. By announcing it ahead of time - though for my money, waiting until they'd had time to sift through the Wiener emails first to see if there was anything new would have been better - Comey avoided making the FBI look complicit in a coverup and would have allowed Clinton to say "Hey, the voters made their choice even knowing what they knew".

Unfortunately, he definitely miscalculated, but hindsight is 20/20.

"Why would I inflict myself on somebody else?"
Raptorslash Since: Oct, 2010
#239284: Apr 18th 2018 at 6:11:59 PM

How does Ted Cruz keep getting reelected, anyway? He isn't holding a major position like Ryan or McConnell, and isn't he one of the most hated people in Congress?

edited 18th Apr '18 6:12:25 PM by Raptorslash

DingoWalley1 Asgore Adopts Noelle Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: Can't buy me love
Asgore Adopts Noelle
#239285: Apr 18th 2018 at 6:14:57 PM

[up] He doesn't; he's a first term Senator, and he only won the first time because he was a Republican in Texas in 2012. This is his first Re-Election.

Wyldchyld (Old as dirt)
#239286: Apr 18th 2018 at 6:15:08 PM

According to that interview, he indicated that his biggest concern was to make a decision that protected the institution's reputation as much as possible.

edited 20th Apr '18 5:52:17 PM by Wyldchyld

If my post doesn't mention a giant flying sperm whale with oversized teeth and lionfish fins for flippers, it just isn't worth reading.
Wyldchyld (Old as dirt)
#239287: Apr 18th 2018 at 6:33:44 PM

double-post.

edited 20th Apr '18 5:52:37 PM by Wyldchyld

If my post doesn't mention a giant flying sperm whale with oversized teeth and lionfish fins for flippers, it just isn't worth reading.
megaeliz Since: Mar, 2017
#239288: Apr 18th 2018 at 6:34:01 PM

So at a Press Confrence with Shinzo Abe, at Mar-a-Lago today, a reporter managed to get in a question about Russia.

Here's his response:

Trump was responding to a shouted question as he posed for photos with Japanese Prime Minister Shinzo Abe following a joint news conference. The president then returned to the microphone to restate his claim that "there has been nobody tougher on Russia than President Donald Trump."

"We had a very, very severe ... fight in Syria recently [in February] between our troops and Russian troops and that’s very sad," the president said. "Many people died in that fight."

"With the media, no matter what I did, it’s never tough enough because that’s their narrative," Trump lamented. "But Russia will tell you there has been nobody tougher than Donald Trump."

DO NOT CONGRATULATE!

Pseudopartition Screaming Into The Void from The Cretaeceous Since: Dec, 2013 Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
Screaming Into The Void
#239289: Apr 18th 2018 at 6:45:43 PM

It's also very likely that they created the stereotype that the proletariat are lazy (and by extension the bootstrap myth) does give them a convenient excuse to blame the victims (and dogwhistles for them to target certain groups) and the stereotype is a factor in their opposition to higher taxes (for the bourgeois), welfare and UBI.
As I understand it, this actually goes back to the early years of capitalism, where higher classes push the idea that extremely long workdays producing goods for companies was the good and moral thing for the people of the lower classes to do. Even going so far as to say that very young children should be put to working long hours as quickly as possible to keep from falling into laziness. This is just the most recent iteration of those ideas, really.

megaeliz Since: Mar, 2017
#239290: Apr 18th 2018 at 6:47:35 PM

[up][up]once you get pass the obvious lies, you can start to see other things wrong with it as well. [1]

"We had a very, very severe ... fight in Syria recently [in February] between our troops and Russian troops and that’s very sad," the president said. 'Many people died in that fight.'"

Trump said this today. It is false, and he radically misunderstood his brief.

What happened: Russian mercenaries from the Wagner Group were positioned across a river from a U.S. Special Forces Forward Operating Base, with the river serving as the defacto dividing line of control.

Wagner mercenaries fired on the American troops.

While they didn't hit anything, they were fully aware they were firing on Americans, and the American soldiers did exactly what they were supposed to do: They did not return fire, which could have sparked a shooting war with Russia, and requested orders from the chain of command.

The American Officer serving as chief liaison to the Russian military contacted his counterpart & said essentially, "Cut it out, move your guys back from the river, and we'll all pretend this never happened."

The Russian officer responded that no Russian troops were in the area.

This is technically true, since Wagner is the Academi/Blackwater of Russia.

You may remember them as the patchless plainclothes soldiers who invaded Eastern Ukraine.

Or from three days ago, when they pushed a journalist covering them out of a window.

