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Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM

SeptimusHeap from Switzerland (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Mu
#118176: Apr 3rd 2016 at 2:01:59 PM

Can we hope that it won't turn into a genital size debate or libel-slinging?

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
darksidevoid Anti-Gnosis Weapon from The Frontiers (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: Robosexual
Anti-Gnosis Weapon
#118177: Apr 3rd 2016 at 2:05:50 PM

I do wonder how large the audience would be the morning after tax deadline day, when people may still be scrambling to get paperwork in.

GM: AGOG S4 & F/WC RP; Co-GM: TABA, SOTR, UUA RP; Sub-GM: TTS RP. I have brought peace, freedom, justice, and security to my new Empire.
desdendelle Hooded Crow from Land of Milk and Honey (Sergeant) Relationship Status: Hiding
Hooded Crow
#118178: Apr 3rd 2016 at 2:16:47 PM

@Money seizure: how the hell did the Republicans not go up in arms — oh wait, they're not actually against Big Government and misuse of government power, forgot. =/

On empty crossroads, seek the eclipse -- for when Sol and Lua align, the lost shall find their way home.
AceofSpades Since: Apr, 2009 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
#118179: Apr 3rd 2016 at 2:20:20 PM

I think both Clinton and Sanders are very carefully not heading in the direction of the Republicans regarding public debate.

LeGarcon Blowout soon fellow Stalker from Skadovsk Since: Aug, 2013 Relationship Status: Gay for Big Boss
Blowout soon fellow Stalker
#118180: Apr 3rd 2016 at 2:31:45 PM

[up][up]The victims were mostly minorities so it's all a-ok in their book.

Oh really when?
JackOLantern1337 Shameful Display from The Most Miserable Province in the Russian Empir Since: Aug, 2014 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
Shameful Display
#118181: Apr 3rd 2016 at 2:32:42 PM

@Silas. No it's the money that is guilty until proven innocent, at least according to John Oliver.

I Bring Doom,and a bit of gloom, but mostly gloom.
desdendelle Hooded Crow from Land of Milk and Honey (Sergeant) Relationship Status: Hiding
Hooded Crow
#118182: Apr 3rd 2016 at 2:33:58 PM

[up][up] That's one of the stupidest, most kleptocratic laws I've ever heard about. Good thing they changed it.

edited 3rd Apr '16 2:34:22 PM by desdendelle

On empty crossroads, seek the eclipse -- for when Sol and Lua align, the lost shall find their way home.
Silasw A procrastination in of itself from A handcart to hell (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
A procrastination in of itself
#118183: Apr 3rd 2016 at 2:53:23 PM

They only changed it in one state, also keep in mind they may have only changed it so that someone has to be charged for the money to be permanently seized. If they did that then someone could be charged, have their money taken then have the charges dropped and still loose their money.

Oh and I belvie the victims weren't always minorities, also foreigners/out of state tourists, which is why it would be so difficult for people to get their money back.

“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran
CassidyTheDevil Since: Jan, 2013
#118184: Apr 3rd 2016 at 3:09:37 PM

The days where it might've been a scandal if the public knew they were defying the law and cheating people out of money are long gone, they do it completely openly now.

And you see the same people who are staunch defenders of this bullshit now like Peter Thiel beginning to openly say they don't like democracy and don't think political freedom is is important, which was always a mostly unspoken thing before although not exactly a secret.

They might almost have a point about democracy...If they were talking about corporate cronyism destroying liberty rather "socialists" not allowing Randian supermen to be unquestioned god-kings.

Ramidel Since: Jan, 2001
#118185: Apr 3rd 2016 at 3:29:06 PM

@Handle: Inter-Service Rivalry is Serious Business. The FBI aren't fighting with the Israelis over the apportionment of Homeland Security budgets, but they do need to prove that they have a reason to exist as something other than a tripwire for the NSA. (Not to mention the simple fact that the different organizations have different and clashing cultures, priorities, and oh yeah, egos.) So yes, the FBI decided to outsource to an Israeli contractor instead of tapping the NSA to get the job done.

The creation of the Department of Homeland Security was intended to cut through all this bullshit. Didn't work out as well as anyone thought it would (though it wasn't a bad idea in principle), just brought everyone into contact with the same set of civilian bureaucrats.

TheHandle United Earth from Stockholm Since: Jan, 2012 Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
United Earth
#118186: Apr 3rd 2016 at 3:37:54 PM

There seems to be a fair bit of room for drastic, urgent improvement, then. Apparently, Inter-Service Rivalry is how 9/11 was allowed to happen, rather than any conspiracy other than the terrorist plot itself (although one could imagine a plot that relied on said rivalry and incompetence to succeed).

Remember remember the elfth of september, the jet plane and tow'r crashing plot
I know of no cause the september farce should ever be forgot.

Crazy hypotheses and bitter vindictiveness aside, this is ridiculous. The FBI needs to exist because some crimes need to be prosecuted across the Union without regard to state borders. The NSA needs to exist because the government needs to be able to violate the citizenry's privacy occasionally, while protecting its own. The CIA needs to exist because the governmnent needs to collect valuable information about foreign nations. They don't face any existential threats, and their domains only overlap if they allow themselves to have Mission Creep and outgrow their needed size.

edited 3rd Apr '16 3:49:32 PM by TheHandle

Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that.
PotatoesRock Since: Oct, 2012
#118187: Apr 3rd 2016 at 3:44:51 PM

Inter-service Rivalry and the Executive orders signed by Reagan that lead to the current conundrum over classification, which lead to data failing to be shared by departments because it was classified.

