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Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM

Discar Since: Jun, 2009
#145701: Oct 21st 2016 at 12:46:57 PM

They've done similar ads for other scandals. Like the one where a US Army vet who got the Purple Heart in Vietnam watches Trump insulting vets who won the Purple Heart.

Writing a post-post apocalypse LitRPG on RR. Also fanfic stuff.
Mio Since: Jan, 2001
#145702: Oct 21st 2016 at 12:54:31 PM

Still seems a bit late in the game to be bringing them out, especially when many people have likely forgotten who they are by now.

KarkatTheDalek Not as angry as the name would suggest. from Somwhere in Time/Space Since: Mar, 2012 Relationship Status: You're a beautiful woman, probably
Not as angry as the name would suggest.
#145703: Oct 21st 2016 at 12:59:17 PM

Well, I think that video explained who they were pretty well.

Oh God! Natural light!
BearyScary Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: You spin me right round, baby
#145704: Oct 21st 2016 at 1:09:39 PM

I wonder if some people hate Hillary because they think they're supposed to.

Do not obey in advance.
AceofSpades Since: Apr, 2009 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
#145705: Oct 21st 2016 at 1:17:11 PM

Somehow I doubt many people have forgotten. And, this close to the election is a perfect time to bring it back out, to remind people what a jerk Trump is and what kind of racist bullshit he's willing to pander to.

CrimsonZephyr Would that it were so simple. from Massachusetts Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
Would that it were so simple.
#145706: Oct 21st 2016 at 1:41:45 PM

[up][up]I think, in everyday political exchanges between people who don't know a whole lot about politics, saying you hate Hillary gives your opinion instant credibility. I think it's partly out of misogyny, but due to broader trends, like America's hatred of all politicians (except their politician, who is the Only Sane Man), the obsession with being a political independent, and a great liking for mindless cynicism of the "both sides are corrupt" flavor, such that Hillary's image is so often molded to fit the image of a stereotypical Corrupt Politician that the actual truth starts sounding false.

"For all those whose cares have been our concern, the work goes on, the cause endures, the hope still lives, and the dream shall never die."
Draghinazzo (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
#145707: Oct 21st 2016 at 1:45:42 PM

"Mindless cynicism" is an apt descriptor for a lot of people's attitudes regarding politicians, and it transcends cultural boundaries.

It's easy to say "both candidates are horrible" and have that be an acceptable position to many people, because it makes you look like a critical independent without having to actually do much measuring of candidates' strengths and weaknesses against each other.

Not being overly fond of Hillary is one thing, but equating her to Trump is supremely ignorant and shows that you're probably not in the groups that would suffer the most were he to win.

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#145708: Oct 21st 2016 at 1:47:44 PM

[up] "shows that you're probably not in the groups that would suffer the most were he to win."

Granted, if an insufferable thin-skinned bigoted manchild like Trump became POTUS, I'm pretty sure we'd all be screwed.

Disgusted, but not surprised
Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#145709: Oct 21st 2016 at 1:50:22 PM

Timothy Dolan is a lying hack and a national disgrace both to the US and the Vatican. I couldn't care less what he claims.

sgamer82 Since: Jan, 2001
#145710: Oct 21st 2016 at 1:54:58 PM

http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSKCN12L2O2

    "Half of Republicans would reject election result if Clinton wins: Reuters/Ipsos" 
Donald Trump has repeatedly called this year's presidential election rigged and has coyly said "I will keep you in suspense” on whether he would accept a Hillary Clinton victory, but many Republicans are less circumspect, according to a new poll.

Only half of Republicans would accept Clinton, the Democratic nominee, as their president. And if she wins, nearly 70 percent said it would be because of illegal voting or vote rigging, according to a Reuters/Ipsos poll released on Friday.

Conversely, seven out of 10 Democrats said they would accept a Trump victory and less than 50 percent would attribute it to illegal voting or vote rigging, the poll showed.

The findings come after repeated statements by Trump that the media and the political establishment have rigged the election against him. He also has made a number of statements encouraging his supporters to fan out on Election Day to stop illegible voters from casting ballots.

