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Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM

IFwanderer use political terms to describe, not insult from Earth Since: Aug, 2013 Relationship Status: Wishfully thinking
use political terms to describe, not insult
#184826: Apr 26th 2017 at 4:47:50 AM

OK, just read five very interesting articles:

1 2 We are what we pretend to be, so we must be careful about what we pretend to be. -KV
megaeliz Since: Mar, 2017
#184827: Apr 26th 2017 at 5:02:36 AM

Article 4: I've been saying this for a while. The exciting things are happening in the local Democratic Party, and grassroots organizing. It has given the the national Democratic Party an unprecedented advantage, and they're still scrambling to keep up.

edited 26th Apr '17 5:04:04 AM by megaeliz

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#184828: Apr 26th 2017 at 5:11:44 AM

[up][up]TBF, no one on this thread was being too hard on Mello. Some of us just don't think it's acceptable to call him a progressive. We all have different lines in the sand. What really irritated some of us was the fact that Sanders endorsed and called him a progressive while refusing to do the same for Ossof when asked about him. And no one here wanted to throw Mello under the bus — if he can win, then more power to him.

edited 26th Apr '17 5:12:39 AM by M84

Disgusted, but not surprised
TacticalFox88 from USA Since: Nov, 2010 Relationship Status: Dating the Doctor
#184829: Apr 26th 2017 at 5:15:26 AM

Lol we are seriously go all purity test on Obama for paid speeches?

Progressives can't do anything without tripping over their own dicks FFS.

edited 26th Apr '17 5:15:48 AM by TacticalFox88

New Survey coming this weekend!
sgamer82 Since: Jan, 2001
#184830: Apr 26th 2017 at 5:35:29 AM

[up][up][up][up] Is Missouri the state where the attorney general tried to conscript the governor into being a defense attorney because said governor's policies were leaving them without public defenders?

https://www.lgbtqnation.com/2017/04/north-carolina-governors-small-revenge-republican-legislators/

In North Carolina, a (Republican!) Judge resigned early, rather than at the approaching mandatory retirement age, to give governor Cooper a chance to fill the gap before the legislature could try to reduce the size of his particular court.

Is it racist to make a legitimate complaint against Obama? Is it sexist to make a legitimate complaint against Hillary?

Don't take money from Wall Street. It's simple.

People attack the Democratic Party as a whole for doing the same thing.

Can legitimate complaints have racist motives depending on who is saying it? Yes but that doesn't invalidate the criticism.

If I may, MadSkillz, my impression is that the problem you're encountering right now boils down to the idea that you're the only one in this room who thinks this is something to legitimately complain about.

To everyone else, it's capitalism at work, and capitalism that nobody gave much of a damn about until it became an issue for Clinton and, now apparently, Obama.

I personally also think that your trying to say "Bernie would get flak it he did it" argument is undercut by my assumption that you'd likely be defending Sanders from all our flak if he did. Which means we'd only have the exact same argument with the roles reversed.

edited 26th Apr '17 5:44:38 AM by sgamer82

math792d Since: Jun, 2011 Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#184831: Apr 26th 2017 at 5:56:07 AM

I mean, it's not necessaily that I applaud the decision. It's just A Thing That Happened.

And I fail to see the reason to get up in arms over it. The Young Turks are partially financed by a GOP millionaire, does that taint their image? note 

edited 26th Apr '17 5:56:25 AM by math792d

Still not embarrassing enough to stan billionaires or tech companies.
IFwanderer use political terms to describe, not insult from Earth Since: Aug, 2013 Relationship Status: Wishfully thinking
use political terms to describe, not insult
#184832: Apr 26th 2017 at 5:58:25 AM

[up]Well, it would explain why they're so adamant about purity testing Democrats.

1 2 We are what we pretend to be, so we must be careful about what we pretend to be. -KV
math792d Since: Jun, 2011 Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#184833: Apr 26th 2017 at 5:59:32 AM

People are perfectly capable of doing that without getting paid by the GOP.

Still not embarrassing enough to stan billionaires or tech companies.
IFwanderer use political terms to describe, not insult from Earth Since: Aug, 2013 Relationship Status: Wishfully thinking
use political terms to describe, not insult
#184834: Apr 26th 2017 at 6:10:06 AM

[up]I mean (and feel free to call me paranoid), if they are backed by a GOP millionaire I'm kind of doubting they're doing it out of genuine disagreement and not as a plant.

1 2 We are what we pretend to be, so we must be careful about what we pretend to be. -KV
fruitpork Since: Oct, 2010
#184835: Apr 26th 2017 at 6:25:51 AM

On the Obama speech thing: for Christ's sake, let him make money. Why the hell are we bitching about this?

Zendervai Since: Oct, 2009
#184836: Apr 26th 2017 at 6:36:18 AM

Apparently because there are people out there who think Wall Street is literally the worst thing ever and being associated with them at all is an unfathomable disaster.

Seriously though, Wall Street hires people all the time at high prices to give speeches, and usually the speeches don't really have much substance. If someone high profile is able to give a paid speech, Wall Street's probably going to get to them eventually. It's not worth freaking out about because it's a standard element of the business world. Like, the oil industry hires Republicans for speeches at events all the time. Wall Street just tends to hire people who are viewed as moderate and centrist.

I've said this before, but Wall Street isn't the enemy here. They're the neutral party that occasionally flip-flops on who they support, but they're important enough that no one wants to tick them off. Yes, they've done a lot of bad, but they're still one of the pillars of the American economy, like it or not. Be pragmatic about it, don't demand ideological purity over something that is honestly not worth the time.

edited 26th Apr '17 6:39:26 AM by Zendervai

Balmung Since: Oct, 2011
#184837: Apr 26th 2017 at 6:38:59 AM

The speeches thing is stupid because it's more or less pointless and the extent of Wall Street hate is stupid, in part because it enables anti-Semites (blaming bankers has long be a roundabout way to blame Jews), and in part because it distracts from so many other harmful industries, like the MIC, the prison-industrial complex, and the fossil fuel fuckers. Or Electronic Arts.

