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Nov 2023 Mod notice:


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In line with the general forum rules, 'gravedancing' is prohibited here. If you're celebrating someone's death or hoping that they die, your post will get thumped. This rule applies regardless of what the person you're discussing has said or done.

Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM

AlleyOop Since: Oct, 2010
#156601: Nov 18th 2016 at 12:10:09 PM

[up][up][up][up] Same plus female and bisexual. However I'd still prefer Pence to Trump, as while he's more anathema to me in terms of beliefs, he's also more predictable and therefore easier to find workarounds (as people did with the Dubya years). He's also less likely to steer us directly towards fascism. At the least he won't sell us out to Russia, start a trade war with China, or actually try to create Muslim death camps.

edited 18th Nov '16 12:11:05 PM by AlleyOop

Draghinazzo (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
#156602: Nov 18th 2016 at 12:10:36 PM

I'm not an american, but as a mixed-race latino I would be very afraid to go to America right now. It's been an ambition of mine for years, but I would not feel safe there anymore despite the fact that I'm considerably more "white-passing" than many minorities.

And yes I'm also an atheist, so there's that too.

Btw if the trade war with China actually happens those poor rural workers that voted for Trump are in for a rude awakening.

edited 18th Nov '16 12:11:26 PM by Draghinazzo

tricksterson Never Trust from Behind you with an icepick Since: Apr, 2009 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
Never Trust
#156603: Nov 18th 2016 at 12:13:36 PM

[up]x4 No, Pence would be worse. He is more competent than Trump, more connected to the GOP power structure and has more charisma than Cruz while having the same goals. He is the only reason I hope Trump stays alive.

edited 18th Nov '16 12:14:30 PM by tricksterson

Trump delenda est
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#156604: Nov 18th 2016 at 12:14:59 PM

TBH, there really aren't any high ranking GOP politicians that I'd want as the POTUS these days. At least none that are in line for the Presidency. Trump: No. Pence: No. Paul Ryan: No.

Disgusted, but not surprised
Elle Since: Jan, 2001
#156605: Nov 18th 2016 at 12:15:07 PM

In fairness, while there is a negative attitude towards atheists here even on our better days, it's not something someone's going to be singled out for unless they're vocal about it...or running for office. Or if you're under pressure from non-atheist family.

Pence I dislike but he might not tank the economy and foreign relations. The number of fronts he would have to be fought on would be narrowed.

edited 18th Nov '16 12:18:06 PM by Elle

RBluefish Since: Nov, 2013
#156606: Nov 18th 2016 at 12:15:51 PM

I would not recommend anybody come to America while all of this is going on, especially people who might be noticeably foreign. If you have an accent or look a bit "ethnic," you've basically got a target painted on your forehead. The horrifying surge in hate crimes is proof enough of that.

I remember on election night, which will probably go down in my memory as one of the worst nights of my life (well...ugh, so far), I read a tweet from a Muslim woman who had just gotten a text from her mother. Her mother, who is ultra-religious, had begged her not to wear her hijab today. She was that frightened.

I remember that made me cry, because...I mean. America, everybody.

"We'll take the next chance, and the next, until we win, or the chances are spent."
PotatoesRock Since: Oct, 2012
#156607: Nov 18th 2016 at 12:16:11 PM

... Why?
Why would Hillary have steamrolled them? Basically Hillary's power was so immense inside the party, she was virtually a God Queen with access to near infinite funding and the ability to kill funding to Democrats who needed it (a complaint made repeatedly through the election that the Democrats got nuked in so many places because Schultz and the DNC were so focused on fundraising for Hillary' campaign that they were leaving the rest of the party anemic on funding).

Not that she herself was evil but the Clinton Machine had become parasitic and the Third Way / Centrist branch of the party was basically trying to hold off any other factions inside the party from expressing valid criticism of Hillary's models of handling the election and the like.

No one stepped out this election cycle because Hillary's shadow was so long and deep that she would of eclipsed them.

The depressing fact is if you want the Democrats to have any form of Local Level / Congressional control, you need to get away from excessive funding focus on the Presidency, because that was sucking up a lot of funding and focus on the party.

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#156608: Nov 18th 2016 at 12:17:16 PM

[up][up] Visitors might have better luck in a heavily Blue State like California. Even then...

edited 18th Nov '16 12:17:58 PM by M84

Disgusted, but not surprised
tricksterson Never Trust from Behind you with an icepick Since: Apr, 2009 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
Never Trust
#156609: Nov 18th 2016 at 12:17:37 PM

[up]x5 There are none I would like but Ryan I could live with just as I could have if Romney had won in '12.

edited 18th Nov '16 12:19:33 PM by tricksterson

Trump delenda est
RBluefish Since: Nov, 2013
#156610: Nov 18th 2016 at 12:19:00 PM

I live in a pretty blue part of New York, and even then I was scared to go outside on The Night. Despite living in a pretty liberal city, we've had hate crimes here before, and my family has had things shouted at us from cars and stuff a few times.

I have a friend who's gay and lives down in L.A., and he did flat-out state that he was afraid to go outside.

"We'll take the next chance, and the next, until we win, or the chances are spent."
Rationalinsanity from Halifax, Canada Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
#156611: Nov 18th 2016 at 12:20:19 PM

I mean, I'm white, straight, and a man (I've got an accent but I doubt it would be identified as particularly foreign) but given my political leanings and habit of spouting off my mouth when I shouldn't....I still wouldn't feel entirely safe in the US right now. Tensions are running high and it doesn't take much to set people off violently. So I get why anyone who is more vulnerable than I am would be living in absolute fear right now.

