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Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM

Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#115051: Mar 9th 2016 at 8:37:46 AM

[up] Which would indeed be a big deal, if it happened and can be proven.

Edit: Damn page toppers.

edited 9th Mar '16 8:37:59 AM by Fighteer

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
SolipsistOwl Since: Jan, 2016
#115052: Mar 9th 2016 at 8:47:10 AM

The full article has a lot more information on other corporations/nations that were involved in Clinton's arms sales and Clinton Foundation donations.

Clinton Foundation Donors Got Weapons Deals From Hillary Clinton's State Department

Even by the standards of arms deals between the United States and Saudi Arabia, this one was enormous. A consortium of American defense contractors led by Boeing would deliver $29 billion worth of advanced fighter jets to the United States' oil-rich ally in the Middle East.

Israeli officials were agitated, reportedly complaining to the Obama administration that this substantial enhancement to Saudi air power risked disrupting the region's fragile balance of power. The deal appeared to collide with the State Department’s documented concerns about the repressive policies of the Saudi royal family.

But now, in late 2011, Hillary Clinton’s State Department was formally clearing the sale, asserting that it was in the national interest. At press conferences in Washington to announce the department’s approval, an assistant secretary of state, Andrew Shapiro, declared that the deal had been “a top priority” for Clinton personally. Shapiro, a longtime aide to Clinton since her Senate days, added that the “U.S. Air Force and U.S. Army have excellent relationships in Saudi Arabia.”

These were not the only relationships bridging leaders of the two nations. In the years before Hillary Clinton became secretary of state, the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia contributed at least $10 million to the Clinton Foundation, the philanthropic enterprise she has overseen with her husband, former president Bill Clinton. Just two months before the deal was finalized, Boeing — the defense contractor that manufactures one of the fighter jets the Saudis were especially keen to acquire, the F-15 — contributed $900,000 to the Clinton Foundation, according to a company press release.

The Saudi deal was one of dozens of arms sales approved by Hillary Clinton’s State Department that placed weapons in the hands of governments that had also donated money to the Clinton family philanthropic empire, an International Business Times investigation has found.

Under Clinton's leadership, the State Department approved $165 billion worth of commercial arms sales to 20 nations whose governments have given money to the Clinton Foundation, according to an IB Times analysis of State Department and foundation data. That figure — derived from the three full fiscal years of Clinton’s term as Secretary of State (from October 2010 to September 2012) — represented nearly double the value of American arms sales made to the those countries and approved by the State Department during the same period of President George W. Bush’s second term.

The Clinton-led State Department also authorized $151 billion of separate Pentagon-brokered deals for 16 of the countries that donated to the Clinton Foundation, resulting in a 143 percent increase in completed sales to those nations over the same time frame during the Bush administration. These extra sales were part of a broad increase in American military exports that accompanied Obama’s arrival in the White House. The 143 percent increase in U.S. arms sales to Clinton Foundation donors compares to an 80 percent increase in such sales to all countries over the same time period.

American defense contractors also donated to the Clinton Foundation while Hillary Clinton was secretary of state and in some cases made personal payments to Bill Clinton for speaking engagements. Such firms and their subsidiaries were listed as contractors in $163 billion worth of Pentagon-negotiated deals that were authorized by the Clinton State Department between 2009 and 2012.

In all, governments and corporations involved in the arms deals approved by Clinton’s State Department have delivered between $54 million and $141 million to the Clinton Foundation as well as hundreds of thousands of dollars in payments to the Clinton family, according to foundation and State Department records. The Clinton Foundation publishes only a rough range of individual contributors’ donations, making a more precise accounting impossible.

Were they bribes? That may or may not be what the FBI is trying to figure out. It may tie into two missing Clinton E-mails released by Romanian hacker Guccifer showing that she was aware of the Benghazi attacks being planned and financed by Saudi Arabia. (Guccifer is being extradited by the Department of Justice to the U.S. for 18 months)

edited 9th Mar '16 8:49:26 AM by SolipsistOwl

Greenmantle V from Greater Wessex, Britannia Since: Feb, 2010 Relationship Status: Hiding
V
#115053: Mar 9th 2016 at 9:12:07 AM

[up] Mind you, when it comes to the Arms Trade, Bribes are pretty normal. Everyone does it, somehow.

