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Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM

blkwhtrbbt The Dragon of the Eastern Sea from Doesn't take orders from Vladimir Putin Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
The Dragon of the Eastern Sea
#157376: Nov 21st 2016 at 7:01:00 AM

Exactly. No matter what happens, we net a positive out of it.

The important part is we don't get four years of Neo-Nazis running the show.

By "we" I mean anyone who two or more of the following:

sane, liberal, racial or ethnic minority, gender/sexual minority, religious minority, or in financial crisis.

Bear in mind I'm claiming that this would be the ideal situation

Not one I'm expecting, or really even hoping for.

edited 21st Nov '16 7:03:59 AM by blkwhtrbbt

Say to the others who did not follow through You're still our brothers, and we will fight for you
Draghinazzo (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
#157377: Nov 21st 2016 at 7:04:51 AM

Yeah I'm pretty sure Trump is gonna become president no matter what happens. Our hope shouldn't be on the EC refusing to swear him in.

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#157378: Nov 21st 2016 at 7:07:52 AM

Yeah, it's all wishful thinking. While we do have to acknowledge the reality of his election and upcoming administration, we do not have to accept this as normal. Nor should we get our hopes up that somehow he'll shape up and be a decent POTUS. He won't. He's seventy — he's not changing his spots any time soon.

Disgusted, but not surprised
PotatoesRock Since: Oct, 2012
#157379: Nov 21st 2016 at 7:10:01 AM

One hopes Bannon's obsession to make the GOP the White Nationalist Party ends up back firing on him and reducing the GOP to a Rump Party, then.

The other thing is being in power places different pressures and expectations on lawmakers than when they're out of powers. I'm in no way talking Trump, but Congress typically finds itself gummed up due to idiosyncrasies of the system. As well, the Senate's unique structure and political make up makes it far less blatantly ideologically rigid than the House. And based on early information, the elder GOP members there believe deeply in theater and 'rules' and the 'system'.

As well, didn't someone mention that the GOP might be facing a local level crisis due to a likely wave of retirements and other combined factors?

. He won't. He's seventy — he's not changing his spots any time soon.
I will admit I do hope his poor personal dietary, sleep and medical habits catch up to him and incapacitate him.

edited 21st Nov '16 7:11:25 AM by PotatoesRock

CrimsonZephyr Would that it were so simple. from Massachusetts Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
Would that it were so simple.
#157380: Nov 21st 2016 at 7:14:58 AM

I'm not saying that capitulation is necessary, but Jesus, we need to start fighting worthwhile (and)/or winnable battles. Making a big deal out of the Electoral College won't go anywhere. Trump will still be president, the EC, out of respect for precedent and/or fearing for their personal safety, will vote him in, and there's nothing we can do. This sort of story is the kind of thing Trump and company want us to be distracted by, so that his new regime squeaks through with less controversy.

"For all those whose cares have been our concern, the work goes on, the cause endures, the hope still lives, and the dream shall never die."
Draghinazzo (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
#157381: Nov 21st 2016 at 7:16:15 AM

I will admit I do hope his poor personal dietary, sleep and medical habits catch up to him and incapacitate him.

I find that much more likely than the EC revolting tbh.

kkhohoho (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#157382: Nov 21st 2016 at 7:19:53 AM

[up]Either that or someone gets so pissed off that they try to take a more... direct approach. I'm not advocating anything of the sort myself, but I wouldn't be surprised if someone tries to literally invoke the slings and arrows of outrageous fortune upon Mr.Trump.tongue

PotatoesRock Since: Oct, 2012
#157383: Nov 21st 2016 at 7:24:46 AM

I'm not saying that capitulation is necessary, but Jesus, we need to start fighting worthwhile (and)/or winnable battles.
Yes. Like turning Paul Ryan and Steve Bannon on each toher and having Trump and Ryan quarrel.

Or letting Schumer and co. block the worst cuts to Social Security, Obamacare, Medicare and the like possible. For anything absolutely banans, the Republicans still need 8 Democrats to side with them, as long as McConnell respects rights of the minority. And again, McConnell being what he is, is absolutely a political weasel. Of what's known, he has nowhere near Ryan's level of blatant sociopathy and is absolutely more than willing to broker deals across the aisle because That's How Things Are Done.

I find that much more likely than the EC revolting tbh.
Again. Trump is:

  • Over Seventy
  • On Cholesterol Medication
  • Apparently eats a diet high in red meat and fast food
  • Sleeps 2-3 hours a night apparently
  • Stays up until ungodly hours
  • Is overweight

And this is without the stress of the presidency on him.

Medinoc from France (Before Recorded History)
#157384: Nov 21st 2016 at 7:32:43 AM

Next step is: How to deal with Pence?

"And as long as a sack of shit is not a good thing to be, chivalry will never die."
Rationalinsanity from Halifax, Canada Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
#157386: Nov 21st 2016 at 7:35:54 AM

An EC revolt would just trigger a right-wing reaction that would give the 2020 race to someone worse.

Also, stupid Trump supporters can't even attack the right Hamilton.

http://m.metronews.ca/#/article/news/canada/2016/11/20/trump-supporters-fluff-their-lines-canada-hamilton-theatre-.html

Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.
PotatoesRock Since: Oct, 2012
#157387: Nov 21st 2016 at 7:36:57 AM

The System.