Basically, the Gipper strikes again from the Grave.

(And for some reason no President has rescinded it.)

Ramidel Since: Jan, 2001
#118188: Apr 3rd 2016 at 3:47:44 PM

Not specifically. The CIA was not allowed to tell the FBI that there were wanted terrorists in US pilot schools - less Inter-Service Rivalry and more Lawful Stupid adherence to dumb regs.

But the root cause of Inter-Service Rivalry is always going to be present: you have different intelligence needs for different situations. The FBI, CIA and NSA all have different approaches because each of them has different duties (the FBI is law enforcement and internal security, the CIA is external security and foreign intelligence, and the NSA hoovers up electronic data indiscriminately).

TheHandle United Earth from Stockholm Since: Jan, 2012 Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
United Earth
#118189: Apr 3rd 2016 at 3:50:57 PM

[up]That's why they don't need to be rivals. They have different roles, they're meant to be a team, not a competition. Them stepping on each other's toes is them overstepping their boundaries.

And that's the dumbest reg I ever heard of. Why would anyone think that's a good idea?

edited 3rd Apr '16 3:52:02 PM by TheHandle

Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that.
SeptimusHeap from Switzerland (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Mu
#118190: Apr 3rd 2016 at 3:54:12 PM

In-group bias and the fear that the FBI cannot handle sensitive information.

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
Zendervai Since: Oct, 2009
#118191: Apr 3rd 2016 at 3:55:05 PM

Yeah, especially since with the advent of the Internet, lots of information isn't exclusively part of one domain. There's probably a ton of duplicate data floating around that doesn't have to be.

Although, the NSA probably needs to be reigned in more. They grab so much data that they can't even analyze most of it. If they find anything meaningful, it is pure dumb luck.

Although the National Reconnaissance Office is probably the most brazen about it. I mean, look at this.

TheHandle United Earth from Stockholm Since: Jan, 2012 Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
United Earth
#118192: Apr 3rd 2016 at 4:05:06 PM

That is hilarious and horrifying. Hilourrifying.

Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that.
SeptimusHeap from Switzerland (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Mu
#118193: Apr 3rd 2016 at 4:11:13 PM

Sanders gets under Clinton's skin in New York: Seems like Sanders's persistence is wearing Clinton down. May be the reason for the somewhat more aggressive tone lately.

Bernie and Hillary's favorite punching bag: Scott Walker: Seems like Republican governors are serving as main targets rather than just practice in the primary, to the point that "you might think Hillary Clinton and Bernie Sanders are running against [Walker], rather than each other."

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
Silasw A procrastination in of itself from A handcart to hell (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
A procrastination in of itself
#118194: Apr 3rd 2016 at 4:15:01 PM

Well in the end the both truly running against the Republicans, which includes Walker.

“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran
ironballs16 Since: Jul, 2009 Relationship Status: Owner of a lonely heart
#118195: Apr 3rd 2016 at 4:15:57 PM

I think you guys keep meaning to type Jurisdiction Friction when discussing the various Alphabet Agencies.

"Why would I inflict myself on somebody else?"
Silasw A procrastination in of itself from A handcart to hell (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
A procrastination in of itself
#118196: Apr 3rd 2016 at 4:17:33 PM

It varies, sometimes it's friction over who should be in charge, some times it's outright rivalry when another agency is in charge and they know it, other times it's compartmentalisation of information coming round to bite everyone in the arse.

edited 3rd Apr '16 4:17:57 PM by Silasw

“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran
Krieger22 Causing freakouts over sourcing since 2018 from Malaysia Since: Mar, 2014 Relationship Status: I'm in love with my car
Causing freakouts over sourcing since 2018
#118197: Apr 3rd 2016 at 4:48:10 PM

Crossposting from the economics thread:

Economists don't believe Trump's claims that the US is headed for another recession. I think he's trying to play on the belief that economic uncertainty unseats incumbent governments as well.

I have disagreed with her a lot, but comparing her to republicans and propagandists of dictatorships is really low. - An idiot
ILoveDogs Since: May, 2010
#118198: Apr 3rd 2016 at 4:57:46 PM

So, if you haven't heard anything, one of my state senators (Dean Skelos) was put out of office because of a corruption scandal, and now they're doing a special election to elect his replacement, and the candidates are an anti-corruption Democrat and a Republican who worked under Skelos and whose main platform is "give less money to inner-city schools and more to the (rich) schools of my county".

Guess who I see more signs of?

FieldMarshalFry Field Marshal of Cracked from World Internet War 1 Since: Oct, 2015 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
Field Marshal of Cracked
#118199: Apr 3rd 2016 at 5:27:59 PM

the anti-corruption candidpfffffft, sorry, sorry, couldn't say it, it's the stupidly corrupt one ain't it?

advancing the front into TV Tropes
ILoveDogs Since: May, 2010
#118200: Apr 3rd 2016 at 5:29:28 PM

That's right! He's basically running on a platform of "fuck Bill de Blasio", which I wish wasn't as effective as it is.


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