Keep Rolling On
SolipsistOwl Since: Jan, 2016
#115054: Mar 9th 2016 at 9:14:19 AM

They also don't normally have a private server with all the evidence on it, forcing the FBI to take action.

Aszur A nice butterfly from Pagliacci's Since: Apr, 2014 Relationship Status: Don't hug me; I'm scared
A nice butterfly
#115055: Mar 9th 2016 at 9:20:46 AM

Didn't Colin Powell and Condoleza Rice also do it?

It has always been the prerogative of children and half-wits to point out that the emperor has no clothes
Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#115056: Mar 9th 2016 at 9:24:54 AM

I'm not sure how many former Secretaries of State have had their entire email archive released to the public. I wonder how many would withstand that kind of scrutiny. Unfortunately, you have to deal with some dirty folks if you are going to play in international politics.

edited 9th Mar '16 9:25:27 AM by Fighteer

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
Montegoraon Since: Jan, 2011
#115057: Mar 9th 2016 at 9:28:56 AM

Powell and Rice had private servers. They didn't have large charitable organizations to funnel money through.

SolipsistOwl Since: Jan, 2016
#115058: Mar 9th 2016 at 9:29:43 AM

State Department: Powell, Rice staffers received classified info via personal email

Powell had both a private and government E-mail, but used both on government servers. He primarily used his government E-mail for government-related business, so very few classified E-mails slipped through to his private account.

He also turned over all correspondences to the State Department following his tenure, rather than keeping it all on a private server.

Colin Powell and top staffers for Condoleezza Rice received classified information through personal email accounts, according to a new report from State Department investigators.

The emails were discovered during a State Department review of the email practices of the past five secretaries of state. It found that Powell received two emails that were classified and that the "immediate staff" working for Rice received 10 emails that were classified.

The information was deemed either "secret" or "confidential," according to the report.

"Based on the department's responses and findings to date, additional potential classified material and/or highly sensitive information not intended for distribution may reside in the Department's unclassified paper and electronic archives associated with Secretaries Powell and Rice and their respective staff," a memo about the report said.

Powell said he never kept the emails in his possession when he left the State Department.Unlike Clinton, Powell's emails remained in government computer servers.

Rice didn't even use E-mail. The classified information was through her aides.

An aide to Rice, who now teaches at Stanford University, said that Rice herself never used email — not even a personal email account — during her tenure.

edited 9th Mar '16 9:35:49 AM by SolipsistOwl

Aszur A nice butterfly from Pagliacci's Since: Apr, 2014 Relationship Status: Don't hug me; I'm scared
A nice butterfly
#115059: Mar 9th 2016 at 9:32:37 AM

Then why the focus on Clinton alone?

It has always been the prerogative of children and half-wits to point out that the emperor has no clothes
LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#115060: Mar 9th 2016 at 9:33:58 AM

Because she's the one running for president and it's a good hook?

Aszur A nice butterfly from Pagliacci's Since: Apr, 2014 Relationship Status: Don't hug me; I'm scared
A nice butterfly
#115061: Mar 9th 2016 at 9:36:27 AM

I mean besides the "Besmirch the rep of a running candidate" obvious plug.

It has always been the prerogative of children and half-wits to point out that the emperor has no clothes
LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#115062: Mar 9th 2016 at 9:38:06 AM

People just really hate Hilary Clinton then?

SolipsistOwl Since: Jan, 2016
#115063: Mar 9th 2016 at 9:39:50 AM

She conducted government business solely on her private account on a private server and never even used her State Department-issued E-mail address.

It seems very much like an attempt to avoid FOIA requests and transparency.

edited 9th Mar '16 9:40:16 AM by SolipsistOwl

LeGarcon Blowout soon fellow Stalker from Skadovsk Since: Aug, 2013 Relationship Status: Gay for Big Boss
Blowout soon fellow Stalker
#115064: Mar 9th 2016 at 9:42:58 AM

Or maybe she's just using a personal sever because it's the only way she can do her job?

Government servers blow some serious ass.

Oh really when?
Aszur A nice butterfly from Pagliacci's Since: Apr, 2014 Relationship Status: Don't hug me; I'm scared
A nice butterfly
#115065: Mar 9th 2016 at 9:44:04 AM

Sounds like a breach of protocol, not a breach of moral or process issue. Would be more worrying if she was not doing her job, doing it badly, or if this yielded evidence of her using the statesec position to attain things for herself.

And the fact that the use of state servers is a suggestion and not an obligation seems to imply it is not even a breach of protocol.

