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Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM

smokeycut Since: Mar, 2013
#128626: Jul 2nd 2016 at 10:00:35 PM

Hillary called them super predators, Bernie called them sociopaths. Both were offensive. Why are we still acting like one was better than the other?

[up][up] Because of a variety of reasons. Please don't act like you know who an entire race of people should support. That's for them to decide, not you. And with the alternative being Trump, I can understand any minority supporting Clinton.

edited 2nd Jul '16 10:03:07 PM by smokeycut

CaptainCapsase from Orbiting Sagittarius A* Since: Jan, 2015
#128627: Jul 2nd 2016 at 10:10:04 PM

[up] In that case you have no right to tell the white working class they shouldn't be voting for the GOP; our entire system is designed around the premise that the population cannot be trusted to make decisions for the common good.

edited 2nd Jul '16 10:12:35 PM by CaptainCapsase

LeGarcon Blowout soon fellow Stalker from Skadovsk Since: Aug, 2013 Relationship Status: Gay for Big Boss
Blowout soon fellow Stalker
#128628: Jul 2nd 2016 at 10:12:24 PM

She is a member of the white working class though. So am I for that matter.

edited 2nd Jul '16 10:12:46 PM by LeGarcon

Oh really when?
CaptainCapsase from Orbiting Sagittarius A* Since: Jan, 2015
#128629: Jul 2nd 2016 at 10:13:23 PM

[up] The notion that a person can only have an opinion on a demographic if they are part of said demographic themselves is laughable in serious academic discussion.

edited 2nd Jul '16 11:13:06 PM by CaptainCapsase

smokeycut Since: Mar, 2013
#128630: Jul 2nd 2016 at 10:14:12 PM

You do realize the implications that statement has, right? Or am I the only one seeing how that comes across badly?

Plus, I am white and part of the working class, so I think I have a say in my own community.

And no, N Word Privileges exist for a damn good reason.

edited 2nd Jul '16 10:14:50 PM by smokeycut

flameboy21th The would-be novelist from California Since: Jan, 2013 Relationship Status: I <3 love!
The would-be novelist
#128631: Jul 2nd 2016 at 10:14:21 PM

[up][up]Okay, what the hell are you talking about.

edited 2nd Jul '16 10:14:49 PM by flameboy21th

Non Indicative Username
Ssj3Gojira Arashi Shigehito from The Event Horizon Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
Arashi Shigehito
#128632: Jul 2nd 2016 at 10:16:28 PM

Wait, how was the Predators movie offensive at all?

Let's see if you can get past my Beelzemon. Mephiles, WARP SHINKA!
flameboy21th The would-be novelist from California Since: Jan, 2013 Relationship Status: I <3 love!
The would-be novelist
#128633: Jul 2nd 2016 at 10:17:48 PM

It's a joke about the "Super Predator" comment from Clinton.

And the Predator has dreadlocks, which is usually associated with black guys.

Non Indicative Username
CaptainCapsase from Orbiting Sagittarius A* Since: Jan, 2015
#128634: Jul 2nd 2016 at 10:18:24 PM

[up][up][up][up] Not when they get applied to this particular scenario (only X can talk about X); being a member of a particular demographic does not necessarily give a person an innate insight about that demographic, and certainly not one that overrides scientific conclusions, ie the conclusion by economists that the GOP's economic plans are detrimental to working class Americans, of which the white working class is a subset.

edited 2nd Jul '16 10:19:04 PM by CaptainCapsase

Ssj3Gojira Arashi Shigehito from The Event Horizon Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
Arashi Shigehito
#128635: Jul 2nd 2016 at 10:18:43 PM

They don't even look black though, and a lot of people wear dreadlocks. Plus, I thought it was some Predator tribal thing going on with them.

Let's see if you can get past my Beelzemon. Mephiles, WARP SHINKA!
AceofSpades Since: Apr, 2009 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
#128636: Jul 2nd 2016 at 10:20:07 PM

I think everyone's just sort of responding to everyone in a melange of crossed messages. The thread has crashed, everyone off the train while the conductor figures out what went wrong.

[up][up] And no one here was even saying that until you brought it up. It's only tangentially related to the whole commenting on other communities thing, and quite frankly if you're trying to use a word that has a history as a vicious slur and lamenting that N-Words privileges prevents that, you're kind of a fool.

@9: You came in here and started talking in a flame baiting manner, and kept repeated asking if we thought Clinton got bribed to change policy, ignoring that we answered no we didn't, and not actually telling us how you thought policy got changed. And just basically slamming Clinton, which is in now way defending Sanders. It was just insulting Clinton. With baseless accusations. Protip; if it hasn't happened very recently this thread has probably already covered it. If you're thinking that you're bringing something new you should probably ask if we've gone over a particular topic already instead of presenting the information like it's new.

edited 2nd Jul '16 10:22:57 PM by AceofSpades

flameboy21th The would-be novelist from California Since: Jan, 2013 Relationship Status: I <3 love!
The would-be novelist
#128637: Jul 2nd 2016 at 10:21:08 PM

[up][up]I said it was a joke, not laboratory science.

edited 2nd Jul '16 10:21:49 PM by flameboy21th

Non Indicative Username
FFShinra Since: Jan, 2001
#128638: Jul 2nd 2016 at 10:22:29 PM

The level of bile here really makes me fear for this election. Trump cannot win by any serious consideration....but Hil can lose, shooing him in to victory, all because you have purists who think anyone who isn't them is the same amorphous enemy and thus doesn't matter which one of them wins.

