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Clarste One Winged Egret Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
One Winged Egret
#118076: Apr 1st 2016 at 11:52:46 PM

The standard narrative is that the superdelegates wouldn't dare go against the popular vote, because that'd simply position themselves as the enemy of the people and democracy itself. That's not the best thing for your political career.

TheHandle United Earth from Stockholm Since: Jan, 2012 Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
United Earth
#118077: Apr 2nd 2016 at 12:17:43 AM

[up]A Bernie Sanders Supporter Confronted a Superdelegate — Then Leaked Their Private Conversation.

Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that.
GameGuruGG Vampire Hunter from Castlevania (Before Recorded History)
Vampire Hunter
#118078: Apr 2nd 2016 at 12:19:38 AM

In addition, President Sanders would not be as bad for the Democratic Establishment as President Trump would be for the Republican Establishment. The only thing Bernie Sanders is really a threat to is Hillary Clinton's presidential aspirations, since I don't think the Democratic Party will allow Hillary to run a third time for the Democratic nomination if she loses to Sanders. After all, she would have lost to Obama badly in 2008 and just barely gotten beaten by Sanders in this scenario, so the Democratic Party Leaders might decide that the voters just don't want Hillary Clinton as President.

edited 2nd Apr '16 12:21:02 AM by GameGuruGG

Wizard Needs Food Badly
Clarste One Winged Egret Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
One Winged Egret
#118079: Apr 2nd 2016 at 12:35:12 AM

[up][up]Superdelegates don't represent states anyway, so I'm not sure why this is such a big deal. I mean, they're from states, but they don't represent the will of the voters or anything. The idea is that they currently support Clinton because she's winning, but if Sanders magically turns things around before the convention they'd feel pressured to ride that wave at the risk of being on the wrong side of history when the party collapses, or whatever. A single superdelegate from Alaska at a time when Clinton's nomination is all but guaranteed is hardly a counterexample, regardless of how Alaska's caucuses turned out.

I mean, I'm not saying that's necessarily what's going to happen, I just don't think that conversation is meaningful, and honestly I felt kind of sorry for her being pestered like that.

edited 2nd Apr '16 12:35:54 AM by Clarste

TheHandle United Earth from Stockholm Since: Jan, 2012 Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
United Earth
#118080: Apr 2nd 2016 at 12:44:43 AM

On the one hand, so did I. But on the other hand, I have a deep antipahty for people who end a declaration with "End of conversation." All the more so when they keep on replying afterwards. The truth is that she handled it with a lot of condescension, and would have been better off not trying to get the last word.

Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that.
Cronosonic (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#118081: Apr 2nd 2016 at 12:50:47 AM

On the bright side, Bernie isn't the Democrats' equivalent to Drumpf. While the Democratic establishment aren't exactly thrilled by Bernie actively attacking the party's status quo and trying to drag them and their preferred candidate towards the left, they can live with a Sanders presidency and don't consider his presence to be an existential problem for the party. The Republican establishment, on the other hand, are hyperventilating and actively considering a brokered convention to prevent Drumpf from taking the GOP to places they desperately don't want.

Ramidel Since: Jan, 2001
#118082: Apr 2nd 2016 at 12:52:13 AM

The idea is that they currently support Clinton because she's winning, but if Sanders magically turns things around before the convention they'd feel pressured to ride that wave at the risk of being on the wrong side of history when the party collapses, or whatever.

A rather dumb idea, since the DNC is primarily composed of apparatchiks to begin with.

A party split is unlikely. What's more likely is that Hillary will be forced through, Sanders won't run third-party, and the backlash will lead to revolts against the state Democratic conventions. What I'd like to see is a Sanders run in 2020 (if Sanders is up for it) fuelled by a mass revolt against the state Democratic Committees. Sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander, and fortunately, Hillary being purged in mid-term by her own party is unlikely to weaken us against the Republicans.

Kayeka (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#118083: Apr 2nd 2016 at 1:01:14 AM

[up]I doubt that Sanders will be able to run in 2020, but considering the support he had gotten, it shouldn't be too weird for someone younger to take the torch.

Ramidel Since: Jan, 2001
#118084: Apr 2nd 2016 at 1:22:22 AM

Yeah, but the biggest name for a Sanders heir I can think of (Lincoln Chafee) has consistently failed to get any traction.

Still, it'd be awesome to have Clinton lame-ducked at her inauguration because of all the crap Schultz has pulled. Baby steps and all.

edited 2nd Apr '16 1:22:40 AM by Ramidel

SeptimusHeap from Switzerland (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Mu
#118085: Apr 2nd 2016 at 1:23:27 AM

Why only a presidential election year? I know that Congress is underrated, but for a "Sanderite revolution" a midterm year may be an option worth considering. The DNC doesn't care what happens in these years so you won't have any superdelegates or manipulation attempts there.

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
Ramidel Since: Jan, 2001
#118086: Apr 2nd 2016 at 1:37:04 AM

The way to support Sanders in Congress, right now, is to get more Democrats into Congress, not launch primary attacks on any who are not progressive enough - we don't have any actual Blue Dogs anymore.

While primarying Schultz might be viscerally satisfying, since she is a US Representative, the objective would be to fix the system the Democratic Party uses to select its Presidential candidate - which Schultz has admitted is designed to keep the party apparat from having to run for their places as delegates.

