TVTropes Now available in the app store!
Open

Follow TV Tropes

Following

The General US Politics Thread

Go To

Nov 2023 Mod notice:


There may be other, more specific, threads about some aspects of US politics, but this one tends to act as a hub for all sorts of related news and information, so it's usually one of the busiest OTC threads.

If you're new to OTC, it's worth reading the Introduction to On-Topic Conversations and the On-Topic Conversations debate guidelines before posting here.

Rumor-based, fear-mongering and/or inflammatory statements that damage the quality of the thread will be thumped. Off-topic posts will also be thumped. Repeat offenders may be suspended.

If time spent moderating this thread remains a distraction from moderation of the wiki itself, the thread will need to be locked. We want to avoid that, so please follow the forum rules when posting here.


In line with the general forum rules, 'gravedancing' is prohibited here. If you're celebrating someone's death or hoping that they die, your post will get thumped. This rule applies regardless of what the person you're discussing has said or done.

Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM

LeGarcon Blowout soon fellow Stalker from Skadovsk Since: Aug, 2013 Relationship Status: Gay for Big Boss
Blowout soon fellow Stalker
#142976: Oct 10th 2016 at 7:58:45 AM

Trump really is such a misogynist that he thinks he's competing against Bill.

Oh really when?
Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#142977: Oct 10th 2016 at 8:04:09 AM

[up][up] Common Core (which Pennsylvania, my home state, uses) is basically a unified curriculum that sets forth the educational objectives for each grade. Students should know X, Y, and Z science and social studies facts; they should be able to do A, B, and C math exercises; they should be able to read at a particular level, and so on. Nothing objectionable about it per se, but for some reason it keeps drawing ridiculous levels of outrage. Apparently every school district should decide independently what to teach children? We're all such rampaging individualists that setting out universal standards for education is an infringement on our freedoms? I can't grasp the logic.

edited 10th Oct '16 8:05:00 AM by Fighteer

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
BonsaiForest Since: Jan, 2001
#142978: Oct 10th 2016 at 8:08:29 AM

Donald Trump's Debate Win Propels Him Toward White - House Breitbart News

From Google News' list of headlines. [lol]

Is this why Trump supporters may riot if Trump loses? Because they've been told again and again that no, he's actually winning?

BestOf FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC! from Finland Since: Oct, 2010 Relationship Status: Falling within your bell curve
FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC!
#142979: Oct 10th 2016 at 8:09:51 AM

The first negative reaction I saw to Common Core was about how it included a new (or at least new-ish) method for doing division with pen and paper. Basically, you're arranging the two figures differently and doing a slightly different thing to get to the result than you would have with previous methods. I took a look at it and saw that (at least to me) it looked like it would work. I can't say whether it's more intuitive or easier to use than any other method, so my overall reaction was: "why should anyone complain about this?"

Usually, in the US, the problem with new standards is that people object to some of the content. IIRC the Common Core complaints, at least with history, were about how negative aspects of US history were introduced that were previously not always included in every textbook. Obviously, teaching children about the true history of the country, rather than a fantasy, is fundamentally wrong. A similar, much more prevalent, issue exists with natural history; namely, evolution. That, of course, should be left out because scientific truths are less important than religious myths.

For serious people who care about teaching children facts and critical thinking, I really haven't heard of a good argument against Common Core. There may very well be good criticisms of it, but all that I've seen have been just blatantly and obviously idiotic.

Quod gratis asseritur, gratis negatur.
LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#142980: Oct 10th 2016 at 8:14:04 AM

Has Trump forgotten that he isn't running against Bill? Or is he just such a chauvinist that he thinks that Hillary is nothing but an extension of her husband? Or is he projecting his own insecurities of being "cucked" on to Hillary Clinton?

Well, I think it's a fairly common thing for people to think her entire career is because of who she's married to, so that might not be too far off.

edited 10th Oct '16 8:14:26 AM by LSBK

Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#142981: Oct 10th 2016 at 8:17:15 AM

I like that Common Core explores alternative methods of arriving at solutions to math problems. I recognized them instantly as the kinds of mental shortcuts that I myself employ to rapidly solve problems without pencil and paper. My wife, on the other hand, got really annoyed by them because she doesn't have mental math strategies and relies on rote memorization. My son, who has ADHD, finds them frustrating because he has a hard time learning alternative approaches.

One can see in this exactly where the challenge lies with teaching strategies for problem solving. Some people literally don't understand the concepts.


Back to the election, I'm seeing some interesting posts on my Facebook feed — one is a Mic.com article that captures the tweets of many women about their first experiences with sexual predators and sexual assault, so they can't be dismissed as "mere statistics". The first one is a woman who describes having her crotch groped by an old man on a bus when she was 12.

