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Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM
Psht, I'm not talking pessimism. I'm talking pragmatism. Yes, there's still hope, of course there is, but it's extremely dangerous to just assume that means things will work out for the best.
Also, 'something like [X] could never happen in the US' is quite possibly the worst attitude you can take with this. People said the same thing about Nazis taking over the White House, and look where we are.
Yep. Most of this is new for the US, but other countries which have gone through authoritarian regimes already know how it goes. That's why this is so chilling, because some countries have yet to get out of those regimes, or at best alternate between authoritarianism and brief periods of democracy (which is what happened in my country, and wouldn't you know it someone even worse than Trump has all the momentum for the 2018 elections).
Like, there's no point beating around the bush anymore. For all intents and purposes, Trump's government is already fascist in any meaningful sense of the word, we're just not at the level of say nazi germany quite yet.
edited 30th Jan '17 12:36:07 AM by Draghinazzo
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That's what I was trying to say, just as Rogue One said: "Rebellions are built on hope."
Hope is vital for us all, I know how bad things are looking but that doesn't mean I must think it will mean a bleak and hopeless future for us all, there's always the way to push forward for a better tomorrow.
The only good fanboy, is a redeemed fanboy.I'm thinking of all the Trump supporters that literally sieg heiled him a while back.
The guy that got punched after being caught sieg heiling Trump on camera.
Yeah, I was aware, sorry.
Sorry if I was too harsh, but.
Nazis exist and their voices are being heard and they feel represented, and based on Bannon they seem to be (alt)right about that.
edited 30th Jan '17 1:04:40 AM by unnoun
My question is, if Tianneman Square is in our future, is there any way to escape. Its seems like every time something positive happens we later learn that its simply a part of Trump's larger plan. It seems like the only way for this madness to end is through civil war, and since the right-wing controls the army and all of the heavily armed civilian militias I doubt that we'd win any civil war.
I don't want to live in a country like this, I don't want to live in a country ruled by an autocrat who uses his near unlimited power to oppress the poor, weak, and marginalized. I don't want to live in a nation where birth control is banned. But I also don't want to die, especially since it seems that my sacrifice would be meaningless. I just want to escape, I want so badly to escape.
I mean.
I feel like the Silicon Valley tech companies and also the state of California could probably bankroll a pretty bitchin' army just in terms of money.
Take a while though probably. Too long.
In terms of cyberwarfare they could probably cripple the U.S. and the stock market until their demands were met.
edited 30th Jan '17 1:00:03 AM by unnoun
The neo-nazis ARE being represented, there's no real question about that. The muslim ban is a really obvious xenophobic and racist measure, cloaking it in facile excuses like "america first" and "safety" doesn't change that. It's possible to revamp or talk about immigration without being malevolent, but this is very transparently not it. It is the very definition of a reactionary measure, and by that I mean that it was sloppily put together as quickly as possible to assert Trumpistan's status quo.
edited 30th Jan '17 1:06:34 AM by Draghinazzo
The thing you guys are missing is that while neither the courts nor Congress have a military with which to stop Trump the states kinda do.
If Trump tries to pull a Tiananmen Square in a Dem state he may well end up having the army troops he orders in face down against national guard regiments mobilised by the governor of the state.
Now obviously this means he can crush dissent more easily in Republican lead states but that may well cause a population drain, as people flee said states to escape the firing squads.
Also the military's loyalty to Trump over the constitution is highly questionable. The troops like him enough to vote for him, that's not the same as enough to gun down their countrymen for him. The officer class don't even like him enough to vote for him, nevermind enough to order their troops to shoot civilians.
Finally Trump is already driving the military away from him, kicking the chairmen of the joint chiefs off the national security council will not have made Trump any friends.
edited 30th Jan '17 1:06:45 AM by Silasw
“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ CyranI know most of the experienced officers defected.
The South had and still has today a strong military culture.
In today's world:
44% of all military recruits come from the South. Mostly Republican states.
20 % come from the Mid-West. Mostly Republican states.
16% come from the Pacific states. All Democrat states. (11% comes from California which is the state that puts the most people in the military)
3.6% come from New England.
10.1% come from the Middle Atlantic (New York, Pennsylvania and New Jersey)
And the 7.5 % come from the Mountain Division (New Mexico, Colorado, Arizona, Utah, Nevada, Idaho, Montana and Wyoming) Only 3 of these states are Democrat. 4 are Republican.
https://www.scribd.com/mobile/doc/234387674/State-Enlistments?skip_app_promo=true
edited 30th Jan '17 1:33:27 AM by MadSkillz
I'd have to search for it but I know 30 % of the military are minorities.
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edited 30th Jan '17 1:56:10 AM by MadSkillz
Yeah where one comes from only matters if Trump tries to order troops to shoot civilians, as they won't shoot folks from their own region even if they would shoot civilians in general. That might well stop Trump from going authoritarian nutjob on protests in the South and Mid-East, which leaves him with the North-East, West Coast and New England, all areas where he could end up with Democratic governors sending in their state's national guard units to oppose a Trump ordered murder of civilians.
“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran

Well, pessimism is far worse, it causes to lose all hope and even the feeling for a better tomorrow and see the bright side of things to come with people who are willing to the right thing, Hope never disappear and never will and you shouldn't assume the worst of the worst always.
The only good fanboy, is a redeemed fanboy.