TVTropes Now available in the app store!
Open

Follow TV Tropes

Following

The General US Politics Thread

Go To

Nov 2023 Mod notice:


There may be other, more specific, threads about some aspects of US politics, but this one tends to act as a hub for all sorts of related news and information, so it's usually one of the busiest OTC threads.

If you're new to OTC, it's worth reading the Introduction to On-Topic Conversations and the On-Topic Conversations debate guidelines before posting here.

Rumor-based, fear-mongering and/or inflammatory statements that damage the quality of the thread will be thumped. Off-topic posts will also be thumped. Repeat offenders may be suspended.

If time spent moderating this thread remains a distraction from moderation of the wiki itself, the thread will need to be locked. We want to avoid that, so please follow the forum rules when posting here.


In line with the general forum rules, 'gravedancing' is prohibited here. If you're celebrating someone's death or hoping that they die, your post will get thumped. This rule applies regardless of what the person you're discussing has said or done.

Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM

Elle Since: Jan, 2001
#148176: Nov 3rd 2016 at 8:10:29 AM

The point is that they shouldn't have to accept being screwed lying down.

The thing about armed insurrection/vigilantism is that "when in the course of human events" all your other options have been tried and exhausted, violence does become the only way out, even if the odds are good that "out" happens on a stretcher.

[up] and [down] Isn't that a point in favor of the argument that denying people the right to arm themselves is a form of tyranny?

edited 3rd Nov '16 8:15:33 AM by Elle

Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#148177: Nov 3rd 2016 at 8:13:26 AM

[up] And you imagine that minorities would be allowed to amass guns with which to conduct this revolution, Second Amendment or not? Delusions. Hell, the Brady Crime bill, designed to keep guns out of the hands of the evil black ghetto people, was signed into law by Ronald Reagan.

Edit: In response to your edit, it's been proven time and again in this country that the Second Amendment is used in practice as a justification for white folks to arm themselves against evil black ghetto people and the cops that would seek to protect them. It is a tool of insurrectionists and racists. Whatever idealized value it may once have had has long since been lost.

Regardless, repealing it would not open the door for some mass program of government confiscation. That's literally impossible. It would, however, remove one of the tools those white nationalist asswipes have to protect their ability to arm themselves to conduct insurrection against the United States, and that is an unequivocal good.

edited 3rd Nov '16 8:19:40 AM by Fighteer

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
Zendervai Since: Oct, 2009
#148178: Nov 3rd 2016 at 8:17:20 AM

Reagan caused so many negative things that it's ridiculous, honestly. But he's still way more palatable than the current Republican party, because Reagan at least wanted the country to, you know, exist in a functional state.

AngelusNox Warder of the damned from The guard of the gates of oblivion Since: Dec, 2014 Relationship Status: Married to the job
Warder of the damned
#148179: Nov 3rd 2016 at 8:20:36 AM

Well it kinda worked for the Black Panthers, back then the police wouldn't dare to touch them out of fear of escalation, today I'm not so sure.

Inter arma enim silent leges
Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#148180: Nov 3rd 2016 at 8:23:52 AM

[up] It is not a good thing for the police to be faced with a heavily armed private group that it cannot effectively combat without escalating to military tactics no matter which side of the political spectrum said group inhabits. I find it truly amazing that this needs to be stated.

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
sgamer82 Since: Jan, 2001
#148181: Nov 3rd 2016 at 8:29:39 AM

Jon Stewart's Twitter Fight with Donald Trump at Stand Up For Heroes, 11/1/16

Some stand-up from Jon Stewart.

Elle Since: Jan, 2001
#148182: Nov 3rd 2016 at 8:30:42 AM

The racist asswipes get a lot of mileage out of the First Amendment too but no one is calling for it to be repealed. (You could argue that the second is more dangerous but the first is not without dangers either.)

The thing with rights is, defending them means defending them for all, even the deplorables, because you can' t justly do away with protection for one group that you don't like without the consequence of doing away with the protection for those you do like.

Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#148183: Nov 3rd 2016 at 8:31:00 AM

[up][up] I was just watching that! I think we should all start tweeting using the hashtag #FuckfaceVonClownstick.

[up] The use of arms to protect civil society should be limited to law enforcement. That is my absolute opinion. If public authority becomes so corrupt that civilians feel the need to stage an armed revolt, the situation has broken down so badly that a priori private gun ownership is irrelevant.

edited 3rd Nov '16 8:47:56 AM by Fighteer

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
sgamer82 Since: Jan, 2001
#148184: Nov 3rd 2016 at 8:35:07 AM

[up] Until we hit a #FuckfaceVonNervestick?

BonsaiForest Since: Jan, 2001
#148185: Nov 3rd 2016 at 8:36:28 AM

Looks like the Republicans in North Carolina tried to make it harder for black people to vote early.

No surprise there. Scum.

A new report has revealed that North Carolina Republicans conspired to limit the operating hours of early voting polling places, in the hopes it would limit minority turnout.

Emails uncovered by Reuters through a public records request revealed that local Republican leaders lobbied at least 17 county election boards to limit the hours that voting sites could stay open — particularly to cut down on weekends and evenings, when Democratic voter turnout tends to be higher.