The Russian Officer probably thought he was being funny. So the Americans decided to be funny too. They called in airstrikes on the mercenaries.

Massive. Airstrikes. I quote: "AC-130 gunships, F-15 fighter jets, MQ-9 Reapers, AH-64 Apache attack helicopters, B-52s, and an F-22."

For their part, the Marines nearby contributed support from an M142 HIMARS rapidly mobile multiple rocket launcher. picture

When the dust cleared, about 100 pro-Assad Syrian troops along with 200-300 Russian Wagner mercenaries were reduced to vapor. The overwhelming violence of a strike by that much firepower on a force numbering ~350 fighters was clearly to send a message to Wagner PMC.

Don't feel too badly for the Wagner mercenaries.

They signed up to kill for a dictator for money, fired on Americans and work for a company to seize oil fields from the Syrian Democratic Forces in exchange for 25% of the profit. AND Wagner is owned by a guy Bob Mueller indicted.

Read the varying countries' accounts here, Or watch Pompeo make an ass out of himself boasting about it here, Or see CNN's coverage for something close to the truth:

edited 18th Apr '18 7:07:15 PM by megaeliz

TheWildWestPyro from Seattle, WA Since: Sep, 2012 Relationship Status: Healthy, deeply-felt respect for this here Shotgun
#239291: Apr 18th 2018 at 6:50:10 PM

[up]

I did get a chuckle at all the firepower the US forces called up. Also, "and an F-22". I just imagine all the ordnance dropping, and the last bomb of the day is by a single jet casually swooping by and dropping its load.

edited 18th Apr '18 6:52:35 PM by TheWildWestPyro

DeMarquis (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#239292: Apr 18th 2018 at 6:53:57 PM

Well at least someone on our side knows how to send a message.

I'm done trying to sound smart. "Clear" is the new smart.
Fourthspartan56 from Georgia, US Since: Oct, 2016 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#239293: Apr 18th 2018 at 6:55:21 PM

Yeah that's hilarious, good for them.

"Einstein would turn over in his grave. Not only does God play dice, the dice are loaded." -Chairman Sheng-Ji Yang
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#239294: Apr 18th 2018 at 6:57:43 PM

Yeah, I'm not inclined to feel any sympathy for those mercs either.

Disgusted, but not surprised
TVRulezAgain Since: Sep, 2011
#239295: Apr 18th 2018 at 7:02:00 PM

So Mitch Mc Connell is looking to extend the Senate workweeks in order to prevent vulnerable Democratic senators from having time to campaign. Fucking slimeball.

BearyScary Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: You spin me right round, baby
#239296: Apr 18th 2018 at 7:09:13 PM

Can he actually do that?

Do not obey in advance.
Eschaton Since: Jul, 2010
#239297: Apr 18th 2018 at 7:16:02 PM

Among other attempts to erase US democracy, Arizona Republicans tried to rig the rules for replacing McCain.

If it had passed, the bill would have given Ducey the power to appoint a Mc Cain replacement through 2020 whether he leaves before or after the end of May.

But Democrats caught the change and raised the alarm, all but killing the effort since emergency clauses need two-thirds support and the party has 13 of the state senate’s 30 seats. Republicans responded by canceling plans to put the bill on the state Senate floor on Wednesday, delaying then canceling a vote.

In better news, Kris Koback was found in contempt of court in the Kansas voting rights trial.

megaeliz Since: Mar, 2017
#239298: Apr 18th 2018 at 7:18:19 PM

From Attorney General Schneiderman:

Long ago, SCOTUS made clear that presidents cannot pardon for state crimes—now it’s time for New York law to do the same.

No one accused of breaking NY’s laws should escape accountability merely because of a strategically timed presidential pardon. [1]

We are disturbed by reports that @POTUS is considering pardons of individuals who may have committed serious federal crimes—acts that may also violate NY law.

We must ensure that if any president issues such pardons, we can use NY’s laws to bring such individuals to justice. [2]

The full letter can be read here

edited 18th Apr '18 7:20:01 PM by megaeliz

RainehDaze Nero Fangirl (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Nero Fangirl
#239299: Apr 18th 2018 at 7:18:20 PM

How is it that almost the entirety of the elected Republican body simultaneously has this "win at all costs" mentality regardless of the consequences?

Rationalinsanity from Halifax, Canada Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
#239300: Apr 18th 2018 at 7:19:06 PM

Those kinds of things are usually prevented by democratic norms. So yes, a leading figure in a fundamentally authoritarian party would and probably could do that.

Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.

Total posts: 417,856
Top