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AngelusNox Warder of the damned from The guard of the gates of oblivion Since: Dec, 2014 Relationship Status: Married to the job
Warder of the damned
#142426: Oct 8th 2016 at 2:40:46 PM

Did you check them to see if any of them had "Made in China" stamped on them?

Inter arma enim silent leges
BearyScary Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: You spin me right round, baby
#142427: Oct 8th 2016 at 2:41:42 PM

Or "Made in Mexico"?

Do not obey in advance.
pwiegle Cape Malleum Majorem from Nowhere Special Since: Sep, 2015 Relationship Status: Singularity
Cape Malleum Majorem
#142428: Oct 8th 2016 at 2:44:24 PM

No, I didn't want to get that close. The proprietors would try to engage me in conversation, and The Stupid, It Burns, y'know...

This Space Intentionally Left Blank.
LinkToTheFuture A real bad hombre from somewhere completely different Since: Apr, 2015 Relationship Status: What's love got to do with it?
A real bad hombre
#142429: Oct 8th 2016 at 2:45:45 PM

So Wikileak's big October Surprise that would bring down Clinton forever...

...was transcripts of speeches which contain absolutely nothing out of the ordinary?

What?

"I have not failed. I've just found 10,000 ways that won't work." -Thomas Edison
TacticalFox88 from USA Since: Nov, 2010 Relationship Status: Dating the Doctor
#142430: Oct 8th 2016 at 2:45:55 PM

All right, how do you guys think Congress is gonna look, assuming this keeps going down hill?

New Survey coming this weekend!
KarkatTheDalek Not as angry as the name would suggest. from Somwhere in Time/Space Since: Mar, 2012 Relationship Status: You're a beautiful woman, probably
Not as angry as the name would suggest.
#142431: Oct 8th 2016 at 2:54:45 PM

I'm more interested in what will happen if (and while I'm pretty optimistic now, I'm not ready to say "when" yet) Clinton wins. Will these hardcore "if Crooked Hillary wins, then it was rigged" Trump supporters riot or something?

Oh God! Natural light!
Zendervai Since: Oct, 2009
#142432: Oct 8th 2016 at 3:00:29 PM

One thing to keep in mind is that we aren't actually sure how many of these super hardcore supporters there actually are. We do kind of know their distribution, and they're mostly concentrated in small towns in the middle of nowhere. I don't think a riot in Peoria, while bad, would really have much of an effect on a national scale.

FluffyMcChicken My Hair Provides Affordable Healthcare from where the floating lights gleam Since: Jun, 2014 Relationship Status: In another castle
My Hair Provides Affordable Healthcare
#142433: Oct 8th 2016 at 3:25:37 PM

Imagine if the fallout from the sex comments is finally what gets Trump to debate professionally tommorow. tongue

To be serious however, I honestly wonder how Donald's comments would be perceived by a European voter base. Sex scandals across the Atlantic tend to have much less weight than here - thanks Puritans - and Trump's candidacy is directly concurrent with a rise in conservatism in Europe as well.

BearyScary Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: You spin me right round, baby
#142434: Oct 8th 2016 at 3:27:15 PM

This goes without saying, but it's really not cool that that anyone could get away with groping their employees and business partners. I don't know if this newest scandal will do much to combat that on the whole, but it does seem to be hurting Trump's candidacy and support.

edited 8th Oct '16 3:27:43 PM by BearyScary

Do not obey in advance.
DrunkenNordmann from Exile Since: May, 2015
#142435: Oct 8th 2016 at 3:30:00 PM

I think in Europe it's basically: Nobody cares about your sex life as long as you're not doing anything illegal. The newspaper articles might entertain some people, but I can't remember anyone actually losing their job over it.

edited 8th Oct '16 3:30:21 PM by DrunkenNordmann

We learn from history that we do not learn from history
Bat178 Since: May, 2011
#142436: Oct 8th 2016 at 3:34:38 PM

[up] Americans tend be more tolerant of violence but less of sex, while Europeans are more tolerant of sex but less of violence, which is reflected in their respective media.

edited 8th Oct '16 3:54:15 PM by Bat178

Julep Since: Jul, 2010
#142437: Oct 8th 2016 at 3:40:31 PM

A good comparison in France would be François Mitterrand and Dominique Strauss-Kahn - both Socialists (albeit the right wing of the party), by the way.