Pence is a typical if zealous politician. Unlike Trump, he's more likely to bend to the social pressures of American politics, the establishment. the general populace and big business. The main and most dangerous issue with Trump is his lack of shame, which most Republicans do have.

Rationalinsanity from Halifax, Canada Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
#157388: Nov 21st 2016 at 7:56:55 AM

Pence, despite his terrible bigotry (that's going to worm its way into policy even if he's only a passive VP, his party shares his views and Trump won't stop them), isn't going to start crashing economies or triggering international incidents out of spite and impulsive reactions.

Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.
Elle Since: Jan, 2001
#157389: Nov 21st 2016 at 7:57:43 AM

And while Pence would still have to be fought on civil rights, the economy might not take so much of a hit and foreign relations would be about even or at least no worse than Bush era.

[nja]

edited 21st Nov '16 7:58:01 AM by Elle

speedyboris Since: Feb, 2010
#157390: Nov 21st 2016 at 8:02:32 AM

[up]x7 But remember: According to Trump's gastroenterologist, he's the healthiest person ever elected for president.

edited 21st Nov '16 8:02:46 AM by speedyboris

Rationalinsanity from Halifax, Canada Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
#157391: Nov 21st 2016 at 8:04:00 AM

Either the healthiest person ever, or he's tested positive for every ailment known to science. Like Mr.Burns but with more capacity to unleash a nuclear disaster.

Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#157392: Nov 21st 2016 at 8:04:30 AM

I guess it boils down to what you think is worse: a bigoted zealous ideologue who is able to keep up a Mask of Sanity, or an unstable Weak-Willed Adult Child who has no clue what he's doing and has no grasp of the responsibility that comes with his new position.

Disgusted, but not surprised
HallowHawk Since: Feb, 2013
#157393: Nov 21st 2016 at 8:05:10 AM

[up][up][up][up][up] and [up][up][up][up] But won't he and his buddies still threaten Net Neutrality, as well as Obamacare?

edited 21st Nov '16 8:06:15 AM by HallowHawk

Rationalinsanity from Halifax, Canada Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
#157394: Nov 21st 2016 at 8:13:31 AM

ACA, Medicaid and Net Neutrality are probably screwed. Pence, Trump, Ryan, doesn't matter. They'll burn it all down.

Americans collectively (or at least ~48%-49% of those who bothered to vote...) screwed themselves, humanity and the planet on November 8th. There is no way out of this. Pence and Ryan are better in that they aren't unstable, so they'll "only" implement terrible policies but probably won't burn down the system in the short term.

I can't see Ryan or Pence letting Putin overrun Eastern Europe, crashing Mexico's economy, or pushing Japan and South Korea to withdraw from the NPT.

edited 21st Nov '16 8:14:44 AM by Rationalinsanity

Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.
AngelusNox Warder of the damned from The guard of the gates of oblivion Since: Dec, 2014 Relationship Status: Married to the job
Warder of the damned
#157395: Nov 21st 2016 at 8:19:35 AM

On Obama's term Net Neutrality was under threat by SOPA and PIPA but the backlash from both public and the tech industry was really big.

Trump trying to threaten the Net Neutrality again could get an even bigger backlash this time since the Democrats would be against it and the Republicans aren't 100% on the same page when it comes to it.

Tech giants really don't like anything that threatens Net Neutrality specially because it would harm their business models since it puts too much power on the hands of big content makers like Hollywood and Internet Service Providers like Verizon and AT&T. So they are more likely to pull some string again to bar an act like that from being voted into law.

Inter arma enim silent leges
RedSavant Since: Jan, 2001
#157396: Nov 21st 2016 at 8:20:45 AM

Yup. The Electors won't break out, I can guarantee it. Hoping for them to do so and give Hillary the presidency is only wishful thinking, and we don't have the luxury of that anymore.

It's been fun.
Rationalinsanity from Halifax, Canada Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
#157397: Nov 21st 2016 at 8:24:00 AM

And a Clinton admin wouldn't be viewed as illegitimate, absolutely nothing would get done, and god knows what kind of monster would beat her in 2020.

Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.
FFShinra Since: Jan, 2001
#157398: Nov 21st 2016 at 8:25:29 AM

The US is so partisan now that Electors giving it to Hil will have the same effect at this point as him winning did. He'd then be proven right about the riggedness.

No, if liberals/democrats want to see success going forward, creating a culture of voting in the mid terms and focusing on local races is their only bet. Getting off the high horse wouldn't hurt either, for some.

MarqFJA The Cosmopolitan Fictioneer from Deserts of the Middle East (Before Recorded History) Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
The Cosmopolitan Fictioneer
#157399: Nov 21st 2016 at 9:06:16 AM

@Rationalinsanity: I think you meant to write "legitimate" instead of "illegitimate".

Fiat iustitia, et pereat mundus.
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#157400: Nov 21st 2016 at 9:27:37 AM

An HRC administration is not going to happen. That ship has sailed. The EC voters could refuse to give Trump the 270 votes he needs to win it without going to the House. The House would then make Trump POTUS anyway.

The only real change I can see if that happened (unlikely as it may be) is a Trump administration whose legitimacy is further weakened + an incentive to finally get rid of the EC.

Honestly, I'd be fine with just those. But I'm fully aware it's almost certainly not gonna happen.

edited 21st Nov '16 9:29:08 AM by M84

Disgusted, but not surprised

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