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Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM

Raddishes Since: Dec, 2014 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
#187276: May 5th 2017 at 2:39:05 PM

Genuine question and not some dark thing: If the bill comes to pass and Trump gets one of the things that was on the bill, should that put him out of healthcare or he's safe from it?

Protagonist506 from Oregon Since: Dec, 2013 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
#187277: May 5th 2017 at 2:39:05 PM

I really doubt a very significant amount of Republicans disliked Obama specifically because he was black. The most common criticism I've heard of him is that he isn't patriotic enough.

(This isn't to say that there are none, but I think there's a severe overestimate of how much racism motivated opposition to Obama, and certain other Republican policies)

Leviticus 19:34
CaptainCapsase from Orbiting Sagittarius A* Since: Jan, 2015
#187278: May 5th 2017 at 2:40:30 PM

If it isn't the only Republican thick skinned enough to occasionally pop into the thread. I haven't seen you in a while.

LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#187279: May 5th 2017 at 2:41:48 PM

Racism was a very significant factor, but along with that I think things have just gotten to such a point that not allowing any Democrat to do anything has become a big point for a lot of Republicans, in and of itself.

Course, that's likely also linked to racism and sexism so...

edited 5th May '17 2:43:59 PM by LSBK

SeptimusHeap from Switzerland (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Mu
#187280: May 5th 2017 at 2:45:16 PM

@Protagonist: Maybe subconscious racism, which one does not notice? Not all bigotry is in the "I dislike X because of their skin colour" openly stated form.

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
TacticalFox88 from USA Since: Nov, 2010 Relationship Status: Dating the Doctor
#187281: May 5th 2017 at 2:51:11 PM

[up] and that's THE main hurdle in fixing systemic racism. We've condition the public (I.e white people) that the ONLY form of discrimination and racismis when you throw out slurs and dress like a Klan member.

In all other scenarios white moderates ALWAYS want to give other whites the benefit of the doubt

New Survey coming this weekend!
Silasw A procrastination in of itself from A handcart to hell (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
A procrastination in of itself
#187282: May 5th 2017 at 3:02:43 PM

The most common criticism I've heard of him is that he isn't patriotic enough.

Sure but that's demonstrably false, Obama was plenty patriotic, it's only with a incredibly warped view of what being patriotic means that a person can come to the conclusion that Obama was not patriotic.

Part of what makes people have such warped views of what standard Obama should be held to is racism, it's not that Obama wasn't patriotic, it's that he wasn't as patriotic as they felt a black man should be.

Oh and a few pages back someone asked about moves Trump was making that would hurt only GOP voters, are the cuts to rural radio and rural airports still planned? Because I'm totally for the Dems letting said things happen, like don't vote for them but there's no need to put in extra effort to stop such things, let some chickens come home to roast and make sure everyone knows who is to blame.

“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran
unknowing from somewhere.. Since: Mar, 2014
#187283: May 5th 2017 at 3:02:53 PM

Obama not Being patriótic enought is motivated by reason consider how EVERYTHING Obama did was treason for them while Trump is just him Being citizen.

"My Name is Bolt, Bolt Crank and I dont care if you believe or not"
Draghinazzo (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
#187284: May 5th 2017 at 3:11:43 PM

and that's THE main hurdle in fixing systemic racism. We've condition the public (I.e white people) that the ONLY form of discrimination and racismis when you throw out slurs and dress like a Klan member.

White people aren't the only ones who absorb that message, everyone does, they're just the ones most likely to not notice the double standards and priorities because they won't really experience systematic racial discrimination.

Also, I think in addition to being a black man a lot of the more fanatical republicans just hate democrats on principle alone.

edited 5th May '17 3:13:44 PM by Draghinazzo

LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#187285: May 5th 2017 at 3:12:47 PM

Anyway, to sum up my opinion on this "let chickens come home to roast" pitch that some people keep mentioning: if there's nothing to be done about it, okay then, just make sure the people actually know it was because of the Republicans.