They also insisted that county election boards open fewer voting sites. State Republican officials claimed they opposed keeping polls open during evenings and weekends because they wanted to conserve county resources.

While North Carolina has added nearly 5,900 voting hours and 78 voting sites since 2012, voter turnout has dropped by 20 percent in those counties that only opened one polling site during the first week of early voting.

In an interview with Reuters, a county elections board chairman named Bill Mc Anulty described being labeled as a traitor when he agreed in July to open a Sunday voting site for African-American churchgoers, ultimately prompting him to withdraw his initial support.

“I became a villain, quite frankly,” Mc Anulty told Reuters. “I got accused of being a traitor and everything else by the Republican Party.”

Those disgusting Republicans badly need to lose.

Elle Since: Jan, 2001
#148186: Nov 3rd 2016 at 8:43:51 AM

Well breakdowns are exactly the case when bearing arms against the government is to be made. I don't advocate it as anything but a last resort but i accept that it is a last resort.

On the smaller scale, the belief in a right to personal self defense is my own absolute opinion but I suspect neither of us can be here all day and probably would end up needed to jump to the philosophy or human rights thread so I'm gonna let that bit go at this time. (I'll also allow for the fact that many people are dumb about their precieved need for a gun as "self defense" and re-iterate that I'm not against basic regulation like licensing laws for guns.)

edited 3rd Nov '16 8:47:47 AM by Elle

IFwanderer use political terms to describe, not insult from Earth Since: Aug, 2013 Relationship Status: Wishfully thinking
use political terms to describe, not insult
#148187: Nov 3rd 2016 at 8:46:29 AM

The racist asswipes get a lot of mileage out of the First Amendment too but no one is calling for it to be repealed. (You could argue that the second is more dangerous but the first is not without dangers either.)

The thing with rights is, defending them means defending them for all, even the deplorables, because you can' t justly do away with protection for one group that you don't like without the consequence of doing away with the protection for those you do like.

To be honest, at this point I personally believe it's better to refine freedom of speech into a "freedom of debate", which would mean that anyone is free to state an idea but you have to be actually capable of defending it through skilled argumentation (that is, without descending into insults and or personal attacks or deflecting when your view is unsustainable).

edited 3rd Nov '16 8:46:41 AM by IFwanderer

1 2 We are what we pretend to be, so we must be careful about what we pretend to be. -KV
Krieger22 Causing freakouts over sourcing since 2018 from Malaysia Since: Mar, 2014 Relationship Status: I'm in love with my car
Causing freakouts over sourcing since 2018
#148188: Nov 3rd 2016 at 8:49:41 AM

A Deplorable hid box cutter blades in a Trump-Pence sign, injuring a poll worker.

lection worker in Plano, Texas was reportedly injured by box cutter blades that were hidden in a Trump-Pence campaign sign.

The Dallas Morning News reported that the sign was found zip-tied to an official polling site sign at 2800 East Spring Creek Parkway at Collin College.

According to KTVT, the sign was placed where the suspect knew that poll workers would have to remove it. And after a precinct official ordered the sign taken down, a volunteer was sliced open by the hidden box cutter blades. The blades drew blood but luckily the cuts were not serious.

County Democratic campaign chair Steve Spainhouer told KTVT that the incident was “deplorable.”

“It just shows how far we have come in politics where people want to be so mean and so hateful to try and injure somebody who’s probably not got any political party persuasion one way or the other,” Spainhouer said. “I think most people have already made their minds up at this point how they’re going to vote and so there’s nothing to gain by being mean spirited or hateful.”

The Texas Rangers were reportedly investigating the incident at the request of precinct officials. Collin College said in a statement that all signs on campus were being inspected for sharp objects.

I wonder if training poll workers to dispose of these signs with Barrett M82s would be practical. Might even help with "poll watchers" too...

I have disagreed with her a lot, but comparing her to republicans and propagandists of dictatorships is really low. - An idiot
Wryte Since: Jul, 2010
#148189: Nov 3rd 2016 at 8:51:14 AM

Oh my god, I would pay good money to see Jon Stewart debate Trump.

Well breakdowns are exactly the case when bearing arms against the government is to be made. I don't advocate it as anything but a last resort but i accept that it is a last resort.

When one side of the equation has tanks, carriers, and fighter jets, I don't.

BestOf FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC! from Finland Since: Oct, 2010 Relationship Status: Falling within your bell curve
FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC!
#148190: Nov 3rd 2016 at 8:52:22 AM

Just as another side note to the second amendment thing, since I was writing earlier about how Finland is pretty safe despite having lots of guns. I've just found out that there's been an incident last night around where I live where a guy was walking around with a gun and apparently threatening people with it. The police couldn't get him to give up the gun, so they shot him. (He's alive, but there's no information on where he was hit and he's in hospital now.) The police say he was behaving very strangely - I get the impression that he might have been on drugs.

So, you know, we do still have gun incidents. I think the police in Finland have shot at about 20 people since 2000, with some fatalities.

