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Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM

iflewaway someone from somewhere Since: Dec, 2016
someone
#171401: Jan 30th 2017 at 9:54:17 PM

edited 10th Oct '17 11:02:27 AM by iflewaway

something
TrashJack Confirmed Doomer from beyond the Despair Event Horizon (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Confirmed Doomer
#171402: Jan 30th 2017 at 9:54:29 PM

@Luigisan 98: I would like nothing better than to be wrong about this. If the personification of the fabric of reality broke into my house, punched me in the face, and showed me the truth of the universe that I was completely wrong about the nature of humanity, I'd be the happiest man alive.

I know that a lot of people are fighting against Trump's abhorrent agenda, just as so many fought against Hitler's, and the same for all the other dictators throughout history. And hell, maybe they'll win. If not, perhaps others will see their dream of freedom through, to make it into the reality we live in once more.

But at the same time, I also don't believe we'll ever truly wipe out the mind-plague of fascism, authoritarianism, and dictatorship from humanity. Eventually, these evils will return, and enough people will fall for it hook, line and sinker to make another wannabe supervillain a global threat yet again, just as they did with Hitler and all the other dictators throughout history.

edited 30th Jan '17 9:56:02 PM by TrashJack

"Cynic, n. — A blackguard whose faulty vision sees things as they are, not as they ought to be." - The Devil's Dictionary
Draghinazzo (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
#171403: Jan 30th 2017 at 9:54:47 PM

@Draghinazzo: Honestly, given the historical precedents and what's been going on lately, I'm inclined to believe that humanity, in general, is hard-wired to desire dictatorship and autocracy in bursts or cycles. Much as I hate to admit it, for a terrifying amount of people, Loki was right: we were made to be ruled.

To be honest I think you are at least partially right about this.

Our own Tobias Drake posted months ago about how America perpetuates the myth of the "great man", where history was shaped by exceptional (and depending on who you ask, god-appointed) men who had the vision and skill to stand above the rest and lead the world into progress, and everyone else working with or under them was just some mediocre, irrelevant nobody doing as they were told.

He wasn't wrong about that, but the thing is that practically all societies work this way. We have a natural tendency to put more trust in one person (as opposed to a group of several thousand people, like the government of most countries) as the virtuous hero fighting against a litany of petty, openly malevolent obstacles, and how if only those obstacles (see: checks and balances) were not in the way, the path to greatness would be open and everything would be fixed.

Except this isn't some two-bit superhero story where the hero will always remain virtuous in the face of danger and where he can be trusted with the power to save the world. We've seen time and time again that as much as people complain about how those things get in the way, people with no checks put on them will always oppress and consolidate their power, either seemingly for its own stake or some ideal (sometimes a nominally decent one, other times a morally repugnant one), while failing to make things better for the most part. Perhaps there are exceptions and examples where this didn't occur, but it's never worth the risk.

've lived amongst middle-class conservatives my entire life, and I can tell you why they voted for Trump despite obviously being a racist, incompetent, con-artist: Most of them are fucking morons. They don't want to grow, they don't want to learn, they don't want to hear anything that disagrees with them. Anything that makes them even slightly uncomfortable they instantly reject. That is why they refuse to see climate change, or evolution, or anything. It differs with their views, therefore it must be wrong.

Well, I believe the human brain is naturally hardwired to reject new information that contradicts with its paradigms. So in that regard I understand a certain reticence to go with stuff that contradicts what you believe to be true (often because it has been taught to you your whole life).

Unfortunately for everyone else, they happen to be wrong.

edited 30th Jan '17 9:56:55 PM by Draghinazzo

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#171404: Jan 30th 2017 at 9:56:40 PM

[up][up][up][up] Things only get better if people keep working for it. Being complacent means death.

Reminds me of the story of the old lady who refused to abandon her house even as a flood approached since she was confident God would save her. She waved off would be rescuers such as a raft, a boat, and a helicopter. When she drowned and ended up in the afterlife, she asked God why he let her die. God was confused since He sent her a raft, a boat, and a chopper.

edited 30th Jan '17 9:59:20 PM by M84

Disgusted, but not surprised
Luigisan98 A wandering user from Venezuelan Muscat Since: Oct, 2013 Relationship Status: I <3 love!
A wandering user
#171405: Jan 30th 2017 at 10:01:24 PM

[up][up][up] No, it's the truth.

And to rest of you, the world will still survive and become a better place, stop implementing things like that we are programmed for something that is in our genes, that's a very pessimistic remark of all of us, we are Humans BY choice and there's no way you can assume that a brain fodder brain for certain events to happen, maybe you don't see the big picture of hope that rotates the world and always ensure that Humanity goes through in the end no matter what.