They will collectively say Worth It if they cause a Hillary loss to Trump.

smokeycut Since: Mar, 2013
#128639: Jul 2nd 2016 at 10:23:14 PM

Okay, scaling back: I thought it came across as Capsace going "I know what's best for black people" when he said that them supporting Clinton baffles him. As a result, I pointed out that he shouldn't act like he knows what they should do, and that that's for them to decide, not him.

AceofSpades Since: Apr, 2009 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
#128640: Jul 2nd 2016 at 10:24:24 PM

I sincerely doubt that the demographic of "screw Hillary" voters is big enough to get Trump into office. I'd worry about the numbers we see closer to the election, really, since we're months away and a lot of people are probably still undecided and Sanders voters haven't really moved one way or the other yet.

[up]Well, the answer to that is that the Clintons have a long history of openly working with and hiring black people, as well as being associated with the upward movement of minorities in the nineties. It should also be noted that the black people she specifically did well with were older voters, as Clinton and Sanders appeared to have a divide along the ages of voters. Sanders just doesn't have that history because he's spent his career representing a majority white state. I don't hold it against him, but it does sort of disadvantage him to a degree to not have that visible history.

edited 2nd Jul '16 10:26:52 PM by AceofSpades

flameboy21th The would-be novelist from California Since: Jan, 2013 Relationship Status: I <3 love!
The would-be novelist
#128641: Jul 2nd 2016 at 10:25:15 PM

[up][up][up]If you come to a politic thread expecting civility, you are so cute.

edited 2nd Jul '16 10:26:00 PM by flameboy21th

Non Indicative Username
CaptainCapsase from Orbiting Sagittarius A* Since: Jan, 2015
#128642: Jul 2nd 2016 at 10:26:27 PM

[up][up] In all seriousness, it doesn't matter all that much which of them wins the Presidency. That's not due to a lack of differences between Trump and Clinton and Sanders and so on, but more due to the inherent rigidness of the American system and the relative lack of power a President without a supportive congress has, and the political situation. Who controls congress will make a far greater difference than who controls the Presidency.

edited 2nd Jul '16 10:26:46 PM by CaptainCapsase

FFShinra Since: Jan, 2001
#128643: Jul 2nd 2016 at 10:27:45 PM

Not expecting civility. But the sheer cognitive dissonance by some here is making me fear for the election.

As for third partiers not being significant, don't hold your breath. Johnson might get enough votes to get federal funding. On the debate stage even. It's Ross Perot all over again. And HE is being followed by Jill Stein, who I have found to be almost as deplorable as Trump for the sheer lack of fucks given about the nation.

[up]Coattail effect is a thing. As for rigidity, we're entering an era where the entire political system is in flux. There is no rigidity.

edited 2nd Jul '16 10:28:44 PM by FFShinra

smokeycut Since: Mar, 2013
#128644: Jul 2nd 2016 at 10:29:23 PM

That's not true in the slightest. The president can veto bills, influence the direction the country takes, meet with foreign leaders, pull us into conflicts, perform executive actions, etc.

The president has just as much power as the SCOTUS and Congress. That's why we have a three branch system.

CaptainCapsase from Orbiting Sagittarius A* Since: Jan, 2015
#128645: Jul 2nd 2016 at 10:31:51 PM

[up] When you look at the big picture though, the long term, it barely makes a difference who is President. They have power, sure, but they can only exercise that power with the consent of their subordinates; if a President were to violate the "rules of engagement", they'd find themselves impeached in a hung senate hearing almost immediately, and failing that, they'd find themselves assassinated.

edited 2nd Jul '16 10:32:17 PM by CaptainCapsase

flameboy21th The would-be novelist from California Since: Jan, 2013 Relationship Status: I <3 love!
The would-be novelist
#128646: Jul 2nd 2016 at 10:32:25 PM

Not to mention the Presidents make the SCOTUS.

[up]Sure, Sir 'Jote.

edited 2nd Jul '16 10:33:54 PM by flameboy21th

Non Indicative Username
LeGarcon Blowout soon fellow Stalker from Skadovsk Since: Aug, 2013 Relationship Status: Gay for Big Boss
Blowout soon fellow Stalker
#128647: Jul 2nd 2016 at 10:33:51 PM

The Supreme Court is effectively the highest power in the nation. The last thing we need is for someone with Trump's beliefs choosing judges.

Oh really when?
smokeycut Since: Mar, 2013
#128648: Jul 2nd 2016 at 10:34:26 PM

And in the short term, Trump can cause untold damage to minority communities, not only in this country, but abroad, as well as influence the rise of facism and anti intellectualism in the west.

Don't pull that "in the long term, it doesn't really matter" crap. People's lives matter right now.

FFShinra Since: Jan, 2001
#128649: Jul 2nd 2016 at 10:34:36 PM

[up][up][up][up]Based on nothing. Every president has had a massive effect on the direction of the country. Somethings more than others, sure, and momentum is a thing, but you seem to think presidents are irrelevant, and they aren't in the near, medium, or long term. Near term, the effect is obvious. As is medium term. And long term, thats when momentum works for them as well.

The current way poltiics is being conducted, for example, is a product of the Reagan Revolution in congress back in the early 90s.

edited 2nd Jul '16 10:34:49 PM by FFShinra

CaptainCapsase from Orbiting Sagittarius A* Since: Jan, 2015
#128650: Jul 2nd 2016 at 10:35:33 PM

[up] Only for someone who buys into the "great man" theory of history. Who is President at a given time reflects underlying social and cultural conditions more than anything else; as much as we try to tell ourselves otherwise, people are fairly interchangeable when you get to populations in the millions. There is a significant political factor, the state of political institutions, but the role of any single person in that system is relatively small. That's not to say that the course of history is entirely deterministic, but individual people have a relatively small impact on it.

edited 2nd Jul '16 10:40:44 PM by CaptainCapsase


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