Nov 2023 Mod notice:
There may be other, more specific, threads about some aspects of US politics, but this one tends to act as a hub for all sorts of related news and information, so it's usually one of the busiest OTC threads.
If you're new to OTC, it's worth reading the Introduction to On-Topic Conversations
and the On-Topic Conversations debate guidelines
before posting here.
Rumor-based, fear-mongering and/or inflammatory statements that damage the quality of the thread will be thumped. Off-topic posts will also be thumped. Repeat offenders may be suspended.
If time spent moderating this thread remains a distraction from moderation of the wiki itself, the thread will need to be locked. We want to avoid that, so please follow the forum rules
when posting here.
In line with the general forum rules, 'gravedancing' is prohibited here. If you're celebrating someone's death or hoping that they die, your post will get thumped. This rule applies regardless of what the person you're discussing has said or done.
Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM
Be careful with this one. In UK, the Conservative government has been trying to do this since 2010. Initially there was media coverage and then it stopped. People thought it had gone away. It hasn't. The government keeps trying to do it on the quiet, with next to no media reporting going on so people are barely aware of it. When people aren't being told it's happening, it becomes much harder to fight.
They managed to pass the relevant bill into law in 2013 and campaign groups managed to get part of the law reworded in 2014 on the grounds that it was too loosely worded (and could even attack something for its 'potential' to cause 'disruption', rather than for something that actually did), but there are still problems with it.
My guess is that the Trump presidency will go the same way, and start attempting to enact things by stealth.
edited 22nd Nov '16 8:51:22 AM by Wyldchyld
If my post doesn't mention a giant flying sperm whale with oversized teeth and lionfish fins for flippers, it just isn't worth reading.Have you guys seen this article? It's terrifying how familiar this all sounds.
http://boingboing.net/2016/11/11/hitlers-only-kidding-about.html
edited 22nd Nov '16 8:49:50 AM by henry42
One does not shake the box containing the sticky notes of doom!@ Viewers Are Goldfish: goldfish wait a few seconds before forgetting things.
Fear of a name increases fear of the thing itself.The Canadian government passed a law like this regarding protests, but no one has been charged under it and their successors are trying to make the law less broad. Also, there is little doubt that the courts will strike down any law that handed out terrorism convictions for protesting fossil fuel development or a new corporate office (if someone actually got charged).
Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.![]()
![]()
There's a reason people decided Godwin's Law no longer applied to what's been going on with Trump.
Y'know, with all this news recently divulged on Trump's election, I am reminded of a quote Eric Idle said in his The Greedy Bastard Diaries autobiography after firing someone: "I feel like Donald Trump. I am in touch with my inner monster."
EDIT: ![]()
The Greedy Bastard Diaries book was first published in 2001, first American publication 2005, way before The Donald seriously considered any political running, though he DID do a brief run during the Bush/Gore campaign as a member of the Reform party, apparently.
When it was published in America, The Donald was still known primarily as a business mogul and reality TV star.
edited 22nd Nov '16 9:40:11 AM by Shippudentimes
Every country has that feeling of 'That awful thing can't happen to us, we're a unique and special snowflake!' I would dare say that it's even stronger in America because of our unique position in the world and our physical isolation. People will look straight into the face of Satan and argue that his skin isn't that red, it's more of a salmon hue, really, because they can't come to grips with the idea that evil is an active and immediately present event. Not just something that happens to people far away or in the past.
The idea that we are somehow special as a nation is something even mainstream politicians on the left like Obama feed into. But that idea of being special, of being better than other people and other countries in some intangible way, gives us a false sense of security. One of these days, the left needs to stand up against it.
Furthermore, I think Guantanamo must be destroyed.![]()
I wonder if that's one of the reasons some people voted for him. Because, deep down, they wish they could act as monstrous as him.
