TVTropes Now available in the app store!
Open

Follow TV Tropes

Following

The General US Politics Thread

Go To

Nov 2023 Mod notice:


There may be other, more specific, threads about some aspects of US politics, but this one tends to act as a hub for all sorts of related news and information, so it's usually one of the busiest OTC threads.

If you're new to OTC, it's worth reading the Introduction to On-Topic Conversations and the On-Topic Conversations debate guidelines before posting here.

Rumor-based, fear-mongering and/or inflammatory statements that damage the quality of the thread will be thumped. Off-topic posts will also be thumped. Repeat offenders may be suspended.

If time spent moderating this thread remains a distraction from moderation of the wiki itself, the thread will need to be locked. We want to avoid that, so please follow the forum rules when posting here.


In line with the general forum rules, 'gravedancing' is prohibited here. If you're celebrating someone's death or hoping that they die, your post will get thumped. This rule applies regardless of what the person you're discussing has said or done.

Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM

sgamer82 Since: Jan, 2001
#128451: Jul 2nd 2016 at 12:55:17 PM

If the KKK counts, David Duke has endorsed him, iirc. Trump also did not immediately disavow that endorsement, instead claiming he hardly knew David Duke enough to make that call.

940131 Since: Feb, 2014
#128452: Jul 2nd 2016 at 12:57:55 PM

He was obviously lying about not knowing who David Duke was or about the KKK. I can't imagine, any American to be so ignorant of the countries history that they wouldn't know what KKK is about. Saying he's associated with David Duke, is a big strech though. The closest they came to an association was when he considered running on the Reform Party Ticket. Ultimately, he decided not to because of the members.

”So the Reform Party now includes a Klansman, Mr. Duke, a neo-Nazi, Mr. Buchanan, and a communist, Ms. Fulani. This is not company I wish to keep,” Trump said.

I suppose, Mr. Trump forgot that the internet existed and we could easily check the record when he played dumb about David Duke and the KKK. It's strange, after all this is the guy on Twitter at 3 in the morning.

edited 2nd Jul '16 1:02:40 PM by 940131

Rationalinsanity from Halifax, Canada Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
#128453: Jul 2nd 2016 at 1:11:59 PM

It was no coincidence that Trump didn't disavow neo-Nazis/the KKK right before a set of Southern primaries.

Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.
LeGarcon Blowout soon fellow Stalker from Skadovsk Since: Aug, 2013 Relationship Status: Gay for Big Boss
Blowout soon fellow Stalker
#128454: Jul 2nd 2016 at 1:15:25 PM

Trump's father was a devout Klan member with an arrest record.

He grew up with it, he knows exactly what he's doing

Oh really when?
Protagonist506 from Oregon Since: Dec, 2013 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
#128455: Jul 2nd 2016 at 1:15:30 PM

Comparing the colonialists to illegal immigrants I think falls into the category of Metaphor Backfire (and partially Insult to Rocks)-if illegals were as bad as conquistadors and the likes of Christopher Columbus and presented a threat similar to the US what they presented to Native Americans, Donald Trump's views would seem a lot saner.

As for the "True Americans" argument, it's highly subjective but basically means "embodies a lot of virtues that American Culture values highly". If I had to make my own suggestion, I'd say the following: Ambition, Self-Reliance, lack of Prejudice". A good example of someone who's the antithesis of American virtiues, I would point to Donald Trump, an entitled leech who's also an elitist bigot.

As for the Native Americans, it's probably accurate to say that the term "Americans" refers to "United Statesians"-the Native Americans pre-date the United States and belonged to their own nations. In the de facto, these nations really don't exist in a meaningful way and are puppet states of the US.

Leviticus 19:34
940131 Since: Feb, 2014
#128456: Jul 2nd 2016 at 1:21:20 PM

@Rational I agree. I think a big part of the reason was that he wanted to get out the racist vote, but I doubt most southerners are racist. It's not 1916 it's 2016. Maybe the debates about the Confederate Flag gave him that impression. I can only imagine that that a black person seeing it flying from government buildings would be like a Jew or a German seeing the Swastika flying over government buildings in Germany.

@Le Garco Let's dispel this fiction once and for all that Donald Trump doesn't know what he is doing, he knows exactly what he's doing?