SeptimusHeap from Switzerland (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Mu
#118087: Apr 2nd 2016 at 1:40:45 AM

You still do have Blue Dogs. Not all of them are tied to swing or red districts, a Blue Dog can also be elected in a safe blue district. I also did not say that primarying Blue Dogs is the only way to go about this - voter enthusiasm that the current DNC does not inspire in midterm elections is the main scope here.

I also think that people like Boss Water-brain even though they aren't Blue Dogs per se are a problem even without her attempts to rig the presidential primary - see that support of hers to defang that financial services bureau for example.

edited 2nd Apr '16 1:41:44 AM by SeptimusHeap

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
Ramidel Since: Jan, 2001
#118088: Apr 2nd 2016 at 1:44:18 AM

Well, either way, a shakeup in the DNC is needed - and a view toward Sanders 2020 makes a good rallying cry for the same. "Congressional organization 2018" just isn't as sexy.

Clarste One Winged Egret Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
One Winged Egret
#118089: Apr 2nd 2016 at 1:48:00 AM

It would be helpful if it was sexy enough to get people to vote, at least.

Medinoc from France (Before Recorded History)
#118090: Apr 2nd 2016 at 2:35:25 AM

Sanders will have a hard time convincing the superdelegates if, as my friends told me, "the superdelegates system was invented to keep people like Sanders out of the nomination"...

"And as long as a sack of shit is not a good thing to be, chivalry will never die."
Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#118091: Apr 2nd 2016 at 3:28:03 AM

>I wonder if TV Tropes has ever been subject to FBI surveillance.

Not very likely

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
ironballs16 Since: Jul, 2009 Relationship Status: Owner of a lonely heart
#118092: Apr 2nd 2016 at 5:11:16 AM

So has anyone else noticed something odd regarding coverage of Arizona's primary problems? I mean, you'd think it'd be major fucking news when a Secretary of State confirms that election fraud happens, but I can't find anything involving that testimony on the more "mainstream" channels (CNN, NY Times, etc.), which is just shameful. Hell, the last thing CNN reported on with Arizona's primary was the petition from voters and Phoenix's Mayor to have the DOJ investigate, but after that? Nothing since the 25th.

"Why would I inflict myself on somebody else?"
Luminosity Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Lovey-Dovey
#118093: Apr 2nd 2016 at 5:26:37 AM

[up] Thanks for that site. There I found a link to this little gem.

Now who has an abuse problem again? Who are the dangerous harrassers again? waii

Silasw A procrastination in of itself from A handcart to hell (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
A procrastination in of itself
#118094: Apr 2nd 2016 at 6:54:35 AM

Now who has an abuse problem again? Who are the dangerous harrassers again?

Many Twitter users it would appear, regardless of what political positions they claim to have.

“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran
GameGuruGG Vampire Hunter from Castlevania (Before Recorded History)
Vampire Hunter
#118095: Apr 2nd 2016 at 7:11:37 AM

To be fair, I believe that the people who have this utter dislike of the Establishment, both on the Democratic and Republican sides, will need their desires addressed. There will be more Sanderses and Trumps in future elections given how popular Sanders is with young voters and how popular Donald Trump has been with Republican voters.

edited 2nd Apr '16 7:12:16 AM by GameGuruGG

Wizard Needs Food Badly
Silasw A procrastination in of itself from A handcart to hell (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
A procrastination in of itself
#118096: Apr 2nd 2016 at 7:13:48 AM

That assumes that neither get the nomination, Trump getting it and loosing will take the wind out of the sails of his supporters, Sander's year, but if Clinton is smart she might be able to fold them in with a good VP pick who both sides would be happy with some 2024.

“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran
ironballs16 Since: Jul, 2009 Relationship Status: Owner of a lonely heart
#118097: Apr 2nd 2016 at 7:28:33 AM

@Luminosity

Haven't had a chance to look at the page (I'm at work), but keep the GIFT in mind when taking online actions and statements into account. Trump's supporters, by contrast, pull their stuff in full view of the public.

"Why would I inflict myself on somebody else?"
optimusjamie Since: Jun, 2010
#118098: Apr 2nd 2016 at 8:14:06 AM

[up][up] Isn't the VP typically a foil to the President anyway, like Kennedy & Johnson or Obama and Biden?

Direct all enquiries to Jamie B Good
GameGuruGG Vampire Hunter from Castlevania (Before Recorded History)
Vampire Hunter
#118099: Apr 2nd 2016 at 8:16:59 AM

[up][up][up] Having Trump run and lose and having a Clinton VP pick that matches the ideals of Sanders would be addressing those desires. The former would be the Republican Establishment giving up on fighting Trump to have an "We told you so" moment after Clinton wins. The latter would be Clinton and by extension, the Democratic Party understanding that this thing started by Sanders isn't going away and to accept those ideals into the fold as it were.

edited 2nd Apr '16 8:17:51 AM by GameGuruGG

Wizard Needs Food Badly
Luminosity Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Lovey-Dovey
#118100: Apr 2nd 2016 at 8:31:55 AM

Now I start thinking what would be the single dumbest(a.k.a. most likely) VP pick for Trump.


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