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Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM

sgamer82 Since: Jan, 2001
#166476: Jan 13th 2017 at 8:35:11 AM

"Trump scorns probe into FBI pre-election handling of Clinton emails" - http://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-election-clinton-idUSKBN14X1FZ

Of course he does

edited 13th Jan '17 8:35:18 AM by sgamer82

RBluefish Since: Nov, 2013
#166477: Jan 13th 2017 at 8:47:31 AM

The head of the DC National Guard is to be removed from command at literally the exact moment Trump is sworn into office. Even he doesn't know why.

That's...weird. And somehow sinister.

"We'll take the next chance, and the next, until we win, or the chances are spent."
BrainSewage from that one place Since: Jan, 2001
#166478: Jan 13th 2017 at 8:51:34 AM

[up]x8: Nah, they'll probably just blame Obama. Their infantile minds can twist literally every misfortune to confirm their misconceptions.

How dare you disrupt the sanctity of my soliloquy?
speedyboris Since: Feb, 2010
#166479: Jan 13th 2017 at 9:06:13 AM

[up]x2 MINUTE ONE.

edited 13th Jan '17 9:06:24 AM by speedyboris

RBluefish Since: Nov, 2013
#166480: Jan 13th 2017 at 9:08:32 AM

Seriously. I'm trying to think of a non-sinister motivation for that, for timing that immediate, and...I can't really come up with anything.

I'm seeing people wonder if it's because he has something planned for the protestors. And he knows the current head of the DC National Guard won't go along with it.

Jesus Christ, I really wish this sounded implausible.

"We'll take the next chance, and the next, until we win, or the chances are spent."
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#166481: Jan 13th 2017 at 9:16:08 AM

[up] I'm hoping it's something petty and stupid like Trump doesn't like the guy's look or something. Kind of like how he rejected Bolton for Secretary of State because he didn't like Bolton's mustache.

edited 13th Jan '17 9:17:54 AM by M84

Disgusted, but not surprised
RBluefish Since: Nov, 2013
#166482: Jan 13th 2017 at 9:17:30 AM

Wow. The House just had its briefing with Comey. And it sounds like the House Dems are livid.

"I was non-judgmental until the last 15 minutes. I no longer have that confidence in him," Rep. Tim Walz (D-Minn.), ranking member of the Veterans Affairs Committee, said as he left the meeting in the Capitol.

"Some of the things that were revealed in this classified briefing - my confidence has been shook."

Rep. Elijah Cummings (Md.), senior Democrat on the House Oversight and Government Reform Committee, delivered a similar condemnation.

"I'm extremely concerned - extremely," he said.

"I'll just - I'm very angry," echoed Rep. Mark Takano (D-Calif.).

[...]

"I want to [have faith in Comey]," said a visibly annoyed Rep. Charlie Crist (D-Fla.). "I have concerns. Stay tuned."

Yet there's also a powerful sense among the Democrats that, while their faith in Comey has plummeted, they'd rather have him atop the FBI than roll and dice to see who Trump would tap as a replacement.

"Do I have confidence in him? Not really. But I think he's probably going to be better than the guy they'd put in," said one Democrat, who spoke only anonymously to discuss a sensitive topic. "It's like a rock and a hard place, but I think that's pretty much where a lot of people are."

Walz, for one, is not in that place.

"I'm disappointed, outraged - many of us are right now," Walz said. "I'll wait to pass full judgment, but the exchange that just happened in the final 15 minutes gives me no reason to have confidence."

The question burning in my mind right now is - did they actually find out about something completely new? Or did they just get confirmation of something that the rest of us have suspected/known for months?

edited 13th Jan '17 9:33:42 AM by RBluefish

"We'll take the next chance, and the next, until we win, or the chances are spent."
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#166483: Jan 13th 2017 at 9:19:26 AM

[up] Knowing Trump, he'd probably replace Comey with someone who is mysteriously more fluent in Russian than English and has a thick Russian accent who keeps talking about a moose and squirrel.

edited 13th Jan '17 9:20:00 AM by M84

Disgusted, but not surprised
DingoWalley1 Asgore Adopts Noelle Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: Can't buy me love
Asgore Adopts Noelle
#166484: Jan 13th 2017 at 9:22:56 AM

[up][up] I don't know what's in that report that made Democrats so angry, but that fills me with fear. I'd be full of more fear if we start getting Republicans saying stuff like that.