The U.S. government has accused Russia of a campaign of cyber attacks against Democratic Party organizations and state election systems.

Clinton has said she will accept the results of the election no matter the outcome.

The poll showed there is broad concern across the political spectrum about voting issues such as ineligible voters casting ballots, voter suppression, and the actual vote count, but Republicans feel that concern more acutely.

For example, nearly eight out of 10 Republicans are concerned about the accuracy of the final vote count. And though generally they believe they will be able to cast their ballot, only six out of 10 are confident their vote will be counted accurately.

Among Democrats, about six out of 10 are concerned about the vote count. They, too, believe they wi1l be able to cast their ballot, but eight out of 10 are confident their vote will be counted accurately.

"Republicans are just more worried about everything than Democrats," said Lonna Atkeson, a professor at the University of New Mexico and head of the Center for the Study of Voting, Elections, and Democracy.

FLEE THE COUNTRY?

Additionally, seven out of 10 Republicans are concerned about issues such as vote buying, faulty voting machines, or confusing ballot designs. Six out of 10 Democrats feel the same way.

Nearly eight out of 10 Republicans are concerned that ineligible voters, including non-citizens, will illegally cast ballots. Four out of 10 Democrats feel the same way.

Six out of 10 respondents, regardless of party, say they are concerned about issues such as voter intimidation and suppression.

Atkeson said the level of concern and mistrust in the system, especially among Republicans, is unprecedented.

“I’ve never seen an election like this. Not in my lifetime. Certainly not in modern history.” The difference, she said, is Trump. “It has to be the candidate effect.”

She worries that the lack of trust is dangerous. It is one thing to not trust government, but quite another to doubt the election process. “Then the entire premise of democracy comes into question,” she said.

About one in five Democrats said they would protest if their candidate loses. Slightly fewer Republicans said they would do the same. Fewer than one in 10 Democrats said they are prepared to take up arms in opposition compared to fewer than one in 20 Republicans.

Democrats are also are three times as likely to say they would leave the country.

There is one area where there is little disagreement: Most people do not expect the losing candidate to concede the race gracefully.

The poll surveyed 1,192 American adults online from Oct. 17 to 21. The results have a credibility interval of plus or minus 3.3 percentage points. The credibility interval for Democrats is 5.1 percentage points; for Republicans it is 5.5 points.

edited 21st Oct '16 1:55:36 PM by sgamer82

Draghinazzo (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
#145711: Oct 21st 2016 at 1:55:13 PM

[up][up][up] That's true but him winning would be validation for the white supremacists and mysogynists who have surged up as a response to his campaign, and the ones who will suffer most from that are minorities.

There's also a pervasive and extremely annoying "golden means fallacy" where many people seem to be under the impression that the right hasn't become increasingly indefensible morally. The alt-right's behavior and tenets are unacceptably horrendous, and the mainstream republican politicians have only continued to enable their and Trump's behavior by backing him only until it became politically inconvenient to do so.

Had the Trump tapes not made the light of day, I doubt many of them would have recanted and abandoned him the way they did.

edited 21st Oct '16 1:55:27 PM by Draghinazzo

Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#145712: Oct 21st 2016 at 1:58:04 PM

Hating Hillary as much as Donald doesn't make you one of the cool kids; it makes you one of the people who are too smugly lazy to apply critical thinking skills to politics.

edited 21st Oct '16 1:58:24 PM by Fighteer

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
CrimsonZephyr Would that it were so simple. from Massachusetts Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
Would that it were so simple.
#145713: Oct 21st 2016 at 2:01:43 PM

I'm actually rather proud that I managed to convince a woman who thought "both sides are equally bad" that it was a false equivalence and incorrect.

"For all those whose cares have been our concern, the work goes on, the cause endures, the hope still lives, and the dream shall never die."
CaptainCapsase from Orbiting Sagittarius A* Since: Jan, 2015
#145714: Oct 21st 2016 at 2:05:21 PM

[up][up] Yes, but you can dislike both without equating them.