But if the Democrats can stop them, they should, because helping people is supposed to be the entire point of being apart of the governing process, not just the people who vote for you. Just, again, make sure the people know who it is (i.e. Democrats) who is actually helping them.

Besides finding the idea morally repugnant, I just don't see it working anyhow.

edited 5th May '17 3:24:15 PM by LSBK

MadSkillz Destroyer of Worlds Since: Mar, 2013 Relationship Status: I only want you gone
Destroyer of Worlds
#187286: May 5th 2017 at 3:20:08 PM

I do think the racism is overestimated because if he was elected on their side, many of them would just love Obama.

I think extreme partisanship is just as big a factor as racism

I'm talking about the Republican leaders btw

edited 5th May '17 3:20:54 PM by MadSkillz

Draghinazzo (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
#187287: May 5th 2017 at 3:22:02 PM

That's sort of the thing with tribalism.

If you are a minority in the Republican group you can still be accepted and receive a modicum of respect as long as you adhere to the dogma and don't say anything to upset them.

The partisanship is a pretty big part of it as well, no doubt about that I think.

Silasw A procrastination in of itself from A handcart to hell (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
A procrastination in of itself
#187288: May 5th 2017 at 3:25:51 PM

[up]X3 Thing is we have to prioritise, there are a lot of people at risk right now and if the Dems prioritise rural Trump voters' radio stations over the real life or death threats to many Americans they don't be forgiven.

[up][up] Obama would never have been elected as a Republican though, Carson had to go full nutjob to even stand a chance and he didn't make it anywhere near close in the end.

“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran
LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#187289: May 5th 2017 at 3:26:34 PM

I feel like racism has been denied as issue for so long that at least concerning some discussions it's gotten to the point of assuming everything comes back to race.

Like, how apparently any criticism or qualm with the Democratic Party is now just pandering to working class white people. Because working-class white people are the only ones how have issues with the Democratic Party/think they're out of touch, right?

All complaints might not be equally valid, but you should at least acknowledge they have more than one source to sort out the invalid ones, instead of just assuming invalidity of all of them.

edited 5th May '17 3:28:14 PM by LSBK

CaptainCapsase from Orbiting Sagittarius A* Since: Jan, 2015
#187290: May 5th 2017 at 3:53:23 PM

My own gauging of things is that it's not simply working class whites who were getting fed up with the democrat's way of doing things, as much as that's used to deflect from very real shortcomings of the party. Despite being basically the most blatant expression in recent memory of the nativist inclinations of the GOP base, Trump still managed to improve over Romney and GWB in terms of his share of the minority vote, and had the Republican nominee been someone more respectable like Rubio, I think that share of the vote would have been even larger.

Eschaton Since: Jul, 2010
#187291: May 5th 2017 at 3:54:42 PM

Did that larger share come with larger numbers?

CaptainCapsase from Orbiting Sagittarius A* Since: Jan, 2015
#187292: May 5th 2017 at 3:59:55 PM

[up] It's difficult to tell because of factors like population growth and turnout affecting factors (and the difference being only a few percentage points), but IIRC in terms of absolute numbers it was slightly above Romney, despite initial reports to the contrary.

edited 5th May '17 4:03:31 PM by CaptainCapsase

Wryte Since: Jul, 2010
#187293: May 5th 2017 at 4:03:26 PM

Like, how apparently any criticism or qualm with the Democratic Party is now just pandering to working class white people. Because working-class white people are the only ones how have issues with the Democratic Party/think they're out of touch, right?

Well, it's not exactly a far leap when a lot of the people accusing the Democrats of being out of touch or elitists (at least those coming from the left) are also the people who keep harping on about the WWC and their dog whistles.

LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#187294: May 5th 2017 at 4:09:17 PM

[up]That sounds like a matter of weeding out the concern trolls, instead of just dismissing the issue as racist out of hand.