These people exist. They are defilers and they cannot be allowed to be an accepted part of our culture. Trump represents them.

edited 10th Oct '16 8:31:33 AM by Fighteer

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
tclittle Professional Forum Ninja from Somewhere Down in Texas Since: Apr, 2010
Professional Forum Ninja
#142982: Oct 10th 2016 at 8:36:09 AM

"We're all paper, we're all scissors, we're all fightin' with our mirrors, scared we'll never find somebody to love."
TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#142983: Oct 10th 2016 at 8:39:20 AM

One other thing on the Trump tape thing, apparently #Not All Men has been trending at one point, thing is it's not directed at women complaining about sexual assault, it's being directed at the Trump supporters claiming that what Trump said was something all men say.

That is actually a really good use of the reviled hashtag. [tup] Just reading through, I really liked this one:

"Pro tip: u can't say #NotAllMen when women discuss rape culture & ALSO say Trumps comments are how ALL men speak n private."

I'm very sure Hillary won this debate - Trump came off as deranged and at times like he was having a health crisis.

That's how I felt too. I mean, between threatening to throw her in jail and coming up behind her to try and physically intimidate her, he came off as a dangerous lunatic. If he keeps this up, by the third debate, we might actually see him physically attack her.

Despite - and partially because of - Russia's best efforts, I think it's pretty clear at this point that Trump's screwed.

So Pence says that he has no intention of dropping out, and that the rumors were false.

That's what I figured. "Mike Pence just announced he's quitting the race" is a funny joke when it immediately follows Trump backhanding Pence's attempt at correcting his public image. I could totally see Trevor Noah or Stephen Colbert making a crack like that in a segment on their show. It's just that Twitter doesn't have Joking Mode tags, so people thought it was serious.

Back to the election, I'm seeing some interesting posts on my Facebook feed — one is a Mic.com article that captures the tweets of many women about their first experiences with sexual predators and sexual assault, so they can't be dismissed as "mere statistics". The first one is a woman who describes having her crotch groped by an old man on a bus when she was 12.

These people exist. They are defilers and they cannot be allowed to be an accepted part of our culture. Trump represents them.

Indeed. In fact, I would say they're a lot of the guys who talk about this shit in locker rooms. If someone thinks that what Trump was saying is "ordinary guy talk" and nothing scandalous to be concerned about, maybe that person needs to spend some time with a few Don't Be That Guy posters.

Laughing, joking, and swapping stories about sexual assault may certainly be "normal" to some men, but you know what else is "normal" to some men? Performing sexual assault. I highly doubt the two are unrelated.

edited 10th Oct '16 8:40:47 AM by TobiasDrake

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
Greenmantle V from Greater Wessex, Britannia Since: Feb, 2010 Relationship Status: Hiding
V
#142984: Oct 10th 2016 at 8:52:27 AM

That's how I felt too. I mean, between threatening to throw her in jail and coming up behind her to try and physically intimidate her, he came off as a dangerous lunatic. If he keeps this up, by the third debate, we might actually see him physically attack her.

What might happen then? I guess the Secret Service details would get involved, and Trump would get tazered/shot?

Keep Rolling On
BestOf FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC! from Finland Since: Oct, 2010 Relationship Status: Falling within your bell curve
FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC!
#142985: Oct 10th 2016 at 8:59:19 AM

The first one is a woman who describes having her crotch groped by an old man on a bus when she was 12.

Speaking of 12-year-old sexual violence victims...

Yeah, that's not a great way to start a post, is it?

Anyway, one of the women involved in Trump's PR stunt before the debate was the victim in a rape trial. She was 12 at the time she was raped. The reason Trump wanted her there (and apparently Breitbart actually paid for her travel expenses to make sure she gets there, being the true neutral news source that they so clearly are) was that Clinton was actually the defense lawyer for the suspect. This is supposed to be a mark against her.

I read up a bit on this case. Apprently she was a public defense attorney at the time, and was assigned the case after the suspect specifically requested a female lawyer to defend him. There were about half a dozen available at the time, and the case happened to land on Clinton. She requested to have someone else do it, but the judge didn't agree to that request so Clinton went ahead and did a (by all accounts) good job of defending him. They still lost the case, and the guy did end up in jail.

(So while I was calling him the "suspect" because that's the term I always use when I'm discussing legal cases, the fact the case was resolved like this means I could just as well have used the term "perpetrator". I don't want to get in the habit of doing that, though, because it might make me more likely to slip that term where it doesn't belong.)

That someone would posit that a public defense lawyer working on an icky case, and working well, should count against that lawyer is, in my opinion, absolutely disgusting and fundamentally against the values that basically all Western countries - the US included - stand for. You must offer every defendant a fair trial, and that includes a competent lawyer who will try to win the case. That must be how the system works, or it doesn't work.

Of course, Trump was already openly opposed to a fair court system, as evidenced by the way he discussed the New Jersey/New York bomber who was arrested recently.

The bad part: now we will give him amazing hospitalisation. [...] And on top of all of that he will be represented by an outstanding lawyer.

Quod gratis asseritur, gratis negatur.
Rationalinsanity from Halifax, Canada Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
#142986: Oct 10th 2016 at 8:59:42 AM

[up][up]I'm guessing they'd physically control him rather quickly. Unless he grabbed a sharp object or something...

edited 10th Oct '16 9:00:07 AM by Rationalinsanity

Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#142987: Oct 10th 2016 at 8:59:46 AM

[up] It'd be hilarious if Hillary punched him out herself. So much for "low stamina".

