TVTropes Now available in the app store!
Open

Follow TV Tropes

Following

The General US Politics Thread

Go To

Nov 2023 Mod notice:


There may be other, more specific, threads about some aspects of US politics, but this one tends to act as a hub for all sorts of related news and information, so it's usually one of the busiest OTC threads.

If you're new to OTC, it's worth reading the Introduction to On-Topic Conversations and the On-Topic Conversations debate guidelines before posting here.

Rumor-based, fear-mongering and/or inflammatory statements that damage the quality of the thread will be thumped. Off-topic posts will also be thumped. Repeat offenders may be suspended.

If time spent moderating this thread remains a distraction from moderation of the wiki itself, the thread will need to be locked. We want to avoid that, so please follow the forum rules when posting here.


In line with the general forum rules, 'gravedancing' is prohibited here. If you're celebrating someone's death or hoping that they die, your post will get thumped. This rule applies regardless of what the person you're discussing has said or done.

Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM

Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#147501: Oct 31st 2016 at 1:17:47 PM

Considering that Comey seems to be actively trying to get Donald Trump elected, if the House stays Republican, I'd imagine they'll... pillory him, because he didn't indict Hillary for treason or something. So, I guess he's not winning either way.

Also, the people lamenting political correctness mainly want to be able to use racial, gender, ethnic, and similar slurs without being vilified for it. Cry me a river.

edited 31st Oct '16 1:18:57 PM by Fighteer

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
LeGarcon Blowout soon fellow Stalker from Skadovsk Since: Aug, 2013 Relationship Status: Gay for Big Boss
Blowout soon fellow Stalker
#147502: Oct 31st 2016 at 1:18:24 PM

Wow, so the fucking head of the FBI is with the Russians.

How did we let this happen?

Oh really when?
TheWanted Since: Oct, 2013
#147503: Oct 31st 2016 at 1:20:17 PM

I bet a lot of people here loved Comey in July.

Isn't this all a little reactionary? [up] Seriously? In the time it took for me to type that up you just linked him to Russia?

edited 31st Oct '16 1:22:31 PM by TheWanted

blkwhtrbbt The Dragon of the Eastern Sea from Doesn't take orders from Vladimir Putin Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
The Dragon of the Eastern Sea
#147504: Oct 31st 2016 at 1:21:40 PM

We decided that that we won the Cold War.

Say to the others who did not follow through You're still our brothers, and we will fight for you
NativeJovian Jupiterian Local from Orlando, FL Since: Mar, 2014 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
Jupiterian Local
#147505: Oct 31st 2016 at 1:22:42 PM

[up][up]No, in July people were mad at him for holding a goddamn press conference to announce his opinion that Clinton was a fuckup, rather than just releasing a statement saying "the evidence does not support filing charges against Secretary Clinton at this time, so we will be recommending against pressing charges against her" like he should have.

This is just the same thing, but worse.

edited 31st Oct '16 1:23:10 PM by NativeJovian

Really from Jupiter, but not an alien.
TacticalFox88 from USA Since: Nov, 2010 Relationship Status: Dating the Doctor
#147506: Oct 31st 2016 at 1:23:25 PM

" An empire toppled by its enemies can rise again. But one which crumbles from within? That's dead... forever."

New Survey coming this weekend!
LeGarcon Blowout soon fellow Stalker from Skadovsk Since: Aug, 2013 Relationship Status: Gay for Big Boss
Blowout soon fellow Stalker
#147507: Oct 31st 2016 at 1:27:16 PM

[up][up][up][up]The guy is actively hiding evidence that Donald Trump is directly collaborating with the Russian government. How is he not with them?

edited 31st Oct '16 1:27:59 PM by LeGarcon

Oh really when?
BestOf FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC! from Finland Since: Oct, 2010 Relationship Status: Falling within your bell curve
FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC!
#147508: Oct 31st 2016 at 1:27:21 PM

In the time it took for me to type that up you just linked him to Russia?

That link is based on the article that was posted on this thread in this page (or maybe the previous one) in which a former FBI employee reveals that Comey had made sure the FBI wouldn't accuse Russia of being the one that hacked Democrat emails, despite the US intelligence services having that consensus.

According to that source (which I don't entirely trust, BTW, because it's just one anonymous former employee) Comey had said that linking Russia to the hack would be wrong because it would influence the election, suggesting that he's fine with hurting Clinton but not Trump.

Quod gratis asseritur, gratis negatur.
Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#147509: Oct 31st 2016 at 1:28:29 PM

Comey knows damn well that Republicans in Congress and the national media are frothing at the mouth for anything that implicates or indicts or even brushes dust in the direction of Hillary Clinton, and the way he handles the release of information indicates that he is intentionally feeding that frenzy.

Withholding information about how Russia is trying to influence the election for "fairness" while playing up Clinton's non-scandals for Congress doesn't exactly scream "unbiased".

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
Greenmantle V from Greater Wessex, Britannia Since: Feb, 2010 Relationship Status: Hiding
V
#147510: Oct 31st 2016 at 1:28:56 PM

@ LeGarcon: And for how long do you think this has been going on? Since the 1930s?

Keep Rolling On
TheWanted Since: Oct, 2013
#147511: Oct 31st 2016 at 1:29:33 PM

It kinda feels like he was screwed either way. Release a statement that the investigation is being reopened or don't and then have to deal with it when it comes out later that this was happening before the election.

Still, accusing him of somehow being in cahoots with Russia this whole time smacks of conspiracy theory territory.

megarockman from The Sixth Borough (Experienced Trainee)
#147512: Oct 31st 2016 at 1:29:50 PM

I thought it might be less "Comey is a Russian asset" and more "Comey is playing political chicken with big car crash = Trump actually winning".