The only good fanboy, is a redeemed fanboy.
CrimsonZephyr Would that it were so simple. from Massachusetts Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
Would that it were so simple.
#171406: Jan 30th 2017 at 10:01:47 PM

The worst thing we can do is say "America is better than this."

We're not. We've already proven that. If we were better, Trump would never have become president.

"For all those whose cares have been our concern, the work goes on, the cause endures, the hope still lives, and the dream shall never die."
iflewaway someone from somewhere Since: Dec, 2016
someone
#171407: Jan 30th 2017 at 10:03:32 PM

edited 10th Oct '17 11:02:36 AM by iflewaway

something
Luigisan98 A wandering user from Venezuelan Muscat Since: Oct, 2013 Relationship Status: I <3 love!
A wandering user
#171408: Jan 30th 2017 at 10:04:02 PM

[up] That's what I meant.

The only good fanboy, is a redeemed fanboy.
iflewaway someone from somewhere Since: Dec, 2016
someone
#171409: Jan 30th 2017 at 10:06:13 PM

[up] I think you misunderstood my quote.

edited 30th Jan '17 10:06:40 PM by iflewaway

something
Ludlow Since: Apr, 2013
#171410: Jan 30th 2017 at 10:07:38 PM

I wonder if our conservative fathers would turn on us if Trump begins to slowly marginalize and outlaw the opposition. If they're so delusional now, why wouldn't they do their national duty and turn us into the authorities. Hell, they wouldn't even have to do that, so many of us young liberals are tied to our parents' purse strings, all they would have to do threaten to throw us out or otherwise no longer support us, and we'd be forced into silence out of fear of poverty.

Perseus Since: Nov, 2009
#171411: Jan 30th 2017 at 10:08:29 PM

You know, browbeating people for not sharing your optimism doesn't do any good for anyone.

unknowing from somewhere.. Since: Mar, 2014
#171412: Jan 30th 2017 at 10:10:17 PM

If something you have show a better resistence that us venezuelan, in only what, ten days and you already show him hell, and while is little im proud of you US, you know well to hold on and resist.

"My Name is Bolt, Bolt Crank and I dont care if you believe or not"
Luigisan98 A wandering user from Venezuelan Muscat Since: Oct, 2013 Relationship Status: I <3 love!
A wandering user
#171413: Jan 30th 2017 at 10:10:27 PM

[up][up] Sorry...it's just that pessimism clouds the minds worse than blind optimism...

[up][up][up] I meant the one of the old lady story.

edited 30th Jan '17 10:10:48 PM by Luigisan98

The only good fanboy, is a redeemed fanboy.
Draghinazzo (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
#171414: Jan 30th 2017 at 10:10:33 PM

The worst thing we can do is say "America is better than this." We're not. We've already proven that. If we were better, Trump would never have become president.

This is at least part of the problem, yes.

America isn't some special place chosen by God free from the problems of other nations. That sort of american exceptionalism leads people to ignoring or downplaying America's crimes and mistakes (slavery, the massacre of the indigenous population, helping to install heinously cruel and oppressive military dictatorships to preserve their geopolitical and economic interests, etc). It creates an extremely banal and frankly dangerous form of patriotism, one without any self-awareness or criticism where anything America does is great because America did it, rather than America being great because of what it does and that if it does not comply with that, it cannot be considered so.

I am sure that the idea that Trump would be held back because "it can't happen here" occurred to at least some of his voterbase. As if there were some nebulous and immaterial force preventing him from being exactly the kind of petty and vindictive Caligula he had every intention of being.

edited 30th Jan '17 10:14:02 PM by Draghinazzo

iflewaway someone from somewhere Since: Dec, 2016
Perseus Since: Nov, 2009
#171416: Jan 30th 2017 at 10:11:22 PM

[up][up][up] That's very arguable.

edited 30th Jan '17 10:11:33 PM by Perseus

fruitpork Since: Oct, 2010
#171417: Jan 30th 2017 at 10:15:50 PM

a rather interesting if frightening article. Putin is basically a virus, mutating other countries into kleptocracies like Russia. It's the 21st century version of the dictatorships of yesteryear.

Eschaton Since: Jul, 2010
#171418: Jan 30th 2017 at 10:16:08 PM

I wonder if our conservative fathers would turn on us if Trump begins to slowly marginalize and outlaw the opposition. If they're so delusional now, why wouldn't they do their national duty and turn us into the authorities. Hell, they wouldn't even have to do that, so many of us young liberals are tied to our parents' purse strings, all they would have to do threaten to throw us out or otherwise no longer support us, and we'd be forced into silence out of fear of poverty.
Something like that would likely depend on the individual and the locale. But my guess is that you're more likely to see apathy and cynicism from older generations.