As with many things, a toxic element doesn't necessarily ruin things, as long as you can differentiate it from the rest.

edited 5th May '17 4:10:54 PM by LSBK

unknowing from somewhere.. Since: Mar, 2014
#187295: May 5th 2017 at 4:21:53 PM

we have to remenber the republican become more and more racist in the first term of Obama when compromise become anathema to them, just look the facts: they let the mayor birther(Donad trump) to become PRESIDENT, identity politics become part of both parties and is the reason of why republican have so little estandar for trump.

"My Name is Bolt, Bolt Crank and I dont care if you believe or not"
CenturyEye Tell Me, Have You Seen the Yellow Sign? from I don't know where the Yith sent me this time... Since: Jan, 2017 Relationship Status: Having tea with Cthulhu
Tell Me, Have You Seen the Yellow Sign?
#187296: May 5th 2017 at 4:40:02 PM

Well, they rallied after all: WSB poll: Handel has slight lead over Ossoff

Republican Karen Handel has built a slight lead over Democrat Jon Ossoff in a poll released Friday by WSB-TV in Georgia’s nationally-watched 6th District runoff.

The poll, conducted by Landmark Communications, has Handel with a 49-46.5 percent advantage over Ossoff. That’s within the 4 percent margin of error. Another 4.4 percent of voters are undecided.

Landmark Communications pollster Mark Rountree told WSB the findings shows Handel may be consolidating Republicans after bitter feuding between the 11 GOP candidates in the runup to the April 18 vote. It shows roughly 80 percent of Republicans back Handel.

“They’re now getting behind Handel in bigger numbers,” Rountree said of Republicans. “And she has now taken the lead in the race. It’s a small lead, but she has taken a small lead.”

There is cause for concern for Handel in the crosstabs, which show Ossoff has a 54-45 lead over Handel among female voters. It also finds that nearly 6 in 10 independents – a crucial voting bloc in Georgia that typically breaks for the GOP – backs Ossoff’s campaign.

The poll surveyed 611 likely voters in the district, which spans from east Cobb to north De Kalb, and it’s one of the first conducted since Handel and Ossoff landed in a June 20 runoff.

Read more about the poll here. See the crosstabs [in the article]


Not being a political analyst, idk if Ossoff should try to keep attracting anti-Trump and anti-Handel right-wingers or try to reach out to the unregistered voters that the court suddenly put into play. So, far I guess its just keep working...

Look with century eyes... With our backs to the arch And the wreck of our kind We will stare straight ahead For the rest of our lives
TacticalFox88 from USA Since: Nov, 2010 Relationship Status: Dating the Doctor
#187297: May 5th 2017 at 5:14:24 PM

Either way, this runoff is gonna be a nail-biter.

New Survey coming this weekend!
IFwanderer use political terms to describe, not insult from Earth Since: Aug, 2013 Relationship Status: Wishfully thinking
use political terms to describe, not insult
#187298: May 5th 2017 at 5:23:42 PM

At FDA, TVs now turned to Fox News and can't be switched. This is one of those things that are so petty, yet illustrate so clearly how tyrannic these people are.

1 2 We are what we pretend to be, so we must be careful about what we pretend to be. -KV
Zendervai Since: Oct, 2009
#187299: May 5th 2017 at 5:34:51 PM

"Carson had to go full nutjob". I'm pretty sure he isn't faking his craziness. He's always just close enough to an actual thing that you can usually tell what he's referring to, but there's almost always a really bad assumption in the mix that makes him miss his mark. That sort of thing is incredibly difficult to fake.

AngelusNox Warder of the damned from The guard of the gates of oblivion Since: Dec, 2014 Relationship Status: Married to the job
Warder of the damned
#187300: May 5th 2017 at 5:35:59 PM

Pathetic is the only word I can use to describe this.

Inter arma enim silent leges

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