@Protagonjst Who in this thread said that illegal immigrants are as bad as Colombus or the Conquistadors?

edited 2nd Jul '16 1:30:26 PM by 940131

DrDougsh Since: Jan, 2001
#128457: Jul 2nd 2016 at 1:23:42 PM

Yes, once and for all, let's put an end to this fiction that Donald Trump doesn't know what he is doing, he knows exactly what he's doing.

TacticalFox88 from USA Since: Nov, 2010 Relationship Status: Dating the Doctor
#128458: Jul 2nd 2016 at 1:37:43 PM

The guy separated black and white contestants on one of his shows once for sport!

Like, the amount of mental gymnastics it takes to believe Trump isn't personally racist himself is baffling.

New Survey coming this weekend!
Protagonist506 from Oregon Since: Dec, 2013 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
#128459: Jul 2nd 2016 at 1:39:12 PM

The most damning thing is that he refused to let a biracial contestant on a beauty pageant, and outright stated it was specifically because of her race.

Leviticus 19:34
SeptimusHeap from Switzerland (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Mu
#128460: Jul 2nd 2016 at 1:39:51 PM

A list of examples, if memory serves it's somewhat incomplete.

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
pwiegle Cape Malleum Majorem from Nowhere Special Since: Sep, 2015 Relationship Status: Singularity
Cape Malleum Majorem
#128461: Jul 2nd 2016 at 1:41:01 PM

I agree, he knows what he's doing. He simply doesn't realize that what he's doing is just plain wrong.

This Space Intentionally Left Blank.
Zendervai Since: Oct, 2009
#128462: Jul 2nd 2016 at 1:43:51 PM

There's a caveat with the idea that Trump knows exactly what he's doing. I think when it comes to personal appearances, that is mostly the case, but when it comes to business and the parts of his campaign that doesn't involve personal appearances, he either delegates to morons (they set up a superPAC to appeal to the Amish, AKA, people who don't vote. Ever.) or he does stuff that is self-destructive at best, like trying to get British and Icelandic government officials to donate to his campaign.

kkhohoho (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#128463: Jul 2nd 2016 at 1:45:09 PM

[up]Oh, I think Trump knows exactly what he's doing. I just don't think he does all of what he's doing particularly well, is all.

edited 2nd Jul '16 1:49:47 PM by kkhohoho

940131 Since: Feb, 2014
#128464: Jul 2nd 2016 at 1:47:07 PM

Huffinton Post and Fox New are two sides of the same coin.

sgamer82 Since: Jan, 2001
#128465: Jul 2nd 2016 at 1:53:52 PM

Even without having to worry about alignment of sources, we still have things like:

Donald "We have to hunt down terrorist families" Trump (Maybe not as racist as other examples, but has always disturbed me on a personal level and serves as the Moral Event Horizon at which point I had no intention of voting for him if I was ever going to have any)
Donald "We have to ban all muslims" Trump (reason it's bigoted, if not strictly racist: How do you identify a Muslim? Or, perhaps more accurately, how would he identify a Muslim?)
Donald "This judge can't be fair in my trial because he's Mexican" Trump (Judge was American born, btw)
Donald "Hey, look at my African American, there" Trump (I'm not racist, my random acquaintance is black)

Heh, you know, it just occurred to me. People are worried about Clinton's potentially being indicted as hurting her chances while Trump is actively on trial (Civil Court, sure, but still)

edited 2nd Jul '16 2:05:49 PM by sgamer82

940131 Since: Feb, 2014
#128466: Jul 2nd 2016 at 2:02:56 PM

@sgamer82 1) Well it should. Killing people for being related to terrorists isn't just evil, it's a war crime.

2) Ted Cruz and Mike Huckabee are for banning muslims too. They're for letting Christian Syrian refugees in but keeping muslims out. Trump is an Islamaphobe. Who said he wasn't? I think muslims, are probably the most stigmitized minorty in America and Canada today.

3) The polls say Trump is very unpopular with Mexican Americans for understandable reasons. I don't think Trump has any right to complain though Trump University was an obvious con.

4) If you're suggesting that he meant ownership, I think that's a stretch.

edited 2nd Jul '16 2:09:23 PM by 940131

sgamer82 Since: Jan, 2001
#128467: Jul 2nd 2016 at 2:04:58 PM

[up] Precisely. Islamophobia is, if not strictly racist (again, see "how do you identify a muslim?") definitely bigoted however you cut it. There's not a big line between them.

I never had any intention of voting Cruz, either. Everything I've heard about him said Christian Fundamentalist, the last type of person I think should be anywhere near power.