NativeJovian Jupiterian Local from Orlando, FL Since: Mar, 2014 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
Jupiterian Local
#184838: Apr 26th 2017 at 6:41:15 AM

If you're going to hold Hillary to those standards then it's fair all Democrats should be held to those standards.
On the flip side of that, if we didn't give Hillary shit for it, then giving Obama shit for it doesn't make sense either. That's the boat that most of us fall into.

Really from Jupiter, but not an alien.
sgamer82 Since: Jan, 2001
#184840: Apr 26th 2017 at 6:53:06 AM

[up][up]As I said in my earlier post, skimming the last few pages gave me the impression that MadSkillz is the only one who actually seems to care about it because "NOT-BERNIE BAD!"

edited 26th Apr '17 6:53:23 AM by sgamer82

Mio Since: Jan, 2001
#184841: Apr 26th 2017 at 6:54:46 AM

To be honest I don't think it's a good look for Obama either, and if I were in a position to advise him I'd probably tell him not to do it.

On the other hand this is a pretty standard thing for former Presidents and it's not as though he is ever going to run for public office again so I'm not really going to be to bent out of shape for him taking free money to say what he wants to a bunch of random rich people.

TacticalFox88 from USA Since: Nov, 2010 Relationship Status: Dating the Doctor
#184842: Apr 26th 2017 at 7:01:07 AM

I'm going to keep it real:

Obama owes this country jack and fucking shit.

He put his time in. He moved us forward. Got our reputation back on track after Bush overseas. Saved the auto industry. Got healthcare for millions. Moved the country into accepting gay marriage. Among other things. And did it while putting up with racist vitriol from the right.

And then that same country betrays him by electing the antithesis of him in LITERALLY every possible way.

Let that man get his paper. The country clearly didn't give a fuck about his legacy.

New Survey coming this weekend!
IFwanderer use political terms to describe, not insult from Earth Since: Aug, 2013 Relationship Status: Wishfully thinking
use political terms to describe, not insult
#184843: Apr 26th 2017 at 7:01:09 AM

[up][up]Agreed, bad optics is the worst I can say about this thing.

That aside, I was looking through the list of Real Life Never Live It Down examples and found this:

  • Despite his better track record with race issues since, Attorney General Jeff Sessions is never going to hear the end of some racist remarks that cost him a federal judgeship back in 1986. To put it in perspective, Axl Rose, who himself will never be able to live down the racist-at-first-glance lyrics in the second verse of "One in a Million" (mentioned on the Music subpage), criticized Donald Trump for making the appointment in the first place.

I'm pretty sure this statement is kind of, you know, whitewashing Sessions. Should it be cut or changed?

edited 26th Apr '17 7:01:57 AM by IFwanderer

1 2 We are what we pretend to be, so we must be careful about what we pretend to be. -KV
NativeJovian Jupiterian Local from Orlando, FL Since: Mar, 2014 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
Jupiterian Local
#184844: Apr 26th 2017 at 7:01:54 AM

The main difference between Mad Skillz and the rest of us — which we've covered before — is that he assumes money = influence and the rest of us don't. Just because a candidate has accepted money from something doesn't mean they're sellouts crafting policy for the highest bidder. This has, as far as I can tell, always been the primary disconnect between their position and ours.

Really from Jupiter, but not an alien.
Zendervai Since: Oct, 2009
#184845: Apr 26th 2017 at 7:16:21 AM

[up][up] I would say cut it. They're not the same situation at all, and it's a genuine worry with Sessions. The comparison is just odd.

edited 26th Apr '17 7:16:51 AM by Zendervai

NoName999 Since: May, 2011
#184846: Apr 26th 2017 at 7:17:02 AM

For fuck's sake, now people are giving Obama shit for being paid to give a speech to Wall Street?

When he gave a speech in a university for FREE? Hell, do you think Bernie Sanders isn't a millionaire as well? Or that Warren also doesn't have rich donors?

Fuck this purity shit. I'm now wishing that Bernie won the primary, the general, only for his diehard supporters to turn on him when they realize "Shit you mean, President != King?"

Also anyone mind telling me how Hillary giving a speech about open borders and creating a North American version of the EU, conservative?

[down]What does that have to do with anything I just said?

edited 26th Apr '17 7:34:22 AM by NoName999

megaeliz Since: Mar, 2017
#184847: Apr 26th 2017 at 7:21:20 AM

Nevermind misread

edited 26th Apr '17 7:35:45 AM by megaeliz

NoName999 Since: May, 2011
#184848: Apr 26th 2017 at 7:23:29 AM

[down][down]But a former President giving a speech somewhere and getting paid for his time is much worse!

(WTF why did you delete it)

edited 26th Apr '17 7:33:21 AM by NoName999

IFwanderer use political terms to describe, not insult from Earth Since: Aug, 2013 Relationship Status: Wishfully thinking
use political terms to describe, not insult
#184849: Apr 26th 2017 at 7:24:31 AM

[up][up][up][up]Done.

1 2 We are what we pretend to be, so we must be careful about what we pretend to be. -KV
megaeliz Since: Mar, 2017
#184850: Apr 26th 2017 at 7:29:29 AM

trump wants to kill energy star. Why? Perhaps because all of his properties recieve low energy star ratings.

https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2017/04/25/politics/donald-trump-energy-star-epa/index.html


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