Feeding and enabling the whole "America is exceptional" crap is one of the problems I had with HRC's campaign rhetoric.
edited 22nd Nov '16 9:06:34 AM by M84
Disgusted, but not surprisedTrump isn't even trying to hide that his "plans" amount to little more than breaking everything he gets his hands on, installing his white supremacist cronies into power for loyalty, and basically robbing the nation at this point and so far the only things that's seemed to sink with his supporters is that he's not actually going to jail Hillary Clinton for her "crimes".
This whole election is a wake-up call on just how broken the systems we have are and how right wing propaganda has broken the minds of so much of the population.
"When you do things right, people won't be sure you've done anything at all" Futurama, GodfellasI was kind of freaked out when I first found out how fucked up FOX News and their ilk were and how much poison they were spreading. I was lucky enough to never get into the habit of watching that stuff growing up, so I was blissfully unaware of what it was doing to the country. I'm not unaware anymore.
Disgusted, but not surprisedThat's the insidious nature of the GOP: their guiding philosophy (little government, people pulling themselves up by their bootstraps, etc) is bankrupt because it ignores societal oppression and the fact that some people have less opportunities. It operates under the false premise that we live in a post-racial, post-gender society where any prejudice one might suffer is a small setback at best, so anyone who works hard enough can get a job, health care, etc.
In order to make people not realize this, they've invested in a giant media empire that treats facts as subjective and appeals to fear and hatred of others.
The depth of their smear campaign is so strong that many of the people who consistently vote for them (poor rural whites) are consistently making their situation worse by doing so, because they've been conditioned not to accept that the government and minorities aren't their enemies.
edited 22nd Nov '16 11:37:57 AM by Draghinazzo
![]()
![]()
Our systems have always been broken; it's just, with actual responsible people in charge, we haven't been able to see just how broken they really are. Under the right circumstances and with the right people in the playing field, anyone can use and abuse our systems to do whatever the hell they want. There's actually an anime series called Legend Of Galactic Heroes from the late 80's and early 90's that was already aware of this decades before Trump came into power, and it was made by the freaking Japanese.
Basically, the President Chairman of the Space!USA Free Planets Alliance was elected into power despite being a corrupt narcissistic douchebag, and hategroups who act in his name run rampant. It was an in-depth look at what a USA-esque democracy could turn into, and it becomes so decadent, corrupt, and outright inefficient that it winds up being taken over by the Galactic Empire, which is actually a pretty sweet place if you don't mind living in an autocracy. I'm not saying that the USA is going to be taken over by China or Russia anytime soon, but in terms of everything else, it was fucking prophetic.
That said, the series does acknowledge the virtues of democracy and makes a strong case for it, with freedom of speech and the right to vote being biggies. But it still acknowledges its' flaws as well, and those flaws are gaping when you get right down to it.
edited 22nd Nov '16 12:29:38 PM by kkhohoho
....
Can The Empire be China please?
(Yes, I'm more than aware that neither Moscow nor Beijing have conquering ambitions beyond the regional level.
)
So Trump may be reconsidering his stance on climate change.
This is the one place where I welcome fickleness on Trump's part.
I'll believe that when I see action, I'm not going to to set myself up for a Hope Spot.
edited 22nd Nov '16 12:45:13 PM by Rationalinsanity
Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.![]()
On one hand, good. That might mean the United States won't be the cause of Islands going under the Ocean and Millions, if not Billions, of People being displaced.
On the other hand, dear freakin' god we have the worst flip-flopper as President of the United States!
edited 22nd Nov '16 12:19:00 PM by DingoWalley1
You know, I really think Godwin's Law and people's rampant abuse of comparisons to Nazi Germany has really screwed the pooch on discourse about fascism.
People think you're crying wolf even if the parallels are on point with every single issue.

Unfortunately this does very much look like a case of History Repeats thus far. People are seemingly too ignorant to realize what they've been playing into this whole time (political outsider runs a campaign on fear and hate, exploiting the populist xenophobia of the masses), or they're very aware and are embracing it wholeheartedly.