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Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM
To be fair, I can see the benefits in mandatory but temporary service, including teaching discipline, teaching people how to properly operate a firearm and close-quarters self-defense. Though I personally would rather have conscripts be able to refuse going into outright combat even if they've done enough training.
Though from a different angle, that might actually lend some strength to the required service argument. Maybe this is just too optimistic, but perhaps incorporating more people who aren't the "soldier type" could amend some of those issues. Of course, that's assuming those people aren't unilaterally converted, not to mention that the military isn't exactly known for its flexibility.
The military isn't an institution that values or permits dissent at a fundamental level. You can question individual decisions, somewhat, with rank, but you're expected to be with the program and believe in the military's mission, even if it's wholly repugnant or wrongheaded, so I don't think putting a diverse array of people into the military will make it better — you'll just get a superficially diverse array of mooks.
"We didn't always used to be so gung-ho about war though...The old conservatives were against it."
The old conservatives were against European entanglement. They were perfectly okay with empire-building.
edited 27th Mar '16 11:24:21 PM by CrimsonZephyr
"For all those whose cares have been our concern, the work goes on, the cause endures, the hope still lives, and the dream shall never die."The purpose of mandatory service in the social dimension is not diversity, it is to ensure that all levels of society have a connection to the military. It becomes reliant on its reserve therefore cannot afford to use them willy-nilly, as it includes the working population of an entire country. The culture of a reserve based military is different. Not sure if the US will benefit from bastardizing their system.
The civilian option would be pretty handy though.
Si Vis Pacem, Para Perkele
Indeed. Going to have to call [citation needed] on the idea that mandatory military service provides a direct social benefit.
If we're talking about Switzerland; the whole reason for their service and widespread gun ownership is because for most of the 20th century they were gonna be the Soviet Union's first stepping stone in a hypothetical invasion of the West. Arming every civilian was their way of making sure they'd last more than a few days.
Not because they wanna play cowboy or exercise their god given rights or any of that nonsense.
edited 28th Mar '16 6:39:32 AM by LeGarcon
Oh really when?To be fair, I can see the benefits in mandatory but temporary service, including teaching discipline, teaching people how to properly operate a firearm and close-quarters self-defense. Though I personally would rather have conscripts be able to refuse going into outright combat even if they've done enough training.
Those aren't things that the average person needs. You could make pretty much the exact same argument for say, mandatory math camp, but nobody's arguing for that.
Blind Final Fantasy 6 Let's PlayI would spring for mandatory economics camp, but you'd have to have math camp as a prerequisite, and to be cut off from reality TV for a week beforehand to clean your mind.
"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"I think this is one of those things where change actually has to come from the top down. People would resent being drafted into military because other branches of government would direct them into campaigns they might not agree with morally or politically, and the best way to curb that resentment is to have government branches that are not likely to authorize wild goose chases.
Accordingly, before we do anything about 'military culture,' I think there are mandatory prerequisites like ending the war on drugs, drastically reevaluating our approaches with traditional enemy nations like Iran, and, of course, having political parties where one side isn't insanely jingoistic. Trying to 'fix' the military without fixing the arm that wields it first will just result in a broken weapon still being wielded against the wrong targets and in the wrong way.
Nor do we have any pressing need for the draft logistically, which would be the primary justification for conscription. We have plenty of soldiers and we have plenty of tools. The problem is how we use them, not how many of them we have. Short of WWIII starting up out of nowhere, that's not going to change.
Furthermore, I think Guantanamo must be destroyed.I thought that was the areas West of the IGB; specifically Helmstadt?
The US Military does have shortages in some areas, such as pilots of the UAV and fighter sort...
Keep Rolling OnHow is that supposed to be different from the US?
Where do you get the idea that civic duty must entail being intolerant? It's the exact opposite, a culture which encourages citizens to be well-educated and participate in civil society, teaching respect for others, fosters tolerance.
It's when citizens are apathetic, aren't encouraged to be part of civil society, are poorly educated, and taught to feel resentment that intolerance is a major problem.
What I'm trying to say is, the Left must recover the spirit of tradition and patriotism from the people who are ruining the country with their nonsense. People inherently need tradition, but there's a vast variety of traditions that aren't rooted that sort of bullshit.
By appealing to the egalitarian, democratic, and individualist tradition of America, they can better convince traditionalists, and frame the Right as radicals corrupting America with their greed. Just call it "conservative" and "tradition".
edited 28th Mar '16 8:18:37 AM by CassidyTheDevil
Mandatory military service leads to a strong and active anti-war movement. Exhibit A: Vietnam. World War I also had a similar opposition, but it didn't last as long for us, and Wilson was able to effectively quash dissent with everything short of a whiff of grapeshot.
Georgia Gov. Nathan Deal vetoes "religious liberty" anti-gay bill.
We have a special on flying bacon. Sadly, I can't draw any conclusions about the governor actually having a shred of principle from this, but I can compliment him on his nice little burn there.
The headline I saw said that he was responding to pressure from companies who were going to withdraw their business from the state if discrimination laws went through, which creates a very weird stopped-clock situation wherein Republicans' slavish fealty to business occasionally causes them to make socially progressive political decisions.
edited 28th Mar '16 8:34:10 AM by Fighteer
"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"

If we expanded civilian service options, I could somewhat agree with the need for some sort of call-up, but I just plainly disagree with the military's subculture and general political bent, and it would be absolute torture having to rub shoulders with such troglodytes for year after year until some idiot politician got such a tremendous war boner that we all get sent to some shithole and get shot.
"Is Switzerland a nation of thugs? I wasn't aware of that, but regardless they seem pretty well-off."
Switzerland has a state policy of absolute neutrality and ergo isn't nearly as gung-ho about war as the United States. It's because America is a nation of thugs that I'm leery about getting more of us involved in the military.
edited 27th Mar '16 10:54:58 PM by CrimsonZephyr
"For all those whose cares have been our concern, the work goes on, the cause endures, the hope still lives, and the dream shall never die."