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Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM
I wouldn't call UKIP major, at least not yet (if they don't implode).
And we weren't saying that other Western/post colonial settler nations didn't have racial problems. Just that they haven't manifested in the form that they utterly dominate the political landscape
Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.I could probably point to historical examples, such as the United Kingdom and "the Irish Question" (yes, back then the Irish were not considered "white"). If we're really being honest, racial politics flare and die in phases. The US happens to be in the middle of a very bad flare right now.
Your point being? Yes, it's an issue but it's not relevant to what we're talking about. That and you only ever seem to say anything when it involves blanket condemnation of the USA.
edited 26th Oct '16 6:26:18 PM by Elle
UKIP aren't major but the resin they're not is because the stories are by and large holding their racist collective together. The stories are in power in large part because they satisfied their base by promising a referendum, which resulted in Brexit.
A strong UKIP would mean the Tories had sold out their base and the base had gone elsewhere, the current imploding UKIP means that the Tories have satisfied their base enough to avoid them going to UKIP. They satisfied that base with Brexit.
We may have just ripped our nation into two (maybe three) due to our split over racist hatred of Europeans.
edited 26th Oct '16 6:27:13 PM by Silasw
“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran![]()
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That really doesn't apply? Like at all? To anything? Like yes it's certainly true (albeit when not put hyperbolically) and it's certainly interesting, but it has nothing to do with this current situation.
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Oh certainly. It's kind of sad that the US is having such a bad flare right now, but it's definitely opening up discussion for these kinds of racial issues, and I like to believe that the US will become better for all the pains that we're going through right now. There are a lot of racial injustices that are finally coming to light, and the more it's in the news the more that we can take a hard look at what we're doing as a culture and try to change the system for the good of all involved.
Yeah, that's more-or-less what I was getting at (though I don't think I could have put it as well-said)
edited 26th Oct '16 6:30:20 PM by EpicBleye
"There's not a girl alive who wouldn't be happy being called cute." ~Tamamo-no-Mae![]()
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I'm not privy enough about other countries to give detailed examples, but I'm pretty sure that's not the case.
It should be relatively easy to find areas in say, the UK, that vote primarily for the Brexit or UKIP and I doubt they're unexpected there. I'd image other European countries have areas like that as well. If you mean specific strategies to take advantage of that, that just seems like politics.
edited 26th Oct '16 6:38:30 PM by LSBK
I don't think it'll last too long, or at least as long as ours did, considering the Internet, increasing tolerance from millennials and Generation Z, and the almost instant buyer's remorse afterwards, increasing miscegenation and interracial friendships and relationships, etc.
I still have some faith in humanity, despite my cynicism.
New Survey coming this weekend!I feel like it's relevant to mention that the GOP hasn't always been reliant on racism. One can make a case that that started with the Obama administration, since that's when racism became the loudest voice against the dems.
Racists have belonged to the GOP for longer than that, but they weren't in control until recently. Hell, as recently as last year it was possible to pretend that they weren't.
I've never understood the attitude, "Everything isn't perfect now, so humanity is garbage" Nothing is ever going to be perfect, I think the focus should be on the fact that there are always people trying to make things better, not that there's always going to be something wrong/people doing something wrong, and taking that as some indictment humanity or a given population if it is a lost cause that doesn't deserve to exist.
The reason racism is getting so bad right now is because Non Whites will soon be in the majority and a lot of people already know this. Deep down most Americans, even the more patriotic ones, be they Trump supporters, or people like me, believe what Fox says to be true. So they dread that day. They believe that once "in power" the minorities will destroy everything, write a new Constitution, blow up Mount Rushmore to build a monument to the Indians, and apologize to the British for declaring independence. On the more realistic front they fear our identity will be dragged through the dirt and our national culture will be put through a kind of quasi "De Nazificaiton" process like Germany. On a more material level many resent the federal government helping minorities because they feel on an individual level those minorities don't deserve it and they do. More to the point many believe that Blacks and others are not "real Americans", and that the Federal government was elected to take care of "real Americans", i.e White People, but instead it is turning to helping "foreigners", who just happen to be our neighbors and live in our boarders. And with immigrants essentially "replacing them" as "the American people" they feel like their land and culture are being stolen right from under them and that the federal government is complicit in this.
Many Trump supporters,including my Mom, have family members who have served in the Military. They feel like their families have bled and died and believed for this country. They have lived the "traditional", American lifestyle, suppressing various personal desires to conform and "put the nation first." Then in the middle or tail end of their lives they feel like they are being told that the jokes on them and nothing they or their ancestors did mattered, or worse it was evil, and they watch the country they love "be handed over to", immigrants, who they view as free loaders who haven't sacrificed anything and won't assimilate, and Blacks, who they will make up excuses as to why they don't count as real Americans and haven't sacrificed anything, and who they view as by their mere existence an act of subversion against the national identity.
