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CaptainCapsase from Orbiting Sagittarius A* Since: Jan, 2015
#123251: May 22nd 2016 at 5:46:18 PM

[up][up] It was hostile in the business sense; it's abundantly clear that the party bosses of the democrats didn't care for Sanders, and the DNC chairwoman did her best to push down on the scale in his opponent's favor. That's the one respect in which he mirrors Trump; he was running as much against the party as we was against his actual opponent.

edited 22nd May '16 5:48:10 PM by CaptainCapsase

TheHandle United Earth from Stockholm Since: Jan, 2012 Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
United Earth
#123252: May 22nd 2016 at 6:15:57 PM

I have a fundamental mistrust of people who are loyal to "the Party" as an entity above and beyond its actual mission of helping people and running a country towards a sustainable future.

Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that.
NativeJovian Jupiterian Local from Orlando, FL Since: Mar, 2014 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
Jupiterian Local
#123253: May 22nd 2016 at 6:22:11 PM

I'd say the fact that he was able to even be competitive demonstrates his base is quite large.
"Large" as in "relevant on the national stage", sure. "Large" as in "could win him the presidency", no. Like it or not, the Democratic voter base has expressed an undeniably preference for Clinton over Sanders.

Mostly I meant Obama in 2008. He had a massive movement behind him. People who actually bought into his HOPE for CHANGE. He won on their backs. They were ready for anything. He told them to go home.
It's less that he told them to go home and more that he faced enormous opposition from the moment he came into office. Even when he had a theoretically Democratic Congress on his side — which was only two years out of his eight as president — many of those Democrats were moderates in vulnerable districts that opposed Obama in order to avoid being voted out in the midterm elections. Such attempts were largely in vain, but it meant that he's been working against Congress rather than with them for virtually his entire presidency. The fact that he's accomplished as much as he has is honestly somewhat amazing.

And he's accomplished a lot, more than most people — even his supporters — realize. Here's a good overview of his presidency.

Really from Jupiter, but not an alien.
AmbarSonofDeshar Since: Jan, 2010
#123254: May 22nd 2016 at 9:12:01 PM

[up][up]When an outsider (as in outsider to the party; Sanders' claim of being a political outsider is pretty silly given he's been in congress for two decades) with a tradition of taking advantage of your party's good graces while simultaneously denouncing them as corrupt tries to join the party and claim leadership of it, you have every reason to be nervous about their objectives and to decide you'd rather they weren't in charge.

SeptimusHeap from Switzerland (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Mu
#123255: May 22nd 2016 at 10:13:37 PM

Eh, it is not so silly. There is a difference between having enough support in one polity to enter parliament and being part of the "system" of interconnected politicians that makes policies - and in many eyes cronyism and privileges - happen.

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
tclittle Professional Forum Ninja from Somewhere Down in Texas Since: Apr, 2010
Professional Forum Ninja
#123256: May 23rd 2016 at 1:48:34 AM

Obama said he is lifting the ban on the sale of military weapons to Vietnam.

"We're all paper, we're all scissors, we're all fightin' with our mirrors, scared we'll never find somebody to love."
PotatoesRock Since: Oct, 2012
#123257: May 23rd 2016 at 4:32:56 AM

In Obama's defense, half of the government threw itself against him to the point of being almost self-destructively contrarian.
And also he didn't have the super majority in the Senate, as this keeps being brought up. At least two seats remained unoccupied for months due to political scandal (Chicago) and recounts (Minnesota). And he had to cut deals with members of his party who were potentially even more economically right-wing/conservative than the Neo Liberal arm (the Blue Dogs)

which was only two years out of his eight as president
Try less than 12 months. Rod Blagojevich really screwed the political pooch.

"Large" as in "relevant on the national stage", sure. "Large" as in "could win him the presidency", no. Like it or not, the Democratic voter base has expressed an undeniably preference for Clinton over Sanders.
Yes, could win him the Presidency. Polls repeatedly demonstrated if asked if they'd vote for whoever the nominee was, Democrats said "Sanders? Hillary? Sure whatever, both are fine, whoever wins".

Now you mean the Primary stage, yes, different deal. But had he gotten past the primaries, Voters were looking pretty accepting of backing him in the General based on polls.

SeptimusHeap from Switzerland (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Mu
#123258: May 23rd 2016 at 4:51:03 AM

Wonder how many people prefer Clinton but have Sanders as an acceptable second choice.

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
PotatoesRock Since: Oct, 2012
#123259: May 23rd 2016 at 5:30:50 AM

Those were basically the polls.

75% of Hillary Voters would vote for Sanders in the general. Same for Sanders voters for Hillary.

77% of Clinton voters consider Sanders an acceptable back up choice. 63% of Sanders voters consider Hillary fine as the other choice.

Mind you this was back in February.

sgamer82 Since: Jan, 2001
#123260: May 23rd 2016 at 6:03:20 AM

A more local story, but thought I'd share it for a change of pace/something a bit different.

2nd employee backs account of mismanagement under Idaho treasurer

http://www.idahostatesman.com/news/politics-government/state-politics/article79225832.html

edited 23rd May '16 6:03:35 AM by sgamer82

Ogodei Fuck you, Fascist sympathizers from The front lines Since: Jan, 2011
Fuck you, Fascist sympathizers
#123261: May 23rd 2016 at 6:14:13 AM

Those figures are going to go up, or at the least Sanders supporters will stay home. The group of "Sanders or Trump" people are going to be negligible (hopefully).