I'd say there's more reason to fear persecution from your reactionary peers, the ones who've bought into the altright nonsense and become power-tripping nazi fanboys.

LinkToTheFuture A real bad hombre from somewhere completely different Since: Apr, 2015 Relationship Status: What's love got to do with it?
A real bad hombre
#171419: Jan 30th 2017 at 10:17:47 PM

[up][up]I think that article's been linked already

edited 30th Jan '17 10:18:01 PM by LinkToTheFuture

"I have not failed. I've just found 10,000 ways that won't work." -Thomas Edison
TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#171420: Jan 30th 2017 at 10:18:02 PM

TBH, I think in this day and age a lot of people would welcome joining the Qun.

Nah. The Qun doesn't let you hate brown people if they, too, join the Qun. That would be a dealbreaker for a lot of folks.

edited 30th Jan '17 10:18:24 PM by TobiasDrake

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
Ludlow Since: Apr, 2013
#171421: Jan 30th 2017 at 10:18:52 PM

[up][up][up] Oh, thats great, so there really is no escape.

I'm just going to go ahead, unplug my laptop, and spend the rest of my life huddling in the corner of my room and pretend absolutely nothing bad is happening.

edited 30th Jan '17 10:19:12 PM by Ludlow

Luigisan98 A wandering user from Venezuelan Muscat Since: Oct, 2013 Relationship Status: I <3 love!
A wandering user
#171422: Jan 30th 2017 at 10:22:40 PM

[up] Don't, resist against anything evil.

The only good fanboy, is a redeemed fanboy.
LinkToTheFuture A real bad hombre from somewhere completely different Since: Apr, 2015 Relationship Status: What's love got to do with it?
A real bad hombre
#171423: Jan 30th 2017 at 10:23:01 PM

As a member of the Coastal Liberal Elite(TM), I can't believe our evil reign is about to finished.

In all seriousness, I am scared as to what the next four years hold, even if I am comparatively really low on the enemies list.

"I have not failed. I've just found 10,000 ways that won't work." -Thomas Edison
tclittle Professional Forum Ninja from Somewhere Down in Texas Since: Apr, 2010
Professional Forum Ninja
#171424: Jan 30th 2017 at 10:25:47 PM

Trump said he is not going to overturn Obama's 2014 EO on LGBT workplace rights.

    Article 
The White House said on Monday that President Trump would leave in place a 2014 Obama administration order that created new workplace protections for gay, lesbian, bisexual and transgender people.

In a statement issued in response to growing questions about whether Mr. Trump would reverse the Obama order, the White House said the president was proud to embrace gay rights.

“President Trump continues to be respectful and supportive of L.G.B.T.Q. rights, just as he was throughout the election,” the statement said. “The president is proud to have been the first ever G.O.P. nominee to mention the L.G.B.T.Q. community in his nomination acceptance speech, pledging then to protect the community from violence and oppression.”

The decision to keep the order, the statement added, was Mr. Trump’s. It uses stronger language than any Republican president has before in favor of equal legal protections for gay, lesbian, bisexual and transgender people, though that is not likely to quiet Mr. Trump’s critics on the left. Get the Morning Briefing by Email

The move could also anger conservatives who had hoped a Republican president would end some socially liberal policies.

While Mr. Trump remains opposed to the right of same-sex couples to marry, he has been more open to it than many in his party. But there could be another political cost to his decision: On the eve of the announcement of his pick to fill the vacant seat on the Supreme Court, it could reopen the divisive debate over same-sex marriage and transgender rights, and subject his nominee to more scrutiny over his or her views on those issues.

The Obama order banned companies that do federal work from discriminating against gay, lesbian, bisexual and transgender employees. It was the first time the government explicitly protected federal workers from discrimination based on gender identity.

Leaving those protections, of course, does not preclude another executive order that would roll back gay rights in other areas. Mr. Trump could, for example, still enshrine a religious freedom provision in federal policy.

Gay rights advocates seemed unimpressed. Chad Griffin, president of the Human Rights Campaign, said Mr. Trump was setting a low bar by claiming credit for not overturning the actions of his predecessor.

“L.G.B.T.Q. refugees, immigrants, Muslims and women are scared today, and with good reason,” Mr. Griffin said. “Donald Trump has done nothing but undermine equality since he set foot in the White House.”

If the rumors about an incoming anti-LGBT EO are true, than this is to soften the blow.

"We're all paper, we're all scissors, we're all fightin' with our mirrors, scared we'll never find somebody to love."
Eschaton Since: Jul, 2010
#171425: Jan 30th 2017 at 10:26:11 PM

[up][up][up][up]Well, if you personally know any nazis and interact with them closely on daily basis, then yes, maybe you should keep your head down.

If not, take a deep breath.

edited 30th Jan '17 10:26:27 PM by Eschaton


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