Strauss-Kahn sexually assaulted a woman, his career immediately ended.

Mitterrand had an extramarital affair which led to him having an illegitimate daughter. When her existence was revealed in 1994 (when his daughter turned 18), people shrugged it off - his political opponents knew about it already and never used it because it wasn't their business. Plus he actually raised (secretly) his daughter, so he wasn't seen like an asshole getting a woman pregnant and abandoning her. A few days ago, a book with his letters to his paramour was published, and the most common was reaction was "Man, he really could write".

That's a pretty clear Trump/(Bill) Clinton parallel.

However, it's not as clear-cut. Denis Baupin (...also left-wing) is still a deputy, despite 14 (!) woman (politicians among them) claiming he sexually harassed/assaulted them. 4 filed a lawsuit, which is underway, and as such, he has not been forced to resign.

And the many examples of sexism behavior in the National Assembly (like a guy mimicking a chicken when a female politican speaks...yeah, I know, so mature) still go unpunished. Denounced, of course, but most dudes just say "Dudz b dudz, y'know". In that sense, it's not very different from Trumpism.

edited 8th Oct '16 3:41:04 PM by Julep

FluffyMcChicken My Hair Provides Affordable Healthcare from where the floating lights gleam Since: Jun, 2014 Relationship Status: In another castle
My Hair Provides Affordable Healthcare
#142438: Oct 8th 2016 at 3:41:02 PM

[up][up] I've actually raised this up from time to time with foreign students at my school, and how I can't but feel that it sets a rather disturbing precedent for our society.

Two lovers engaging in an naturally programmed act of biology is something you shouldn't show countless impressionable minds, yet gouging out a person's eyes in a deliberate act of violence is.

I suppose one could make an argument that violence is a "natural" act of biology though. sad

edited 8th Oct '16 3:41:11 PM by FluffyMcChicken

Falrinn Since: Dec, 2014
#142439: Oct 8th 2016 at 4:13:15 PM

If Hillary Clinton's campaign has any more dirt on Trump that they've been keeping in reserve, their best play might be to release it just a couple hours before the debate on Sunday.

With the stress levels substantially heightened in the Trump camp, it won't take much to put Trump in a position where he can't regain his composure (well, regain what little composure he is capable of). Thus forcing him to either withdraw from the debate at the last minute, or completely lose his cool right from the start and comes off as a blubbering lunatic.

Either way, the bottom is going to fall out on Trump's campaign.

TacticalFox88 from USA Since: Nov, 2010 Relationship Status: Dating the Doctor
#142440: Oct 8th 2016 at 4:29:29 PM

Giuliani, leaving Trump Tower, signals Trump is ready to wage war against his party. "This is basically the insiders versus the outsiders."

Shit's about to get LIT

New Survey coming this weekend!
Elle Since: Jan, 2001
#142441: Oct 8th 2016 at 4:38:50 PM

If Giuliani is an outsider then I'm Trump's illegitimate kid. (Ew.) I'm seeing this as he couldn't get a political career based on conventional stances to take off after leaving NY as mayor so he embraced the crazy.

Parable Since: Aug, 2009
#142442: Oct 8th 2016 at 4:56:34 PM

Condeleeza Rice is calling for Trump withdraw from the race.

BestOf FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC! from Finland Since: Oct, 2010 Relationship Status: Falling within your bell curve
FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC!
#142443: Oct 8th 2016 at 5:07:38 PM

14 Republican senators are not voting for Trump.

If you look at that article, you'll also see a fun list of other notable Republicans who don't support Trump:

Jeb Bush, former Florida governor
Tim Pawlenty, former Minnesota governor
Gary Herbert, Utah governor
Jason Chaffetz, Utah congressman
Carly Fiorina, former presidential candidate
Barbara Comstock, Virginia congresswoman
Mike Coffman, Colorado congressman
Mike Lee, Utah congressman
William Cohen, former secretary of defence
Michael Hayden, former CIA director, former NSA director
John Kasich, Ohio governor, 2016 presidential candidate
Tom Ridge, former Pennsylvania governor; former Homeland Security secretary
Mitt Romney, former Massachusetts governor, 2012 nominee
Ileana Ros-Lehtinen, Florida congresswoman

Republicans who will vote Clinton include George HW Bush.