BearyScary Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: You spin me right round, baby
#145715: Oct 21st 2016 at 2:06:55 PM

Both sides have their problems and corrupt members.

Do not obey in advance.
LeGarcon Blowout soon fellow Stalker from Skadovsk Since: Aug, 2013 Relationship Status: Gay for Big Boss
Blowout soon fellow Stalker
#145716: Oct 21st 2016 at 2:07:45 PM

That Reuters poll is pretty worrying.

Oh really when?
Parable Since: Aug, 2009
#145717: Oct 21st 2016 at 2:07:56 PM

But since when has that not been the case?

Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#145718: Oct 21st 2016 at 2:09:12 PM

"I don't like school," said the cool kid smoking a half-foot outside the grounds.

"Me neither," said the other cool kid, lighting up his third. "They have all these rules and they try to make you learn stuff, and all those nerds suck up to the teachers. Fuck school."

"You know what else I don't like? Getting raped and murdered by that gang that hangs out on the other side of the street."

"Yeah, that's kind of sucky. Those stupid teachers keep warning us about them, but fuck teachers, right?"

"Hey, Josh is getting raped and murdered over there. Should we get the teachers' help?"

"Nah, I'm cool. They'll make us stop smoking and hang out with the nerds and they'll try to teach us 'facts' and shit. Shame about Josh, though."

edited 21st Oct '16 2:13:18 PM by Fighteer

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
CrimsonZephyr Would that it were so simple. from Massachusetts Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
Would that it were so simple.
#145719: Oct 21st 2016 at 2:13:34 PM

"Yes, but you can dislike both without equating them."

You can, but if you're being realistic, ultimately, you have to choose if you care about the outcome.

"Both sides have their problems and corrupt members."

Well, I mean, duh. Of course they do. I don't think anyone's making the claim that there isn't any corruption in one of the parties. But they're not the same, and if you think that the GOP is politically horrible, you can't say the same about the Democrats — in this era of partisanship, that claim is intellectually dishonest given their diametric opposition.

edited 21st Oct '16 2:16:30 PM by CrimsonZephyr

"For all those whose cares have been our concern, the work goes on, the cause endures, the hope still lives, and the dream shall never die."
BearyScary Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: You spin me right round, baby
#145720: Oct 21st 2016 at 2:29:46 PM

I don't think they're very equivalent. I thought about it, and I think I just accepted the "both sides are horrible" argument without thinking criticality about it for myself.

But I really don't think they're the same.

Do not obey in advance.
Draghinazzo (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
#145721: Oct 21st 2016 at 2:35:53 PM

One party is backing a white supremacist and mysogynist, and not only that, but he's actually super stupid and incompetent.

It's pretty hard to go down from there for the Dems, who aren't perfect but then again who is?

kkhohoho (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#145722: Oct 21st 2016 at 2:36:48 PM

Well, according to the Reuters's poll, only 1 in 20 Republicans said they would actually take up arms if their candidate lost, so maybe things won't be as bad as some think they might be if Trump doesn't concede. That said, 'won't be as bad' isn't the same as 'not bad at all', so it's still a bit worrying.

LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#145723: Oct 21st 2016 at 2:40:06 PM

Yes, but you can dislike both without equating them.

You can, but how many people actually do. Acting as if they're the same just makes things so much easier.

edited 21st Oct '16 2:40:36 PM by LSBK

Elle Since: Jan, 2001
#145724: Oct 21st 2016 at 2:45:17 PM

Lightysnake, do you have any factual basis for calling Cardnal Dolan a lying snake? I don't exactly follow the activity of Catholic leadership but the most I can be sure of he is that he is conservative on the things Catholics tend to be conservative about. Maybe you're talking about the things he was accused of in dealing with the fallout of priest sexual abuse scandal?

Draghinazzo (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
#145725: Oct 21st 2016 at 2:46:04 PM

My brother is actually one of the rare ones. He doesn't like Hillary much but said that he would vote for her against Trump if we were US citizens.


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