And in all of those cases the blame is as heavy on the Obama administration for not keeping tabs on their statesec, and if the Obama adminsitration was aware of this it means they trusted Clinton with this and before you would want to initiate any investigaiton you would need proof she was doing these illicit things before throwing around accusations.

Otherwise it really, really, really, really just sounds like tabloid accusations of the same value as a kardashian gossip

edited 9th Mar '16 9:45:11 AM by Aszur

It has always been the prerogative of children and half-wits to point out that the emperor has no clothes
SolipsistOwl Since: Jan, 2016
#115066: Mar 9th 2016 at 9:44:08 AM

[up]The State Department didn't even have an Inspector General to oversee State business until after she left and Kerry came on.

I don't think her job involved ordering her aides to strip classification markings and send documents via fax.

edited 9th Mar '16 9:45:23 AM by SolipsistOwl

Aszur A nice butterfly from Pagliacci's Since: Apr, 2014 Relationship Status: Don't hug me; I'm scared
A nice butterfly
#115067: Mar 9th 2016 at 9:46:48 AM

I ask the opposite: How can any of these not involve either of those?

I would like to question why there was no inspector general, but if that is the case, then the whole Clinton mess matters even less because it is beholding Clinton to rules that were placed AFTER she left that position

edited 9th Mar '16 9:50:50 AM by Aszur

It has always been the prerogative of children and half-wits to point out that the emperor has no clothes
Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#115068: Mar 9th 2016 at 9:52:30 AM

The suggestion seems to be that Clinton was deliberately ignoring procedures intended to maintain classification rules, when the prosaic explanation is that State was working with absurd protocols and outdated systems and she needed to bypass them in order to get anything useful done.

Benefit of the doubt aside, can it be shown that any actual harm came from these actions, as opposed to the mere possibility of harm? We're talking about trusting her to be head of state, not to be Mother Theresa. A saint would make a terrible President.

edited 9th Mar '16 9:56:34 AM by Fighteer

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
SolipsistOwl Since: Jan, 2016
#115069: Mar 9th 2016 at 9:53:38 AM

Ironically, Mother Theresa is an infamously horrible person.

Aszur A nice butterfly from Pagliacci's Since: Apr, 2014 Relationship Status: Don't hug me; I'm scared
A nice butterfly
#115070: Mar 9th 2016 at 9:55:36 AM

That is what I am asking, really. I mean, if she was using those servers for nefarious, moustache twirling purposes or otherwise some other sort of self profiting way, it would be noticeable, but during her tenure as Statesec, I don't think anyone can say Clinton fucked up and if anyone could, it would be the Obama Administration.

It's just loud, annoying and pointless. Like Kardashian gossip. But unlike kardashian gossip there is no T&A on the newspaper frontpages. And That's Terrible.

It has always been the prerogative of children and half-wits to point out that the emperor has no clothes
Lennik (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#115071: Mar 9th 2016 at 10:08:12 AM

[up][up]Didn't she keep sick houses without properly treating people because she felt being around suffering brought her closer to her god, or do I have my facts mixed up?

That's right, boys. Mondo cool.
Aszur A nice butterfly from Pagliacci's Since: Apr, 2014 Relationship Status: Don't hug me; I'm scared
A nice butterfly
#115072: Mar 9th 2016 at 10:09:29 AM

I am not sure if the Mother Theresa subject is appropriate for this thread. Might be better taking it elsewhere.

It has always been the prerogative of children and half-wits to point out that the emperor has no clothes
Clarste One Winged Egret Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
One Winged Egret
#115073: Mar 9th 2016 at 10:12:23 AM

[up][up]I think she thought suffering was good for people in general. It wasn't selfish of her, just something most people would disagree with.

TotemicHero No longer a forum herald from the next level Since: Dec, 2009
No longer a forum herald
#115074: Mar 9th 2016 at 10:13:40 AM

Especially since none of you can spell her name correctly. tongue (There's no "H".)

Expergiscēre cras, medior quam hodie. (Awaken tomorrow, better than today.)
Aszur A nice butterfly from Pagliacci's Since: Apr, 2014 Relationship Status: Don't hug me; I'm scared
A nice butterfly
#115075: Mar 9th 2016 at 10:14:16 AM

Fuck you, Thotemic!

It has always been the prerogative of children and half-wits to point out that the emperor has no clothes

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