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Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM
Look, as people have said, the Clintons have been bombarded by accusations of corruption, murder, collusion, calumny, and being a pair of meany doo-doo-heads since the 70s. You'd think that one of those charges would have stuck, but either they are the most proficient conspirators of any politicians in history, or there's no fire beneath that smoke.
At this point, it is safe to assume that anyone accusing Clinton or casting shade on her on the basis of past accusations is either a victim of the disinformation cycle or concern trolling. Saying, "Well, there has never been a fire before, but if we just keep looking, maybe we'll find one this time," is asinine. Give it up, already.
"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"Decades of bullshit from the Right does not mean that the left loose the right to levy legitimate questions and criticisms against Clinton.
edited 19th Feb '16 8:28:35 PM by Silasw
“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ CyranMaybe no conspiracy but she really does the hypocrisy shtick well. And this above bit is why people don't trust her to stick to nuking TPP.
Well, at least it's real evidence of her lying about her political intentions. Better than rumors and speculation.
"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"@Silas: you might should check your grammar a bit, your sentences are getting a little hard to parse.
Also, when did anyone expect Clinton to nuke the TPP? Can't say I care much about the TPP, mostly because I really do not understand international commerce all that well. There was a whole bunch of alarmism (and quite frankly I'm getting tired of internet alarmism to the point of dismissing it most times I hear it) and then some people saying it was not that bad, or at least not catastrophic.
It's more she's recently come out against it. And this shows a pattern where she'll claim to be against a free trade deal vs. secretly brokering for it.
(The biggest concern is it would basically be SOPA and NAFTA. Basically think the DMCA on steroids (i.e. why Youtube pulls videos), combined with even more hollowing out of American manual labor jobs.)
The TPP's opposition comes at a time when people are tired of being teeth kicked enough already by poorly written free trade deals causing layoffs.
It's not going to completely wreck household incomes or anything (probably), but my objections to TPP are mainly not to do with the actual free trade provisions and are rather about all the extra bullshit packed into it, like Investor-to-State Dispute Settlement (the "right" of trans-national corporations to sue entire nations for "lost" profits), the exportation of all the terrible parts of U.S. copyright law without including any of the parts that make it remotely reasonable (for example, Fair Use), and so on and so forth. Basically, it won't wreck our economy, but given that assistance for worker retraining is almost guaranteed to be completely insufficient, it's going to fuck a lot of people (in the U.S.) over whilst the largest corporate players will disproportionately profit, and it will generally continue to solidify all the negative aspects of globalization more than it will the positive.
Of course, this is just my personal assessment.
Anyway, the point is not that everyone and their mother believed/knew Clinton was a liar about not supporting "free trade" agreements (that is, FTAs with all kinds of unnecessary crap tacked on). The point is that there's now solid proof that she's a liar on that topic, which makes all the difference in the world.
edited 19th Feb '16 8:22:54 PM by darksidevoid
GM: AGOG S4 & F/WC RP; Co-GM: TABA, SOTR, UUA RP; Sub-GM: TTS RP. I have brought peace, freedom, justice, and security to my new Empire.It's the duty of the SoS to help negotiate, and to some extent lobby the Senate for approval of, the President's treaties, but it's also the SoS' duty to advise the President, and I am rather disinclined to think that there was much sunlight between Barack and Hillary on those deals.
edited 19th Feb '16 8:42:17 PM by darksidevoid
GM: AGOG S4 & F/WC RP; Co-GM: TABA, SOTR, UUA RP; Sub-GM: TTS RP. I have brought peace, freedom, justice, and security to my new Empire.Well, that seems a bit... disingenuous. I mean, you should support the candidate you want to support, not the candidate someone else wants you to support. Not that you should ignore what other people have to say, but I can't say I like this removal of agency.
How do these caucuses work exactly anyways? Are there separate stations for each candidate? Polling centers?
Think for yourself! Don't let your mother dictate your political views.
Sit down with her and tell her your position and, if you disagree, then don't be ashamed to be on the opposite side of the battle lines from her. Mom and I squabble over politics all the time (and that isn't talking about Dad, who ran for Congress on the Libertarian platform).
Yeah, that's kind of not right of your mother to try to jack your vote like that. Although I do support that she's taking you to a caucus?? The sooner you learn how the process works the better, I think. Although after all that stuff in Iowa I'm still really confused about how that works. I'm so glad that in Texas it appears to simply involve casting a vote.
See, the issue is that a lot of people believe that there are differences between the two. Differences that Hillary doesn't want to say openly because they would cost her the nomination.
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard FeynmanPrecisely. There doesn't seem to be much in the way of ideological difference between Bernie and Hillary, now. Since Hillary has demonstrably "evolved" as a candidate. Which is not inherently a bad thing, nor is Bernie's ideological purity inherently a good thing. And if Hillary sticks to what she's saying now, a lot of people would be pretty happy with that. But a lot of those same people simply can't shake the doubt that Hillary will continue "evolving" in her policies once elected.
X8 Your mom insisting on the way you vote (even in a primary) is technically electoral fraud, it's your vote not hers.
Never let someone else control your vote, that undermines the entire point of democracy.
“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran![]()
Honestly, this whole issue probably helps Trump more than it hurts him, because again, what could he possibly say that would make things worse? note Maybe it'll gain him some fundamentalists still running on anti-Catholic sentiment, because there could be no better endorsement.
But more importantly, he's having a spat with The Pope! He's made it! Just by being the most obnoxious American on the face of the Earth! He's an inspiration to us all!
edited 20th Feb '16 3:29:42 AM by Eschaton
That is so sad, even though it made me laugh.
Nate Silver's thing actually did a bit on this and they're thinking that it may well hurt Trump, the Pope is popular Amongest Catholics and Catholic Reoublicans are a thing, it just comes down to if there's overlap between Catholics who like the Pope and Catholic Republicans who were considering voting for Trump.
“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran

I think that the "I'll release mine when others release there's" was stupid, if they're not worth releasing then just say that, don't piss about and try and sling mid.
edited 19th Feb '16 6:33:19 PM by Silasw
“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran