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Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM

JulianLapostat Since: Feb, 2014
#158876: Nov 27th 2016 at 3:35:53 PM

Article by New Yorker:

As we rode toward the airport, Obama talked about Trump. “We’ve seen this coming,” he said. “ Donald Trump is not an outlier; he is a culmination, a logical conclusion of the rhetoric and tactics of the Republican Party for the past ten, fifteen, twenty years. What surprised me was the degree to which those tactics and rhetoric completely jumped the rails. There were no governing principles, there was no one to say, ‘No, this is going too far, this isn’t what we stand for.’ But we’ve seen it for eight years, even with reasonable people like John Boehner, who, when push came to shove, wouldn’t push back against these currents.”

I asked about Trump’s capacity to eliminate serially a long string of Republican contenders. “Donald Trump beating fifteen people said less about his skills and more about the lack of skills of the people he beat,” Obama said. “But, obviously, he tapped into something. He’s able to distill the anger and resentment and the sense of aggrievement. And he is skillful at challenging the conventions in a way that makes people feel something and that gives them some satisfaction.”

TheHandle United Earth from Stockholm Since: Jan, 2012 Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
United Earth
#158877: Nov 27th 2016 at 3:39:14 PM

I'm still waiting for Obama to get really real.

Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that.
Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#158878: Nov 27th 2016 at 3:47:39 PM

You'll be waiting a long time then

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
JulianLapostat Since: Feb, 2014
#158879: Nov 27th 2016 at 3:50:21 PM

I don't think Obama can ever be "really" real...but he's pretty forthright:

“I think that the President-elect has shown himself to be able to make a connection with his supporters that gives him much more flexibility than the normal candidate to take a variety of approaches,” he said. “ They seem to trust him, separate and apart from any particular thing that he says or does. And, as a consequence, I think we have to wait and see how, in the face of the realities of governance, he reacts to it. Another way of putting this is that what has been true for some time is that if I proposed something that was literally word for word in the Republican Party platform, it would be immediately opposed by eighty to ninety per cent of the Republican voters. And the reason is not that they’ve evaluated what I said. It’s that I said it. Well, the reverse then becomes true.”

JulianLapostat Since: Feb, 2014
#158880: Nov 27th 2016 at 3:52:32 PM

More

“They know there are lobbyists, special interests, gridlock; that the powerful have more influence and access than they do. And if things aren’t working, if there’s gridlock, then the only guy that they actually know is supposed to be in charge and supposed to be helping them is the President. And so the very deliberate strategy that Mitch Mc Connell and the Republican Party generally employed during the course of my Presidency was effective. What they understood was that, if you embraced old-fashioned dealing, trading, horse-trading, bipartisan achievement, people feel better. And, if people feel better, then they feel better about the President’s party, and the President’s party continues. And, if it feels broken, stuck, and everybody is angry, then that hurts the President or the President’s party'.”

PotatoesRock Since: Oct, 2012
#158881: Nov 27th 2016 at 3:56:39 PM

Again, Obama's said he plans to get more active and unrestrained after he's left office. So probably wait for February 2017, at the earliest.

Shippudentimes Since: Dec, 2012
#158882: Nov 27th 2016 at 3:57:34 PM

Despite no evidence, Trump claims millions voted illegally.

What.

WHAT.

WHAT.

'WHAT!

As much as I disagree with the results, he WON, didn't he? Why's he complaining about this NOW?

edited 28th Nov '16 5:18:57 AM by Shippudentimes

TheHandle United Earth from Stockholm Since: Jan, 2012 Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
United Earth
#158883: Nov 27th 2016 at 3:58:02 PM

Such a class act, this man. We could all stand to learn from him.

Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that.
RedSavant Since: Jan, 2001
#158884: Nov 27th 2016 at 4:00:17 PM

Laying the groundwork for truthiness about how Hillary's popular vote lead is a lie and/or made up and/or illegal and/or thanks to Mexicans.

It's been fun.
Draghinazzo (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
#158885: Nov 27th 2016 at 4:09:19 PM

Yep. His base doesn't care about facts, only what he makes them feel. If they cared about facts they'd have seen through his snake oil right away. Or in the case of white supremacists, it didn't really matter either way, so long as their hatred could be validated.

edited 27th Nov '16 4:09:46 PM by Draghinazzo

PotatoesRock Since: Oct, 2012
#158886: Nov 27th 2016 at 4:11:12 PM

It goes back to what was mentioned yesterday:

Trump's basically perpetually butthurt he's rejected by every group he seeks affection and praise from.

The rich think he's too much of a schlub.

New Yorkers hate him.

Scots reject his Scottishness.

Now he's butthurt a majority of voters rejected him and he only won due to a technicality of the system.

kkhohoho (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#158887: Nov 27th 2016 at 4:12:52 PM

History is written by the winners, and as far as Trump's concerned, he's the most bigly winner of them all. In Trump's new history book, Crooked Hilary was a dirty rotten liar who should have been arrested ages ago, Obama is a Muslim double agent who has been secretly working to destroy America from within, and every single person in America who didn't send in an illegal vote voted for their glorious Supreme Leader Trump. Now, if Trump were actually intelligent, I'd say he's trying to effectively rewrite history so that, in the event he establishes the Trump dynasty, he could ensure that he is looked up to as the People's Greatest Leader for generations to come. However, seeing as Trump probably isn't intelligent, he's likely just being an asshole for the sake of being an asshole, while simultaneously being lost in his own little world. Godspeed Mr.President.tongue

edited 27th Nov '16 4:13:57 PM by kkhohoho

tricksterson Never Trust from Behind you with an icepick Since: Apr, 2009 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
Never Trust
#158888: Nov 27th 2016 at 4:13:02 PM

[up][up][up]Because it's not enough that he won electorally. He can't conceive of losing in any way, shape or form without the other person "cheating".

Trump delenda est
JulianLapostat Since: Feb, 2014
#158889: Nov 27th 2016 at 4:15:57 PM

What can I say classic projection...he's a liar/cheat/fraud/hypocrite and he gets off and accuses other people of the stuff he's guilty of.

PotatoesRock Since: Oct, 2012
#158890: Nov 27th 2016 at 4:16:01 PM

He's an asshole. He's a manchild third generation wealth born with a Silver Spoon who's never been able to get respect, so he's a rampaging Id of anger, fury, misogyny, racism, and bigotry with bigly hands.

JulianLapostat Since: Feb, 2014
#158891: Nov 27th 2016 at 4:21:07 PM

I will say that Trump is America's greatest demagogue...there have been Know-Nothings, there have been Huey Longs, there's Joseph McCarthy (the true founder of the modern Republican Party, not Lincoln), George Wallace and others. But Trump has gone further than them.

Parable Since: Aug, 2009
#158893: Nov 27th 2016 at 4:45:40 PM

California has publicly said "F U" to Trump so I can see why he's attacking us, but where do Virginia and New Hampshire fit in this?

Kostya (Unlucky Thirteen)
#158894: Nov 27th 2016 at 4:46:29 PM

Those are the Swing States that went for Hillary.

IFwanderer use political terms to describe, not insult from Earth Since: Aug, 2013 Relationship Status: Wishfully thinking
use political terms to describe, not insult
#158895: Nov 27th 2016 at 4:46:49 PM

He's probably getting salty that someone dared to cast doubt on his totally 100%-legitimate victory that he actually got elected by the most people, seriously guys, he's got the best elections.

edited 27th Nov '16 4:47:10 PM by IFwanderer

1 2 We are what we pretend to be, so we must be careful about what we pretend to be. -KV
FluffyMcChicken My Hair Provides Affordable Healthcare from where the floating lights gleam Since: Jun, 2014 Relationship Status: In another castle
My Hair Provides Affordable Healthcare
#158896: Nov 27th 2016 at 4:59:17 PM

WSJ: Death of Fidel Castro May Pressure Donald Trump on Cuba Promises

WASHINGTON—The death of Fidel Castro is putting unexpected pressure on President-elect Donald Trump to follow through on earlier promises to reverse the recent openings to Cuba made by President Barack Obama. While Mr. Trump could undo Mr. Obama’s efforts, which were implemented using executive authority, he could face pushback from U.S. companies now deeply invested in Cuba under the current administration’s policy. Those companies include major airlines, hotel operators and technology providers, while big U.S. phone carriers have signed roaming agreements on the island.