Take all that and the campaign event in Wisconsin where Ryan decided to disinvite Trump and host Pence, instead - but Pence isn't coming, either. (I'm guessing he's trying to take attention away from the event where Trump was disinvited.)

A story that's been fairly consistent in this election has been that Trump isn't actually paying a whole lot for this election, considering his wealth. He's accepted loads of donations, but nothing like what Clinton has; and of his own "donation", most of it is actually loaned to the campaign and I assume if he loses he'll try to have as much of it paid back as possible.

Other than that he's relied on the ground operation and funds of the party, and that's created problems with local offices having to decide whether to emphasise their local candidates instead of the top of the ticket. It's not hard to guess how that balance will move now.

edited 8th Oct '16 6:25:16 PM by BestOf

Quod gratis asseritur, gratis negatur.
LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#142444: Oct 8th 2016 at 5:12:16 PM

I do wonder if all of these Republicans going against Trump/for Hilary will just be used as fire to the "She's basically a Republican" Bernie Bros and the like, or otherwise depress turnout.

Elle Since: Jan, 2001
#142445: Oct 8th 2016 at 5:29:20 PM

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/10/03/us/politics/hillary-bill-clinton-women.html?_r=0

Thought I'd put this up as a counterpoint to the Trump stuff at least because it's interesting reading and maybe partly because there is ammunition against Hillary in there. Basically, she probably played a large role in trying to discredit (in nasty ways) the women claiming Bill had affairs with up until the point Bill finally admitted to her that they were true. This is probably the "grain of truth" in the whole "Hillary was covering for/enabling her husband" is based on.

Apples and oranges compared to Trump but still, interesting reading.

BearyScary Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: You spin me right round, baby
#142446: Oct 8th 2016 at 6:20:11 PM

Condeleeza Rice is calling for Trump withdraw from the race.

Wow, go Condeleeza. Too bad I don't think Trump will withdraw unless his campaign is literally going down in flames?

What would happen if a major party's candidate left at this late stage in the game.

edited 8th Oct '16 6:20:32 PM by BearyScary

Do not obey in advance.
BestOf FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC! from Finland Since: Oct, 2010 Relationship Status: Falling within your bell curve
FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC!
#142447: Oct 8th 2016 at 6:24:18 PM

Some early ballots have already been cast. You can't take your candidate back at that point - it would essentially invalidate all of those votes.

Quod gratis asseritur, gratis negatur.
Elle Since: Jan, 2001
#142448: Oct 8th 2016 at 6:24:50 PM

Here’s what happens if a presidential nominee has to drop out of the election (Vox)

Both parties have similar contingency plans that boil down to the RNC/DNC leaders decreeing a new candidate. However short of a candidate's death they all require the candidate to withdraw voluntarily and there would still be problems with early/absentee ballots..

KarkatTheDalek Not as angry as the name would suggest. from Somwhere in Time/Space Since: Mar, 2012 Relationship Status: You're a beautiful woman, probably
Not as angry as the name would suggest.
#142449: Oct 8th 2016 at 6:57:31 PM

It should be noted, though, that voters are voting for electors, and those electors are assembled by the candidates' parties and are thus loyal to them.

Oh God! Natural light!
Silasw A procrastination in of itself from A handcart to hell (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
A procrastination in of itself
#142450: Oct 8th 2016 at 7:02:56 PM

However there are rules about electors going faithless, so a Trump that withdraws late and still wins electoral votes would still have them counted for him and not the Replacement Republican.

edited 8th Oct '16 7:03:34 PM by Silasw

“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran

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