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Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM

Zendervai Since: Oct, 2009
#129026: Jul 6th 2016 at 12:06:33 PM

[up][up] Yeah, I've run into that one. It sucks, and it means I won't be patronizing whatever business does that.

Greenmantle V from Greater Wessex, Britannia Since: Feb, 2010 Relationship Status: Hiding
V
#129027: Jul 6th 2016 at 12:08:05 PM

[up][up] Are you saying "Legislate Private Education out of business"?

Keep Rolling On
TacticalFox88 from USA Since: Nov, 2010 Relationship Status: Dating the Doctor
#129028: Jul 6th 2016 at 12:09:29 PM

[up][up][up] Where did I imply that I cared about the welfare of Private Institutions? I was simply pointing out they'll throw massive amounts of money to stop this in this tracks...not that it would get pass committee, anyhow.

edited 6th Jul '16 12:09:39 PM by TacticalFox88

New Survey coming this weekend!
Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#129029: Jul 6th 2016 at 12:10:06 PM

[up][up] If it serves no purpose that justifies its existence, yes. I'm sure that private education will remain competitive in some cases, but in a remarkably large percentage, it's little more than a scam to bilk students of their future earnings (or their family's wealth).

[up] "They will fight it tooth and nail" is no reason not to try to reform a broken system. That's rather astoundingly defeatist. In truth, none of the ideas in the Democrats' platform could pass Congress as it's currently constituted. Doesn't mean we should give up and let Der Trumpenfuhrer take over.

edited 6th Jul '16 12:11:18 PM by Fighteer

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
TheHandle United Earth from Stockholm Since: Jan, 2012 Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
United Earth
#129030: Jul 6th 2016 at 12:30:31 PM

After Clinton took this position, I'm beginning to warm up to her.

NOT EVERYONE NEEDS TO OR SHOULD GO TO COLLEGE.

Absurd. Society benefits immensely from lots of people having higher education. For one thing, they're less likely to vote stupidly.

Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that.
Protagonist506 from Oregon Since: Dec, 2013 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
#129031: Jul 6th 2016 at 12:32:26 PM

[up]A lot of very successful people never went to college.

Leviticus 19:34
Ssj3Gojira Arashi Shigehito from The Event Horizon Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
Arashi Shigehito
#129032: Jul 6th 2016 at 12:32:47 PM

And we don't have to deal with the equivalent of a Brexit if we actually get educated people who understand what the heck they're voting on.

Let's see if you can get past my Beelzemon. Mephiles, WARP SHINKA!
smokeycut Since: Mar, 2013
#129033: Jul 6th 2016 at 12:33:58 PM

And a lot of people would have been successful had they been able to go to college. There's certain things you just can't figure out on your own, and we should aspire to have a better educated population.

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#129034: Jul 6th 2016 at 12:47:07 PM

Not everyone should or needs to go to college. I agree with that.

But it should be an option for everyone. Not just trust fund babies and people willing to spend the rest of their lives saddled with crippling debt.

edited 6th Jul '16 12:47:31 PM by TobiasDrake

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
CrimsonZephyr Would that it were so simple. from Massachusetts Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
Would that it were so simple.
#129035: Jul 6th 2016 at 12:59:12 PM

"A lot of very successful people never went to college."

Being a billionaire doesn't mean you're not a moron.

"For all those whose cares have been our concern, the work goes on, the cause endures, the hope still lives, and the dream shall never die."
ironballs16 Since: Jul, 2009 Relationship Status: Owner of a lonely heart
#129036: Jul 6th 2016 at 1:21:33 PM

[up]

Naturally the reverse can be true as well. It's all about managing the money once you actually get it that decides whether you remain wealthy or not.

Of course, the one thing that needs addressing is the fact that we're now in the Information Age - it used to be that if you wanted to learn things, you had to go to colleges/universities because they were the primary source of information. Now? 5 seconds in Google and you can find incredibly detailed timelines and histories for various historic events, some of which wouldn't have seen the light of day at a formal institution. Of course, the flipside is that the same 5 seconds will lead you to "X/Y/Z of why [insert historic event] is a lie!" (and, naturally, historically-accurate porn videos/stories) - but the point is that formal education is no longer required in order to actually learn about things. But it's going to take a long time for society to catch up with that.

[down]

Pretty sure I mentioned that point with "X/Y/Z Is a lie!" segment.

edited 6th Jul '16 1:33:46 PM by ironballs16

"Why would I inflict myself on somebody else?"
AceofSpades Since: Apr, 2009 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
#129037: Jul 6th 2016 at 1:27:17 PM

Tactical: Your "not everyone should or needs to go to college" is a really FUCKING STUPID argument against the whole "make college more affordable". I know that others have said that, but holy shit that's a total non-argument when it comes to making college affordable. First off, as far as I'm concerned a vocational school IS a college, as it's secondary education, and should qualify for/be covered under all the same financial aid programs as a traditional college. Second, that's not actually any fucking help at all for the hundreds of thousands of kids that are trying to get an affordable education. Saying that vocational schools should be included in the plan is the far more logical and helpful argument to make here. Because a vocational/trade school is a continued education, for a specific thing. (And frankly a lot of community colleges are starting to verge onto vocational schools, with their specific programs.)