[down] Which is why, if the Republicans in Congress started saying "We're Mad and Angry at the last 15 minutes of this Briefing", I'd be full of more fear. The Republicans think everything is fine and dandy. What if the Report made them get mad?!

edited 13th Jan '17 9:29:47 AM by DingoWalley1

RBluefish Since: Nov, 2013
#166485: Jan 13th 2017 at 9:24:13 AM

See, I'm more scared this way. Because as it stands, the Democrats are furious and terrified. And the Republicans think everything is great.

And that is very bad.

"We'll take the next chance, and the next, until we win, or the chances are spent."
sgamer82 Since: Jan, 2001
#166486: Jan 13th 2017 at 9:32:33 AM

That link about the Dems and Comey is going to the one about the National Guard leader.

RBluefish Since: Nov, 2013
#166487: Jan 13th 2017 at 9:34:01 AM

Oh, sorry. Fixed the link, and reposted here for good measure.

"We'll take the next chance, and the next, until we win, or the chances are spent."
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#166488: Jan 13th 2017 at 9:35:05 AM

[up][up][up] Even if some GOP House members were as angry as the Democratic ones, they're not gonna admit it.

edited 13th Jan '17 9:35:16 AM by M84

Disgusted, but not surprised
Draghinazzo (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
#166489: Jan 13th 2017 at 9:41:04 AM

I wouldn't discount the possibility of chunks of his base breaking away once they start to see what a disaster he is, but that would be at least partially contingent on that information ever reaching their ears. So long as the bulk of his supporters keep getting their news from Fox or Breitbart, they'll stay in their bubbles.

Well, you can only spin facts around so much. If enough of the damage that Trump's government does is visible and tangible to the average american some of them will start to smell something funny going on. If the media's telling you everything's great while and you everyone else you know is in the toilet you're going to get bitter and resentful. The people at Carrier are eventually gonna realize they've been duped if they haven't already.

I think it's important to treat both sides with respect. Yes, they elected someone awful, but calling them anything other than a viewpoint is going to give them more ammunition for the "You are why Hillary lost" argument. We shouldn't sink to their level. Respectful discourse.

I agree that productive discourse should be respectful, but I also think that it's important to be intellectually honest about people and the implications of what they say and do, even if those things are unpleasant. A lot of the subtext (and actual text) of the trump campaign has...pretty unfortunate implications. Simply ignoring that isn't correct either because it allows those elements to go unchallenged, and if certain people object to that no matter how politely and respectfully it's explained (as often is the case), then there's nothing you can really do because not saying anything is worse.

Also, depending on the person, a respectful debate might not be possible anyways. A lot of Trump supporters on the internet are pretty unpleasant, disrespectful people and it's hard to have a civilized conversation with someone who calls you a "cuck" when you imply that America might have race problems, or someone who thinks america is full of "n*gger lovers".

I have no issues having a polite conversation with a trump supporter or whoever without insulting them, provided the person is being polite and respectful in kind, but on the internet whether you'll get that or not is a dice roll.

edited 13th Jan '17 9:43:44 AM by Draghinazzo

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#166490: Jan 13th 2017 at 9:43:46 AM

[up] In general, you'll have better luck having a civil conversation with a Trump supporter in person than online.

At the very least, they probably won't have the guts to call you a "cuck" to your face.

edited 13th Jan '17 9:44:54 AM by M84

Disgusted, but not surprised
CaptainCapsase from Orbiting Sagittarius A* Since: Jan, 2015
#166491: Jan 13th 2017 at 9:45:47 AM

As far as the confirmation hearings go, comparatively Mattis and Tillerson seem to be the Only Sane Men of the Trump cabinet. They're certainly grounded compared to Michael "MY PRECIOUS BODILY FLUIDS!" Flynn and Ben "the pyramids were used for grain storage" Carson.

edited 13th Jan '17 9:47:26 AM by CaptainCapsase

Rationalinsanity from Halifax, Canada Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
#166492: Jan 13th 2017 at 9:46:27 AM

According to reports, most Trump supporters (the aggressively violent ones aside) are rather avoidant and shy when encountered in person.

Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.
RBluefish Since: Nov, 2013
#166493: Jan 13th 2017 at 9:48:21 AM

[up][up] Tillerson refused to call Putin a war criminal and is posed to do irreparable damage to the planet. Don't let him fool you.

"We'll take the next chance, and the next, until we win, or the chances are spent."
DingoWalley1 Asgore Adopts Noelle Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: Can't buy me love
Asgore Adopts Noelle
#166494: Jan 13th 2017 at 9:48:51 AM

[up][up][up] Tillerson is troubling to me: He's one of the most Liberal Cabinet Picks Trump has (supporting Common Core and Immigration Reform), but also either ignoring or downplaying Putin's atrocities in Russia and through out the world. I honestly don't know if I can support the guy, and I honestly think he's going to be one of the few picks to not get their job (perhaps even the only one).

edited 13th Jan '17 9:49:04 AM by DingoWalley1

CaptainCapsase from Orbiting Sagittarius A* Since: Jan, 2015
#166495: Jan 13th 2017 at 9:50:34 AM

[up][up] The climate change stance comes with the Republican party. As far as Putin goes, if I were being appointed top diplomat in an administration seeking a new detente with Russia (best interpretation of the Trump administration), I would be careful with my words to avoid poisoning the well. What he described regarding Russia is basically a fairly standard realist approach, which given the success of realist foreign policy in lowering tensions with the Soviet Union in the past, is worth a shot.

Don't get me wrong, he's far, far from ideal, particularly because of the Hawkishness towards China, but the current tensions with Russia are probably the single most dangerous flashpoint in the world.

[up] He's been recommended by Henry Kissinger, Colin Powell, and Dick Cheney. The chances of him not getting through are slim to none based on that patronage alone.

edited 13th Jan '17 9:54:15 AM by CaptainCapsase

RBluefish Since: Nov, 2013
#166496: Jan 13th 2017 at 9:53:46 AM

If I were going to be Secretary of State for what is supposedly a moral country, I would condemn someone who murders thousands of journalists and political dissidents. Why on Earth are we giving Trump's administration the benefit of the doubt?

And saying that climate change denial just comes with the GOP is like saying that severe internal bleeding just comes with the car crash. It doesn't mean we should even think about accepting it.

"We'll take the next chance, and the next, until we win, or the chances are spent."
CaptainCapsase from Orbiting Sagittarius A* Since: Jan, 2015
#166497: Jan 13th 2017 at 9:54:53 AM
Thumped: Wow. That was rude. Too many of this kind of thump will bring a suspension. Please keep it civil.
RBluefish Since: Nov, 2013
#166498: Jan 13th 2017 at 9:58:10 AM

Ideally, that would involve getting a doctor who's going to treat the injuries, not look at them and go "no, this is normal."

I'm going to stop torturing this metaphor before I violate the Geneva Convention, Point is, Tillerson is an Exxon executive, has refused to condemn Putin's monstrous crimes (he has an Order of Friendship from Moscow, for God's sake), and is posed to do catastrophic harm to the planet. He cannot be Secretary of State.

"We'll take the next chance, and the next, until we win, or the chances are spent."
CaptainCapsase from Orbiting Sagittarius A* Since: Jan, 2015
#166499: Jan 13th 2017 at 9:59:08 AM

[up] I would focus political capital on stopping Sessions above any other Trump appointee, and as far as refusing to condemn human rights violations goes, well that's par and parcel with the kind of Realpolitik his sponsor Kissinger advocated for;

“The emigration of Jews from the Soviet Union is not an objective of American foreign policy. And if they put Jews into gas chambers in the Soviet Union, it is not an American concern. Maybe a humanitarian concern.”

edited 13th Jan '17 10:00:30 AM by CaptainCapsase

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#166500: Jan 13th 2017 at 10:00:33 AM

What really strikes me as just a bit odd is the way Tillerson criticized China's South Sea island bullshit by comparing it to Russia invading Crimea.

Far as the "Mad Dog" goes...I'm just glad Trump was put off by Bolton's 'stache. Bolton + Mattis + Flynn = near certain war with Iran. With just Mattis and Flynn there's still a chance we won't rip up the Nuclear Deal.

edited 13th Jan '17 10:03:56 AM by M84

Disgusted, but not surprised

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