CaptainCapsase from Orbiting Sagittarius A* Since: Jan, 2015
#123262: May 23rd 2016 at 7:34:53 AM

[up] Around 1 in 13 based on the last poll I saw on the subject, much lower among millennials. You will almost always find a small minority of voters who support a candidate for utterly moronic reasons though, so that's not entirely surprising.

edited 23rd May '16 7:36:08 AM by CaptainCapsase

storyyeller More like giant cherries from Appleloosa Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: RelationshipOutOfBoundsException: 1
More like giant cherries
#123263: May 23rd 2016 at 7:40:19 AM

I just wish they weren't so omnipresent online.

Try less than 12 months. Rod Blagojevich really screwed the political pooch.

Technically, Obama had a Democratic congress for 2 years. It is just that he didn't have a supermajority for that long due to the Minnesota recounts and Ted Kennedy's death.

Blind Final Fantasy 6 Let's Play
sgamer82 Since: Jan, 2001
#123264: May 23rd 2016 at 8:01:10 AM

"U.S. Supreme Court rules for black Georgia death row inmate" - http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSKCN0YE1W0

It was a 7-1 decision, too.

Is there any consensus on whether the GOP's Supreme Court obstruction has largely backfired on them?

edited 23rd May '16 8:03:10 AM by sgamer82

Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#123265: May 23rd 2016 at 8:06:06 AM

Well, it has resulted in some cases going 4-4 or being remanded that would probably have been decided in their favor by Scalia. It's highly unlikely that those cases would have gone better for them if they'd confirmed an Obama nominee, though.

edited 23rd May '16 8:06:31 AM by Fighteer

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
sgamer82 Since: Jan, 2001
#123266: May 23rd 2016 at 8:07:30 AM

Though my understanding is Merrick Garland probably would have voted with them in some cases had he been on place at the time.

SeptimusHeap from Switzerland (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Mu
#123267: May 23rd 2016 at 8:30:31 AM

Yep, Garland is a bit of a pro-criminal law sort of judge. But also very much pro-administrative action too. Why did it take 30 years for the ruling to get to the court?

As for this question Is there any consensus on whether the GOP's Supreme Court obstruction has largely backfired on them? what are the polls in the Senate elections, the one in Iowa especially?

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#123268: May 23rd 2016 at 9:09:41 AM

Krugman: Remembrance of Booms Past

In a nutshell, Hillary plugging her husband as the leader of the nation's economic revitalization is a little disingenuous, since Bill had little to do with the boom that happened during his presidency. What he mainly did was twofold: preside over an era of remarkable productivity growth thanks to the computer revolution in business, and not sabotage it by lowering taxes like Republicans demanded. In fact, he raised taxes, which is something that Hillary has also promised to do.

edited 23rd May '16 9:10:56 AM by Fighteer

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
LogoP Party Crasher from the Land of Deep Blue Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: You can be my wingman any time
Party Crasher
#123269: May 23rd 2016 at 10:15:55 AM

Trump passes Clinton in polling average

It is sometimes an appropriate response to reality to go insane.
CaptainCapsase from Orbiting Sagittarius A* Since: Jan, 2015
#123270: May 23rd 2016 at 10:16:32 AM

[up] Mmmm. Hopefully that won't be reflected in the outcome of the election.

sgamer82 Since: Jan, 2001
#123271: May 23rd 2016 at 10:45:41 AM

"Baltimore police officer acquitted in Freddie Gray death" - http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSKCN0YE176

smokeycut Since: Mar, 2013
#123272: May 23rd 2016 at 10:48:05 AM

Because apparently illegally choking an unarmed, nonaggressive man to death despite his pleas to spare his life isn't a crime.

Well, not if you're a cop, at least.

Edit: my bad. Got this case mixed up with another one. Still, fuck our justice system. Especially since there's so many of these cases I can't even keep track of them.

edited 23rd May '16 10:49:25 AM by smokeycut

ILoveDogs Since: May, 2010
#123273: May 23rd 2016 at 10:49:12 AM

As sad as it is to have to say this, you're thinking of another case of police brutality. That's Eric Garner you're thinking of.

CrimsonZephyr Would that it were so simple. from Massachusetts Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
Would that it were so simple.
#123274: May 23rd 2016 at 10:53:16 AM

[up][up][up][up][up]I think it might be time for the superdelegates to jump ship and do their duty in suppressing the popular vote. If that trend continues, Clinton needs to be dropped like a hot potato.

edited 23rd May '16 10:53:48 AM by CrimsonZephyr

"For all those whose cares have been our concern, the work goes on, the cause endures, the hope still lives, and the dream shall never die."
Rationalinsanity from Halifax, Canada Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
#123275: May 23rd 2016 at 10:53:30 AM

Ok, Bernie, I don't think your helping anymore. Your revolution isn't worth a fucking Trump presidency.

http://www.cnn.com/2016/05/23/politics/hillary-clinton-bernie-sanders-donald-trump-2016/index.html

[up]Sanders is done mathematically come the 7th, but he's already doing plenty of unnecessary damage to Clinton. Sanders would hardly be seen as legitimate by swing voters and Clinton supporters if he wins because the superdelegates (that he's spent months screaming about) give him the primary.

edited 23rd May '16 10:57:22 AM by Rationalinsanity

Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.

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