As for the whole "it will never pass" thing, I say this: The fucking ACA was never going to pass either. And look where we are now.

[up]You can also find a fuckton of WRONG information, bubbles of social networks reinforcing that wrong information, and circlejerk arguments full of people who don't take kindly to any kind of correction. The Information Age is not the Wisdom Age.

edited 6th Jul '16 1:31:39 PM by AceofSpades

smokeycut Since: Mar, 2013
#129038: Jul 6th 2016 at 1:31:54 PM

And besides, an article on the French Revolution isn't at all the same as spending 4 years studying french history in depth. One will net you a job as a historian, the other won't even get you a job at Wendy's.

CaptainCapsase from Orbiting Sagittarius A* Since: Jan, 2015
#129039: Jul 6th 2016 at 1:37:07 PM

[up] I'm rather curious though how much someone would be able to self-teach themselves about French history solely through the use of the Internet.

SeptimusHeap from Switzerland (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Mu
#129040: Jul 6th 2016 at 1:38:06 PM

Well, I did learn much of my science stuff autodidactically. Part of the reason why I am in university now, in fact.

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
TheHandle United Earth from Stockholm Since: Jan, 2012 Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
United Earth
#129041: Jul 6th 2016 at 1:38:47 PM

They would hit a wall as soon as we start getting out of "textbook" territory and into the world of scientific and academic papers. Blanket subscriptions to peer-reviewed journals are fairly prohibitive.

edited 6th Jul '16 1:39:11 PM by TheHandle

Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that.
CaptainCapsase from Orbiting Sagittarius A* Since: Jan, 2015
#129042: Jul 6th 2016 at 1:40:22 PM

A better educated population is more or less never a bad thing; the more educaged a population is the less willing they are to put up with exploitation and abuse from their leaders.

[up] I know, but older stuff is often free; you obviously won't be able to be current without secondary education, but you can do a lot more than you would've prior to the Internet.

edited 6th Jul '16 1:42:42 PM by CaptainCapsase

AceofSpades Since: Apr, 2009 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
#129043: Jul 6th 2016 at 1:41:28 PM

Ideally, one of the things a college should teach you is how to learn, not just the subject matter. Ideally.

Eschaton Since: Jul, 2010
#129044: Jul 6th 2016 at 1:46:30 PM

[up][up][up]Exactly. Theoretically, someone could learn quite a lot from online self-teaching, but there is still a limit to how much information that can be found online versus physical publications. Not to mention that finding the best places for information online is something provided by college institutions.

[up]Similarly, colleges should also teach you how to apply that learning. Speaking for myself, learning about history is one thing, writing about history in a professional manner is another. And colleges provide an avenue to practice the practice.

ironballs16 Since: Jul, 2009 Relationship Status: Owner of a lonely heart
#129045: Jul 6th 2016 at 1:56:38 PM

[up][up]

Of course, that's a rather vast departure from the public education system's current "teach to the test" mentality.

"Why would I inflict myself on somebody else?"
sgamer82 Since: Jan, 2001
#129046: Jul 6th 2016 at 2:21:04 PM

[up] I've heard college is different in that respect. But then I'm told that by people encouraging me to go, which I haven't partly due to cost and partly because I've no special desire to motivate me (and all that cost and commitment won't amount to much if I don't at least have a plan going in, I feel)

AdricDePsycho Rock on, Gold Dust Woman from Never Going Back Again Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Rock on, Gold Dust Woman
#129048: Jul 6th 2016 at 2:28:15 PM

Ah damn, that's not good.

edited 6th Jul '16 2:28:26 PM by AdricDePsycho

Have you any dreams you'd like to sell?
Silasw A procrastination in of itself from A handcart to hell (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
A procrastination in of itself
#129049: Jul 6th 2016 at 2:45:05 PM

Wasn't there a lot of criticism aimed at the prison keeping Manning for putting her on suicide watch (which means depriving her of things she might kill herself with)? Because it seems like that watch might have been a good idea.

Oh and with the "a bunch of successful people didn't go to college" I think a lot actually dropped out, as in they got a certain level of education from it then finished. I know that the first year of US college has been compared to the last year of UK regular school.

edited 6th Jul '16 2:46:14 PM by Silasw

“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran
AdricDePsycho Rock on, Gold Dust Woman from Never Going Back Again Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Rock on, Gold Dust Woman
#129050: Jul 6th 2016 at 2:52:22 PM

Here's the thing about successful people who dropped out of college to get where they are: they didn't get it easy.

Have you any dreams you'd like to sell?

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