Quod gratis asseritur, gratis negatur.
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#148191: Nov 3rd 2016 at 8:52:45 AM

[up][up] Don't forget drones.

edited 3rd Nov '16 8:52:53 AM by M84

Disgusted, but not surprised
Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#148192: Nov 3rd 2016 at 8:53:12 AM

[up][up][up] This. The idea that private citizenry can conduct a successful revolt against a militarized federal government is laughable.

edited 3rd Nov '16 8:53:21 AM by Fighteer

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#148193: Nov 3rd 2016 at 8:55:26 AM

In the extremely unlikely hypothetical of the Second Amendment being repealed, how would you all prefer gun-ownership to be handled?

TacticalFox88 from USA Since: Nov, 2010 Relationship Status: Dating the Doctor
#148194: Nov 3rd 2016 at 8:57:26 AM

So...the FBI is conducting an investigation into its own internal twitter account.

Seriously..

The FBI has launched an internal investigation into one of its own Twitter accounts.

The account at issue, @FBI Records Vault, had been dormant for more than a year. Then on October 30 at 4 a.m., the account released a flood of documents, including one describing Donald Trump’s father Fred Trump as a “philanthropist.”

But it wasn’t until two days later, when the account tweeted documents regarding President Clinton’s controversial pardon of Marc Rich that the account began to attract significant attention.

The account has not been active since that tweet.

Think Progress has learned that the FBI’s Inspection Division will undertake an investigation of the account.

Candice Will, Assistant Director for the FBI’s Office of Professional Responsibility, said she was referring the matter to the FBI’s Inspection Division for an “investigation.” Upon completion of the investigation, the Office of Professional Responsibility will be referred back to the Office of Professional Responsibility for “adjudication.”

Federal law and FBI policy prohibit employees from using the power of the department to attempt to influence elections.

New Survey coming this weekend!
Shippudentimes Since: Dec, 2012
#148195: Nov 3rd 2016 at 9:02:33 AM

Would Racist Carrot also be an apt analogy for the RNC "nominee"?

Kostya (Unlucky Thirteen)
#148196: Nov 3rd 2016 at 9:08:22 AM

[up][up][up]Certain weapon types are restricted, you have to be thirteen and licensed to use a gun, and you must pass psych evaluations every x number of years.

Edit: Also people can lose the right to own guns if convicted of certain crimes.

edited 3rd Nov '16 9:09:22 AM by Kostya

Elle Since: Jan, 2001
#148197: Nov 3rd 2016 at 9:08:23 AM

If it got to that point, no, but if it got to that point there would also probably be serious dissension in the military as well. A Racist asswipe militia rebelling would probably get crushed without sympathy from either military or public. Citizens rebelling in the face of actual tyranny, some portion of the rank and file of the military are likely to resist shooting their countrymen.

[up]I'm gonna take a bit of issue with the age requirement proposal. Youth programs that teach responsible gun handling, often in the context of hunter education, are very prevalent, very effective and very much a good thing, IMO. Most gun deaths where the shooter is a minor, AFAIK, are cases where the kid has a gun they aren't supposed to have, aren't trained to handle and aren't truly congisant of the consequences before they happen. (You edited it to thirteen from sixteen but I have seen kids still younger than that getting firearms training.)

edited 3rd Nov '16 9:17:15 AM by Elle

Lennik (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#148198: Nov 3rd 2016 at 9:40:30 AM

To be honest, at this point I personally believe it's better to refine freedom of speech into a "freedom of debate", which would mean that anyone is free to state an idea but you have to be actually capable of defending it through skilled argumentation (that is, without descending into insults and or personal attacks or deflecting when your view is unsustainable).

Do I need to explain why this is a terrible idea? You'd be taking away people's right to be wrong. Or emotional.

edited 3rd Nov '16 9:41:36 AM by Lennik

That's right, boys. Mondo cool.
InAnOdderWay Since: Nov, 2013
#148199: Nov 3rd 2016 at 9:46:54 AM

The First Amendment is the right to be a complete fucking idiot, and I wouldn't have it any other way. That doesn't mean people have to accept it, that doesn't mean private owners have to accept it, but it exists for damn good reason, and tampering with it would set some really bad precedents. Remember that the Constitution doesn't just exist for one President's term, it exists for all terms, including a hypothetical Trump 2 who would love to use something like that against those pesky social activists and their totally irrational "feels".

The Second Amendment, imo, can stay. It doesn't need to stay, but it doesn't need to go either, and when you're dealing with bipartisan politics sometimes compromise is the only real option that will keep everyone satisfied. What we need are heavier regulations and checks in the system that actually allows people to own guns. You're free to have a weapon.... so long as you go through the proper procedure, and within the "reason" set by the government.

edited 3rd Nov '16 9:48:05 AM by InAnOdderWay

Medinoc from France (Before Recorded History)
#148200: Nov 3rd 2016 at 9:51:59 AM

Hell, the Brady Crime bill, designed to keep guns out of the hands of the evil black ghetto people, was signed into law by Ronald Reagan.
Uhm, I tried to get more info on this, but all I could find was a law signed by Bill Clinton...

"And as long as a sack of shit is not a good thing to be, chivalry will never die."

Total posts: 417,856
Top