Mr. Trump’s top aides said Sunday that he would demand the release of political prisoners held in Cuba and push the government to allow more religious and economic freedoms. Reince Priebus, Mr. Trump’s incoming White House chief of staff, said the president-elect “absolutely” would reverse Mr. Obama’s policies if he didn’t get what he wanted from Cuba.

“We’re not going to have a unilateral deal coming from Cuba back to the United States without some changes in their government,” Mr. Priebus said Sunday on Fox News. “Repression, open markets, freedom of religion, political prisoners—these things need to change in order to have open and free relationships, and that’s what president-elect Trump believes, and that’s where he’s going to head.”

Sen. Marco Rubio (R., Fla.), a critic of Mr. Obama’s opening, said Sunday on CBS that he hopes Mr. Trump will examine Mr. Obama’s changes to U.S.-Cuba policy and consider whether they foster democracy.

Ana Rosa Quintana, an expert on Latin America at the conservative Heritage Foundation, said she hopes Mr. Trump will roll back regulations that allow U.S. companies to interact with state-run entities in Cuba.

Mr. Obama announced in December 2014 that his administration had reached a deal with Cuba to begin to normalize relations. Since then, embassies have reopened in both countries, and the U.S. has loosened trade and travel restrictions to Cuba.

Despite bipartisan support, Congress has refused to lift the economic embargo on Cuba, which administration officials have said is necessary to fully normalize relations.

Sen. Amy Klobuchar (D., Minn.), a co-sponsor of a bipartisan bill to lift the embargo, said until Republican leaders allow a vote on the legislation its supporters are “stymied.”

That gives Mr. Trump broad authority to scale back U.S. relations with Cuba, said lawyers and former officials who specialize in sanctions policy.

Regulations that allow U.S. companies to deal with Cuban state-owned entities seem the most vulnerable, such as one that allows U.S. businesses to use state-owned distributors as middlemen for deliveries to the private sector, the former officials and lawyers said.

Peter Harrell, a former senior official at the State Department who worked on sanctions in the Obama administration, said he expected Mr. Trump would “pull back some of that dealing with the Cuban state while allowing travel and private enterprise to go forward.”

Another measure Mr. Trump could reverse is Mr. Obama’s decision earlier this year to allow so-called people-to-people travel to Cuba without a tour group, a move that essentially lifted the travel ban and that critics believe went too far. According to the State Department, 700,000 Americans visited Cuba in 2015, which officials said was an increase from previous years.

“I wouldn’t be surprised to see that rescinded,” said Robert Muse, a Washington-based lawyer who advises companies on doing business in Cuba.

Republican opponents of Mr. Obama’s Cuba policy—including Mauricio Claver-Carone, who is on Mr. Trump’s transition team at the Treasury Department—have been critical of a deal Starwood Hotels signed with the Cuban government earlier this year, under which the company is running a hotel once owned by the tourism arm of the Cuban military. Mr. Harrell said Mr. Trump might rethink that authorization or allowing similar licenses in the future.

Mr. Claver-Carone didn’t respond to requests for comment. Starwood, now owned by Marriott International Inc., declined to comment.

In addition to corporations seeking to invest in Cuba, Mr. Obama’s policy has strong support in another Republican stronghold: the farming industry.

Kevin Paap, president of the Minnesota Farm Bureau, said he voted for Mr. Trump but didn’t want to see the next administration take any steps that would put U.S. farmers at a further disadvantage in the Cuban market.

“Every other country in the world has diplomatic and trade relations with Cuba, and what we don’t want to do is lose that market share to the European Union, Brazil, Argentina,” Mr. Paap said, adding that U.S. market share in Cuba has decreased in recent years as other countries are able to provide better financing.

The White House has been working to facilitate new investments in Cuba by U.S. companies to try to further entrench business and trade ties between the two countries before Mr. Obama leaves office, with new announcements expected in coming weeks. It is unclear how Mr. Castro’s death might affect those efforts.

The potential blowback from U.S. business has been the White House’s de facto insurance policy on Mr. Obama’s approach to Cuba.

In March Mr. Obama became the first sitting U.S. president in 88 years to visit Cuba, and many administration officials have gone to the island to advance economic and cultural ties.

Matt Miller, an American Airlines spokesman, said the company is proceeding “full steam ahead” with plans to expand its service from the U.S. to Cuba this week to include flights to Havana from Miami and Charlotte, N.C. U.S. commercial flights to Cuba resumed in September.

To further entrench Mr. Obama’s policy, administration officials also are relying on lawmakers in agriculture states poised to benefit from trade with Cuba and a growing number of Cuban Americans who support policy changes that loosen travel restrictions and allow them to send more money to family members living there.

Rep. Tom Emmer (R., Minn.), ​a​ strong proponent of lifting the embargo​who supported Mr. Trump in the election, ​said he hopes the Trump administration will seize on the opportunity of Mr. Castro’s death to further normalize ties.

“Hopefully the ​Trump administration will build off what has already been created, ​understanding that it is a new day in the Western Hemisphere,” he said in an interview. ​

Paul Johnson, co-chair of the U.S. agriculture coalition for Cuba, said he isn’t yet worried that Mr. Trump would reverse the momentum from Mr. Obama’s policy because “rural America clearly supports normalization of trade with Cuba” and wants to end the U.S. embargo.

Dan Restrepo, a former Latin America adviser to Mr. Obama who is now a fellow at the Center for American Progress, said U.S. companies that invested in Cuba under Mr. Obama’s policy could explore legal action against the government if Mr. Trump reversed measures that allowed them to operate there.

U.S. companies “now have a vested interest and they are going to be part of any debate” and that “broadens the political conversation,” he said.

JulianLapostat Since: Feb, 2014
#158897: Nov 27th 2016 at 5:19:34 PM

Obama's Iran N-Deal won't be repealed either. Apparently he pulled a Batman Gambit made it a fait accompli:

Their argument? Tehran has already received tens of billions of dollars in sanctions relief in exchange for shipping out a large chunk of its enriched uranium and taking thousands of centrifuges offline. If Washington pulled out of the deal, Tehran could theoretically restart those centrifuges and renew its push for nuclear weapons — while keeping the money.

For the deal to be a success in American eyes, Iran would have to abide by limits on its nuclear program that are designed to last for as long as 15 years. But abandoning or trying to redo the agreement would free Iran from those restrictions. The US, in other words, arguably needs the deal more than Iran does.

“We gave up ... all of our leverage on the front end when we gave away the moneys that were stashed in various countries around the world and so now the leverage is with them," Republican Sen. Bob Corker, who opposed the deal as chair of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee, told Politico.

The good news is that if Trump is a Putin Stooge then things will be better. Putin supports the N-Deal, he supports lifting sanctions of Cuba. If things get dicey, Bad Vlad Putin is there to defend Obama's foreign policy achievements.

PotatoesRock Since: Oct, 2012
#158898: Nov 27th 2016 at 5:22:22 PM

It is a strange world in which we're hoping Putin to be the Trump Whisperer and keep the global system from melting down.

pwiegle Cape Malleum Majorem from Nowhere Special Since: Sep, 2015 Relationship Status: Singularity
Cape Malleum Majorem
#158899: Nov 27th 2016 at 5:26:38 PM

Is this the beginning of Trump's final meltdown? Or just another chapter in the ongoing saga of As the Stomach Turns? Stay tuned for further details!

This Space Intentionally Left Blank.
JulianLapostat Since: Feb, 2014
#158900: Nov 27th 2016 at 5:26:55 PM

Putin would relish that role...he wants to be seen as a major statesman and be respected. Now he's the guy who will be there to talk Trump into thinking about climate change, agreeing to the Paris Agreement, the N-Deal, taking a lead on Palestinian talks (alongside China).

The world will cry "Save us" and Putin will look down and say, "Da".

I condemn the Russian interference in US elections (I think it went as far as the DNC email hacks and support and spread of fake News but not to actual hacking)...but I do think the Obama Administration made a stupid policy mistake with regards to Ukraine and they refused to consider the consequences of NATO expansionism.


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