A few countries have already issued travel advisories regarding the US, I suspect that number will increase if the violent incidents/overt and public hate crimes/protests don't taper off.

edited 18th Nov '16 12:21:29 PM by Rationalinsanity

Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#156612: Nov 18th 2016 at 12:21:24 PM

[up][up] I'm wondering how bad things will get for Asian-Americans of Chinese descent if Trump really does start a trade war with China.

edited 18th Nov '16 12:21:35 PM by M84

Disgusted, but not surprised
Rationalinsanity from Halifax, Canada Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
#156613: Nov 18th 2016 at 12:22:38 PM

Not just Chinese-Americans, racists really can't be bothered to set various groups apart. Look at how often Hindus and Sikhs get attacked by Islamaphobes.

Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.
CaptainCapsase from Orbiting Sagittarius A* Since: Jan, 2015
#156614: Nov 18th 2016 at 12:22:48 PM

[up][up] It depends. How bad were things for Russian Americans during the cold war?

[up] People bothered to distinguish between the Japanese and the Chinese during World War II, and the American government made a point of pointing out the distinction, despite the atrocity it was engaged in.

edited 18th Nov '16 12:23:35 PM by CaptainCapsase

AlleyOop Since: Oct, 2010
#156615: Nov 18th 2016 at 12:24:04 PM

Mitch McConnell would hopefully say no to the most drastic stuff since his wife is Chinese. Not that something similar stopped Lou Dobbs from railing against immigrants.

RBluefish Since: Nov, 2013
#156616: Nov 18th 2016 at 12:24:05 PM

@M84: Things are already not good for Asian-Americans - we have not been spared in the increase in hate crimes.

If Trump does do that, then...I'm not walking alone at night anymore, I tell you that.

edited 18th Nov '16 12:24:23 PM by RBluefish

"We'll take the next chance, and the next, until we win, or the chances are spent."
Rationalinsanity from Halifax, Canada Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
#156617: Nov 18th 2016 at 12:24:47 PM

Russian/Eastern Europeans in America tended to be vocally anti-communist for the most part. But they still had the FBI and other authorities stalking them. It helped that they were white, but a lot of them changed their names to eliminate being associated with the Eastern Bloc.

Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.
KarkatTheDalek Not as angry as the name would suggest. from Somwhere in Time/Space Since: Mar, 2012 Relationship Status: You're a beautiful woman, probably
Not as angry as the name would suggest.
#156618: Nov 18th 2016 at 12:26:06 PM

[up][up][up][up] The Chinese were our allies, though. Might that have made a difference? You generally don't want to risk pissing off people who are on your side.

edited 18th Nov '16 12:26:16 PM by KarkatTheDalek

Oh God! Natural light!
CaptainCapsase from Orbiting Sagittarius A* Since: Jan, 2015
#156619: Nov 18th 2016 at 12:26:32 PM

[up][up] Well I certainly hope things don't get that bad.

[up] And now the Japanese are our allies, and South Korea is heavily dependent on the United States for defense. Thus there's at least some reason to suppose Koreans and Japanese might not be as heavily targeted. Which is cold comfort to me, though I suppose I could try to pass for white if it came down to it, or part-Korean/Japanese, since I doubt such people would recognize my surname as Chinese.

edited 18th Nov '16 12:28:24 PM by CaptainCapsase

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#156620: Nov 18th 2016 at 12:27:17 PM

[up][up] Now it's reversed. The Japanese are America's ostensible allies, and China is the big scary "other".

edited 18th Nov '16 12:27:35 PM by M84

Disgusted, but not surprised
Elle Since: Jan, 2001
#156621: Nov 18th 2016 at 12:27:30 PM

Your average person on the street isn't going to be able to tell the difference without engaging with the person. I mean, I do know there's a difference in appearance but I sure can't tell a Vietamese from a Korean from a Chinese from a Japanese person on sight alone.

Rationalinsanity from Halifax, Canada Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
#156622: Nov 18th 2016 at 12:28:04 PM

Do you actually think that the kind of scum who assault random people on the street while shouting "Trump's gonna ship you back to China!" are going to bother checking to see if their victim is actually Korean/Japanese/Vietnamese/Thai/etc beforehand?

edited 18th Nov '16 12:28:43 PM by Rationalinsanity

Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.
CaptainCapsase from Orbiting Sagittarius A* Since: Jan, 2015
#156623: Nov 18th 2016 at 12:29:18 PM

[up] No, but there's less likely to be black shirts roaming around Koreatown or in neighborhoods with Japanese-American populations compared to Chinese neighborhoods, to use New York City as an example.

edited 18th Nov '16 12:31:31 PM by CaptainCapsase

RBluefish Since: Nov, 2013
#156624: Nov 18th 2016 at 12:30:00 PM

[up][up] Nope. All they're going to see is "yellow skin, check - slanty eyes, check - time to start acting like a racist Neanderthal." Like somebody else said, violent bigots already don't bother to distinguish between Muslims and Sikhs. And Interchangeable Asian Cultures is already a plenty-prevalent thing, so the seeds have been planted for a long time now.

edited 18th Nov '16 12:30:14 PM by RBluefish

"We'll take the next chance, and the next, until we win, or the chances are spent."
CaptainCapsase from Orbiting Sagittarius A* Since: Jan, 2015
#156625: Nov 18th 2016 at 12:30:57 PM

Well we can only hope Trump doesn't end up starting a second cold war with China.


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