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Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM

KarkatTheDalek Not as angry as the name would suggest. from Somwhere in Time/Space Since: Mar, 2012 Relationship Status: You're a beautiful woman, probably
Not as angry as the name would suggest.
#146576: Oct 26th 2016 at 11:27:54 AM

I don't want to give him views. What is it?

Oh God! Natural light!
AlleyOop Since: Oct, 2010
#146577: Oct 26th 2016 at 11:29:56 AM

In some more lighthearted news, Pepe reclamation. Not sure how well that'll work as Boys' Club was always kind of a gross-out comic even if it was chill, but the art is cute.

theLibrarian Since: Jul, 2009
#146578: Oct 26th 2016 at 11:33:25 AM

Yeah, one of my professors, another student, and I were talking today about how the election was apparently bringing out the worst in everyone.

Clarste One Winged Egret Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
One Winged Egret
#146579: Oct 26th 2016 at 11:51:23 AM

Well, "most" is a loaded word.

I know, I know, I should give them the benefit of the doubt, but when you look at all these scandals it's just disgusting. Humoring a fake Chinese donator for bribes? Intentionally sabotaging elections while accusing the other party of doing the same? And, well, literally anything Trump does, has done, or will do. Like, he doesn't pay his workers because he knows settling lawsuits will be cheaper for him. That's not even a scandal: it's just something he does publicly. Meanwhile, on the other side, Clinton... may have mishandled her emails, technically, but no harm was done? How is that even on the same scale of ethics?

Throw in all the party's blatant homo/islamo/xenophobia, misogyny, racism... I just find it really really difficult to believe that these are people who possess empathy.

edited 26th Oct '16 11:52:11 AM by Clarste

LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#146580: Oct 26th 2016 at 11:55:11 AM

[up]I find that generalizations make things easier so long as you remember to turn them off with actual individuals, just because of the sheer number of them.

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#146581: Oct 26th 2016 at 12:01:48 PM

[up]x5 Long story short, a badly edited attempt to make it seem like the Clinton campaign accepted 20 grand from a foreign donor, or was willing to accept it from one.

edited 26th Oct '16 12:02:11 PM by M84

Disgusted, but not surprised
thatguythere47 Since: Jul, 2010
#146582: Oct 26th 2016 at 12:04:44 PM

I find it interesting that the debates moved things so dramatically. Looking back before the first most quality polls had clinton at 1 point up but most have her sitting at six/seven since and not budging much. That's insane. A six point boost from a debate has to be a record.

I'm also really curious why it took that. The needle movement seems to have been all from undecideds finally deciding. Did it really take putting the two right next to each other for it to click that trump was nuts?

Is using "Julian Assange is a Hillary butt plug" an acceptable signature quote?
Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#146583: Oct 26th 2016 at 12:05:48 PM

Functionally, politics in today's United States is so factional that a certain ratio of the population will never cross the line to vote for someone of the other party no matter what, and will make up any rationalization needed to support that decision. At worst, they will stay home rather than cast their vote for a candidate they cannot support.

edited 26th Oct '16 12:06:08 PM by Fighteer

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
FFShinra Since: Jan, 2001
#146584: Oct 26th 2016 at 12:06:12 PM

Just gonna say I disagree with Fighteer on his portrayal of the Bush family as a whole. But thats no surprise, either in my disagreement or Fighteer villifiying everyone with an R beside their name.

Anyway, as another poster said about GHWB, he was an icy pro-American imperialist. But I'd say his good side was he had class and was also pretty honest about why and what he was doing. Doesn't sound like much, but if you bear in mind that most complaints about the US are less to do with imperialism than it does with the fact that America keeps trying to couch it as anything but that. They hate the hypocrisy of it all.

I'd also not quite call Dubya an idiot. He had his issues, all of which have been enumerated time and again, but the cause of them has more to do with his governing style (the same way Obama's issues also have to do mostly with his governing style rather than naivete) in that Bush let his cabinet run amok with only their rivals providing oversight. Even on the WMD lie, it had been a pitched battle between the Condi-Powell faction and the Rumsfeld-Cheney faction in trying to convince the president what the right facts were. It's very likely he was as duped about WM Ds as Clinton and other members of congress were....he just had less of an excuse to be.

Jeb, being the wonk of the family, would have basically been a male, Republican Hil. Kinda awkward, more interested in governing than pressing flesh, generally moderate or at least flexible. I do hope he tries again, next cycle. He'd have learned from his mistakes, the Bush years would be even further behind, and the "Deep Bench" would be a lot less so among his competitors.

Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#146585: Oct 26th 2016 at 12:07:56 PM

I don't inherently give a damn if you have a "D" or an "R" next to your name, as long as you espouse sensible political positions. That said, if you do have an "R", and you don't vote in lock-step with your party's ideology, you're very likely to get primaried out. Like it or not, the modern Republican party stands for intolerable and even genocidal positions on most issues.

We aren't in an apples-to-apples comparison here. Given Trump as their candidate, many of the reasonable Republicans have already jumped ship. Those that remain have no excuses, however.


Also, the Bush family's record in private life is mediocrity and/or failure at everything they try, a legacy they have taken with them into elected office. They aren't bad, in the sense that the carpet in my living room isn't bad. But putting it in a position of power basically means that it gets walked on by everyone with a real agenda, and thus we have Cheney and Rumsfeld running the show for Bush 43.

edited 26th Oct '16 12:12:06 PM by Fighteer

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
Rationalinsanity from Halifax, Canada Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
#146586: Oct 26th 2016 at 12:09:20 PM

Jeb might not be awful, but wouldn't be bring in his family's inner circle (who very much are, for the most part, awful) with him? Sure, he wouldn't be as malleable as his brother but those are some nasty voice to have near the throne.

Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.
Greenmantle V from Greater Wessex, Britannia Since: Feb, 2010 Relationship Status: Hiding
V
#146587: Oct 26th 2016 at 12:09:48 PM

@ Fighteer:

To tweak a quote:

"When you play for the Presidency, you win, or you die. There is no middle ground."

smile

edited 26th Oct '16 12:10:14 PM by Greenmantle

Keep Rolling On
Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#146588: Oct 26th 2016 at 12:13:47 PM

[up][up] Yes, Jeb! tried to distinguish himself from his brother's abject failure of an administration by bringing in almost literally the exact same advisory team and trying to run a campaign as "Bush 45". Now, maybe he's a nice guy in person. Maybe his true political beliefs aren't as dumb as those of the party that he seeks to represent. But his record in office and the things he said in the primary are not indicative of the kind of person who belongs in the White House, nor is even particularly enthusiastic about seeking it. "Please clap."

edited 26th Oct '16 12:15:21 PM by Fighteer

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
blkwhtrbbt The Dragon of the Eastern Sea from Doesn't take orders from Vladimir Putin Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
The Dragon of the Eastern Sea
#146589: Oct 26th 2016 at 12:14:07 PM

I'm pretty sure losers of the Presidential office aren't summarily executed for treason.

Also, can we stop referring to the Oval Office as a "throne"? I've always been kind of averse to authoritarian politics, except where government regulation of corporations applies, and referring to "the throne" in any tone other than critical or ironic seriously creeps me out

Say to the others who did not follow through You're still our brothers, and we will fight for you
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#146590: Oct 26th 2016 at 12:15:27 PM

George HW Bush had his faults, but at least he had a spine. Unlike his sons.

At least Dubya and Jeb had some decency and empathy, unlike their creepy relative Billy Bush.

Disgusted, but not surprised
Rationalinsanity from Halifax, Canada Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
#146591: Oct 26th 2016 at 12:17:40 PM

[up][up]I meant it as in terms of advisors being powerful voices near (or behind in W's case) the center of authority. It works even in democratic models.

Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.
Wildcard Since: Jun, 2012
#146592: Oct 26th 2016 at 12:20:59 PM

Guys I am a little scared about Donald Trump getting elected. I'm ready to vote against it, but even in my town which is in a Northern State I sometimes see Trump signs or people exclaiming "He's not that bad". I know the polls and lots of people are summarily against him, but I think Reagan set a precedent for not so great entertainers to go into politics and be awful about them. I think we could survive four or even eight years of Trump but I don't want to deal with it.I sure wouldn't want anything Trump says he is gonna implement be implemented. Anything that will help me feel better?

Edit: Edited for spelling and grammar, was in a rush when I first wrote it.

edited 26th Oct '16 2:09:10 PM by Wildcard

blkwhtrbbt The Dragon of the Eastern Sea from Doesn't take orders from Vladimir Putin Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
The Dragon of the Eastern Sea
#146593: Oct 26th 2016 at 12:23:52 PM

Remember that the American Government is more than one man. Remember that you can always vote for Congress, which has the legislative power and power of impeachment. Remember that the other two branches of government hold tight leashes on the presidency.

Say to the others who did not follow through You're still our brothers, and we will fight for you
Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#146594: Oct 26th 2016 at 12:26:28 PM

[up][up] Well, the aggregate polling data (RealClearPolitics) has Clinton up by 4.9% in the national popular vote, which equates to a massive electoral sweep. FiveThirtyEight gives Clinton an 85% chance of winning the election.

So, it's not quite at "stick a fork in it" levels, but the election is pretty much over by historical standards.

edited 26th Oct '16 12:26:35 PM by Fighteer

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
SeptimusHeap from Switzerland (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Mu
#146595: Oct 26th 2016 at 12:36:11 PM

So, today it's Hillary's birthday as well.

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
TacticalFox88 from USA Since: Nov, 2010 Relationship Status: Dating the Doctor
#146596: Oct 26th 2016 at 12:47:03 PM

Had a guy tell me today with a straight face. "Man, fuck, if Elizabeth Warren were running, she'd be up 15, maybe 20 points right now!"

His reasoning?

"Did you not see the polls they did?!"

Cue my epic Facepalm

New Survey coming this weekend!
KarkatTheDalek Not as angry as the name would suggest. from Somwhere in Time/Space Since: Mar, 2012 Relationship Status: You're a beautiful woman, probably
Not as angry as the name would suggest.
#146597: Oct 26th 2016 at 12:49:26 PM
sgamer82 Since: Jan, 2001
Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#146599: Oct 26th 2016 at 12:52:19 PM

There were polls during the primaries pitting a variety of Democratic candidates against a variety of Republican candidates and most of them put Hillary as the least competitive against the Republican field of major figures including Warren, Biden, and Sanders. But this was largely because those others had never been tested on a national level and we didn't already have all the "oppo" about them as part of the general public conversation.

Believe me, Republicans were sharpening their stakes in gleeful anticipation for all of the mud they would have flung at Sanders.

That said, I'd have been super happy to see Warren go for it, but she didn't.

edited 26th Oct '16 12:53:25 PM by Fighteer

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
FFShinra Since: Jan, 2001
#146600: Oct 26th 2016 at 12:54:33 PM

Warren seems fine as a Senator honestly. She has her focuses and passions, which the Senate allows her to pursue, but like Sanders, she has nothing of note on foreign policy beyond Dem boilerplates.


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