I think I've lost track here, are you trying to prove Trump is, or is not, racist? Because I was getting a vibe that you were saying "no", but now I'm honestly unsure.

Speaking of Cruz:
Cruz chairs contentious U.S. Senate hearing on 'radical Islam'

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-congress-islam-idUSKCN0ZE2U4

edited 2nd Jul '16 2:07:59 PM by sgamer82

940131 Since: Feb, 2014
#128468: Jul 2nd 2016 at 2:17:15 PM

@sgamer 1) http://www.cbsnews.com/news/donald-trump-tweet-with-star-of-david-draws-social-media-backlash/

2) Some people think this star was a shot at that old conspiracy theory that the Jews secretly control the world. The one a lot of neo Nazis believe. They think Trump is suggesting that Hillary is controlled by the Jews. All I'm saying is that I think its a stretch. It's undeniable that he's an Islamaphobe and a xenophobe. Is he a bigot? I think so. But people suggesting he's a secret white supremacist are going to far IMO. I think he's bigoted in the same way that Bill O' Reilly is bigoted.

3) If I was an American, I'd have voted for Sanders. Trumps insane and Hilary's corrupt.

edited 2nd Jul '16 2:18:47 PM by 940131

JackOLantern1337 Shameful Display from The Most Miserable Province in the Russian Empir Since: Aug, 2014 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
Shameful Display
#128469: Jul 2nd 2016 at 2:17:51 PM

[up][up] In America their tied with Atheists and Transpeople. But no group is despised in Canada except biggots and people who voted for Stephen Harper.

I Bring Doom,and a bit of gloom, but mostly gloom.
ILoveDogs Since: May, 2010
#128470: Jul 2nd 2016 at 2:20:54 PM

[up][up] I think that:

A. Hillary is nowhere near as corrupt as people say that she is, and

B. Sanders is an egotistical old crank who thinks that his half-baked ideas to break up the banks will solve all the country's ills.

940131 Since: Feb, 2014
#128471: Jul 2nd 2016 at 2:23:23 PM

1) If Hilary has nothing to hid, why won't she release her speeches?

2) This is the woman who refused to call israels Gaza incursion excessive when a progressive Jewish American called her on it and accused the world of anti semetism for criticizing Israel.

edited 2nd Jul '16 2:25:25 PM by 940131

sgamer82 Since: Jan, 2001
#128472: Jul 2nd 2016 at 2:24:01 PM

Even if Hillary is as corrupt as people say, I've yet to see a skeleton in her closet (or any combination of) that would convince me Donald Trump is a better choice.

940131 Since: Feb, 2014
#128473: Jul 2nd 2016 at 2:27:27 PM

[up] Maybe not, but at least Trump is more open about what he is. Trump's a monster and everyone knows it. People like Clinton and Cruz are old style sleazy politicians. They ooze slime and it sickens me. If Sanders had been more like Trump and focused on the person over the issues, he'd have stood a better chance.

@I Love Dogs How is Sanders an egotist?

edited 2nd Jul '16 2:32:10 PM by 940131

sgamer82 Since: Jan, 2001
#128474: Jul 2nd 2016 at 2:32:35 PM

Meant to reply to this part:

2) Some people think this star was a shot at that old conspiracy theory that the Jews secretly control the world. The one a lot of neo Nazis believe. They think Trump is suggesting that Hillary is controlled by the Jews. All I'm saying is that I think its a stretch. It's undeniable that he's an Islamaphobe and a xenophobe. Is he a bigot? I think so. But people suggesting he's a secret white supremacist are going to far IMO. I think he's bigoted in the same way that Bill O' Reilly is bigoted.
To reiterate my earlier post, anyone else could be seen as a "slip of the tongue", so to speak, but Trump's past record and willingness to say anything to insult his opponents works against him in giving benefit of the doubt.

Also, I don't think anyone, including yourself going by [up], thinks he's a secret white supremacist.

Lastly, a lot of people regard Donald Trump as an Attention Whore, and will lash out at anything that threatens to usurp him in the public eye, which feeds into a big ego.

edited 2nd Jul '16 2:35:59 PM by sgamer82

940131 Since: Feb, 2014
#128475: Jul 2nd 2016 at 2:35:57 PM

@sgamer82 Wait? You think Trump is an open white supremacist?


Total posts: 417,856
Top