[up][up] Everyone hates defense attorneys. Until they need one themselves. You'd think a guy who gets sued as often as Trump would be more appreciative of lawyers.

edited 10th Oct '16 9:01:59 AM by M84

Disgusted, but not surprised
Silasw A procrastination in of itself from A handcart to hell (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
A procrastination in of itself
#142988: Oct 10th 2016 at 9:02:44 AM

Going back to US education for a second, remember that while funding for a district might not be an issue you also have to look the distribution of funds, most other western nations don't have schools perform so much sports based education, so US school actually may need bigger budgets than one would otherwise think, because they 'have' to pay not just for standard education but also the money sink for an expensive football team.

“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran
GameGuruGG Vampire Hunter from Castlevania (Before Recorded History)
Vampire Hunter
#142989: Oct 10th 2016 at 9:05:36 AM

I like that Common Core explores alternative methods of arriving at solutions to math problems. I recognized them instantly as the kinds of mental shortcuts that I myself employ to rapidly solve problems without pencil and paper. My wife, on the other hand, got really annoyed by them because she doesn't have mental math strategies and relies on rote memorization. My son, who has ADHD, finds them frustrating because he has a hard time learning alternative approaches.

One can see in this exactly where the challenge lies with teaching strategies for problem solving. Some people literally don't understand the concepts.

I think that might be the ultimate problem with any attempt to streamline education... People have different ways of learning. For example, I myself am good at rote memorization, but I am also good at solving problems and being able to focus. I never needed a mnemonic to remember the order of what was then the nine planets, and even today, I can still name the eight planets from memory. However, that's only the best system for me, and other people can have a totally different way of learning.

edited 10th Oct '16 9:57:37 AM by GameGuruGG

Wizard Needs Food Badly
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#142990: Oct 10th 2016 at 9:05:38 AM

[up][up] High schools do NOT need massive stadiums. Heck, I'm not sure colleges need them. Oh hell with it, do cities really need them?

I'm not a huge sports fan in case you can't tell.

edited 10th Oct '16 9:07:21 AM by M84

Disgusted, but not surprised
TacticalFox88 from USA Since: Nov, 2010 Relationship Status: Dating the Doctor
#142991: Oct 10th 2016 at 9:09:02 AM

Hillary leading Trump by 14(!!!) in latest NBC/WSJ poll

Holy fuck

New Survey coming this weekend!
TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#142992: Oct 10th 2016 at 9:14:54 AM

Sounds about right. Between "Grab 'em by the pussy!" and this latest debate, Trump's due for a nosedive.

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
Kostya (Unlucky Thirteen)
#142993: Oct 10th 2016 at 9:15:30 AM

Sports should not be siphoning money from actual classes. Ideally they'd be self funding through tickets and concession stand sales. Also stadiums are an idiotic idea for a high school. You just need a good sized field and some bleachers.

Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#142994: Oct 10th 2016 at 9:16:21 AM

Slowly watching sanity returning to the American electorate is like a breath of fresh air.

The emphasis on sports programs in American education, however, is a major drain on education resources.

edited 10th Oct '16 9:17:30 AM by Fighteer

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
Rationalinsanity from Halifax, Canada Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
#142995: Oct 10th 2016 at 9:16:27 AM

[up][up][up]That poll probably didn't factor in the debate yet...

edited 10th Oct '16 9:16:42 AM by Rationalinsanity

Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.
Mio Since: Jan, 2001
#142996: Oct 10th 2016 at 9:18:48 AM

It's often the case that sports pulls in a lot of money and so districts and the schools will fund the thing that "makes the most profit" (this is even more true at the collegiate level).

Also local sports is big in many areas. Trying to take that away would be political suicide for many School Board members.

Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#142997: Oct 10th 2016 at 9:19:59 AM

Sports programs are net money-makers only for the most successful schools. Everyone else is forced to drain their coffers in order to strive to be competitive. Part of the blame, of course, lies on the emphasis on sports programs as a way to attract students and keep alumni involved.

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
LeGarcon Blowout soon fellow Stalker from Skadovsk Since: Aug, 2013 Relationship Status: Gay for Big Boss
Blowout soon fellow Stalker
#142998: Oct 10th 2016 at 9:20:26 AM

Mine has a big ass stadium and a few other fields. All at the cost of things like art and afterschool programs and so on.

It's like that in a ton of places around here. Everything is about sports and the money it pulls in.

Oh really when?
Kostya (Unlucky Thirteen)
#142999: Oct 10th 2016 at 9:24:07 AM

If they actually put that money into classes it would be one thing but it seems like they don't. Where the hell does it go?

Mio Since: Jan, 2001
#143000: Oct 10th 2016 at 9:27:45 AM

Back into the sports programs of course. Particularly the ones that bring in the most money, which usually means football, which of course is also one of the more expensive sports to operate.


Total posts: 417,856
Top