The damned queen and the relentless knight.
Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#147513: Oct 31st 2016 at 1:30:46 PM

[up][up] Well, I don't think that Comey is a Russian agent or anything. That would require proof. But he is playing political chicken, as noted above. Does he really want Donald Trump to be his next boss?

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
TheWanted Since: Oct, 2013
#147514: Oct 31st 2016 at 1:35:17 PM

If Comet really wanted to damage Hillary though, why did he not do so in July?

SeptimusHeap from Switzerland (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Mu
#147515: Oct 31st 2016 at 1:36:10 PM

Cynically: It's much more effective now.

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
BestOf FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC! from Finland Since: Oct, 2010 Relationship Status: Falling within your bell curve
FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC!
#147516: Oct 31st 2016 at 1:37:10 PM

If we trust that source mentioned earlier, Comey's thought process was this:

  • While all US intelligence agencies are linking Russia to the email hack and preparing a statement to that effect, the FBI, according to Comey, should not participate in revealing that information because it would influence the election. (The suggestion, from the Clinton Campaign and others, is that the hacking was specifically meant to influence the election in favour or Trump, which is fairly obvious.)

  • Still, when the Clinton investigation was being reopened just to make sure, basically, that the Weiner emails contained nothing new about Clinton, it was OK for the FBI to reveal it - either because he thought it wouldn't influence the election, or because he wanted to influence the election.

I simply don't see any way to spin this into anything other than Comey condoning Russian agents influencing the US election and wanting to protect that secret, while simultaneously wanting to reveal anything - even inconclusive - that would hurt Clinton.

If he's so worried about transparency and so on, why didn't he join the other agencies in connecting Russia to the hack? Does the FBI have some evidence supporting Russia that the other agencies don't have? This would have to be his defense now; it's the one that would hurt him least.

Quod gratis asseritur, gratis negatur.
LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#147517: Oct 31st 2016 at 1:37:34 PM

Going by here, he announced they didn't really anything on her in the most disparaging way possible. But, bias and all so...

LeGarcon Blowout soon fellow Stalker from Skadovsk Since: Aug, 2013 Relationship Status: Gay for Big Boss
Blowout soon fellow Stalker
#147518: Oct 31st 2016 at 1:38:48 PM

The Russians are backing Trump. Even if he's not a proper asset of theirs they've still got an apparently large hand in his campaign. Comey knows this and he's deliberately hiding evidence of it.

What's more is that he's deliberately trying to get Trump in power. The guy who's being backed by the Russian government.

Ergo, Comey is with the Russians.

Oh really when?
TheWanderer Student of Story from Somewhere in New England (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: Wishfully thinking
Student of Story
#147519: Oct 31st 2016 at 1:40:46 PM

If Comet really wanted to damage Hillary though, why did he not do so in July?

He couldn't because the law she would be charged under literally prevents someone from being charged unless they knowingly and intentionally leak classified material. Insinuations are free and don't need to be proven.

But for everyone panicking, I just saw polls which I can link to later. Clinton’s lead before Comey: 47 to 41. Clinton's lead after Comey: 47 to 41.

edited 31st Oct '16 1:42:25 PM by TheWanderer

| Wandering, but not lost. | If people bring so much courage to this world...◊ |
Greenmantle V from Greater Wessex, Britannia Since: Feb, 2010 Relationship Status: Hiding
V
#147520: Oct 31st 2016 at 1:42:04 PM

@ Garcon: In other words, you're saying there are active agents of the Russian Security Services have infiltrated the US Government, to high levels? In other words, are you saying James Jesus Angleton was correct?

edited 31st Oct '16 1:42:43 PM by Greenmantle

Keep Rolling On
Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#147521: Oct 31st 2016 at 1:44:36 PM

One can be "with the Russians" whilst not actually being in their pay. But I doubt Comey is doing that, either way. He's just a person who wants to see Clinton lose the election, and doesn't apparently care about the consequences of that.

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
kkhohoho (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#147522: Oct 31st 2016 at 1:44:40 PM

[up][up][up]Please do. Because 538's Poll Plus forecast went up from 24% for Trump to 25%-26% in the course of a single day. So you can understand if I'm getting a touch jumpy.tongue

edited 31st Oct '16 1:46:39 PM by kkhohoho

Silasw A procrastination in of itself from A handcart to hell (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
A procrastination in of itself
#147523: Oct 31st 2016 at 1:46:20 PM

@Green that's explicitly not what's he's saying and you seem to be trying to misread it so as to make things more dramatic (a habit of yours I might add).

“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran
FFShinra Since: Jan, 2001
#147524: Oct 31st 2016 at 1:46:47 PM

Again you guys overfocus on the Russians thing. They're trolling the US, but there is enough out there to doubt they give a damn about Trump other than that they know incompetence helps them.

NativeJovian Jupiterian Local from Orlando, FL Since: Mar, 2014 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
Jupiterian Local
#147525: Oct 31st 2016 at 1:49:02 PM

It kinda feels like he was screwed either way. Release a statement that the investigation is being reopened or don't and then have to deal with it when it comes out later that this was happening before the election.
Then he should have taken the option that was actually in line with FBI and DOJ policy — namely, not commenting on ongoing investigations and not doing anything that can be perceived as weighing in on an election. If someone's going to yell at you either way, you might as well do the thing you're supposed to.

If Comet really wanted to damage Hillary though, why did he not do so in July?
He did do so in July. He held a press conference and told the world that he thought that Clinton had been "extremely careless". His job isn't to go on TV and answer questions on his opinion of Clinton. His job is to determine whether what she'd done was illegal or not. What he should have done is sent a letter to the Attorney General's office recommending against prosecution, and otherwise kept his damn mouth shut.

Really from Jupiter, but not an alien.

Total posts: 417,856
Top