Deep down they know they will loose and they on some level know they deserve to loose. And they know that History will not remember them fondly. This enrages them and drives them to despair.
Now a lot of this, both America being the most prejudiced country on Earth, that honor goes to India, and about non Whites being "out to destroy the country", is flat out wrong, but people feel it and they act accordingly.
Sorry for the long post
Edit: As to why racism is so much worse in the US than the rest of the Anglo Sphere I put it down to several factors.
1 Our ideals: America is the land of the free and the home of the brave. Of course minorities are living testament to how untrue all our pretensions of being a moral nation are. And many hate them for it. I heard someone once said "The Germans will never forgive the Jews for the Holocaust", or rathe making them carry the tremendous burden of guilt for said crimes. These days, and probably in the past, it was and is much the same for Blacks and Slavery.
2 We have more minorities: This leads to more interaction and thus prejudice. When Britain ended slavery it was a nice little act of parliament that made them feel good about themselves then they went off to create the empire. For us it required the discretion for the economy and social structure of a fourth of the country. The more diverse a country is the more racist it is, and often the harder it is to end the racism. This is why the country ranked most racist is India, which also happens to be one of the most diverse countries on Earth.
3 National Pride and Identity: America is the Greatest country in the world they once said. In contrast the British learned their Empire was done long ago and have accepted the fact that it had it's flaws, though Brexit shows their is some of old Britania left their after all. Australia, Canada and New Zealand had no independence struggle, and thus no grand narrative of nationalism. This is especially true of Canada, whose previous identity was "basically British bur right next to the US." Theirfore they lost nothing by ending that identity and embracing multi-culturalism, indeed they gained a certain smug pride standing over the boarder looking over at the US and it's problems. New Zealand can brag about being the least genocidal of all the British settler colonies, and Australia, the ex colony other than the US with the most national pride, is not coincidentally, the most racist.
edited 26th Oct '16 7:50:59 PM by JackOLantern1337
I Bring Doom,and a bit of gloom, but mostly gloom.
X8 We've been pandering to racist anti-Europe sentiment since long before Brexit. Probably since almost 1066 in some manner. The EU has certainly been being hated ever since it came into being and our press have been part of it the whole time.
That's before we get into our issues with the Irish, which date to the Norman invasion of Ireland.
Don't get into a fight about long term racism issues with a nation so much older than you, we've been at this a long time, at least back to whenever we started oppressing the Welsh and stealing their heroes.
edited 26th Oct '16 7:59:39 PM by Silasw
“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran![]()
Britain's age is another reason why it doesn't have to confront it's "original sin", i.e the destruction of the Welsh Irish etc. Because these events occurred a long time ago, and to people who look exactly like the British, most of the populations have assimilated, and thus have stopped pressing the British and their narrative on the issue. Therefore most British people don't mind them. As for the Empire, well that was a big part of, but not the core of who they were as a people. Not to mention it is easier to pawn off most of Britain's guilt onto the various colonies, the Commonwealth Realms,the US,and Apartheid South Africa and Rhodesia. Indeed it allows the British to stand above and act smug and lament that these poor colonials, who were all descendants of England's "refuse populations", criminals and religious "nutters", didn't listen to the much wiser counsel of the mother countries. In this way they feel good about themselves. In short America's mistake on racism was that we didn't have enough time to destroy and assimilate the populations we brutalized, and thus the ugly truth is out their for us and the rest of the world to see.
edited 26th Oct '16 7:56:32 PM by JackOLantern1337
I Bring Doom,and a bit of gloom, but mostly gloom.Are any of us really knowledgeable enough to say which country is the most prejudiced? There are a lot of countries out there, all of which have different issues about people who are different. Can anyone claim to have even a passing knowledge of all of them, not to mention the question of deciding which problems are the worst?
Also: You're kind of being overly reductive of Canada's identity there. A big portion of the Canadian national identity is tied up in the fact that we were a French colony that got conquered by England. Which, for example, meant that when the American revolution happened, we sat back and smugly watched what we saw as two subtly different kind of Englishman kill each other. And in more modern times, it lead to separatism becoming a major movement in Quebec.
edited 26th Oct '16 8:03:41 PM by Gilphon

Actually, KMT (Ancient Egypt) knew very well where the Kingdom of Kush
(them south of them) was... Basically because at least one dynasty of pharaohs came from there. Not to mention a lot of trade negotiations, wars, marriage alliances, god-swaps, two-way cultural appropriation...
Sorry, but... no on the Nubia. Don't confuse the Greco-Romans with KMT. The Ptolemaic dynasty was the tail-end of a long, long association with Kush.
edited 26th Oct '16 6:20:27 PM by Euodiachloris