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Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM

FFShinra Since: Jan, 2001
#106926: Dec 16th 2015 at 2:23:14 PM

@Bense - But Cruz and Carson are okay to you?

Bense Since: Aug, 2010
#106927: Dec 16th 2015 at 2:28:09 PM

I repeat. My only answer so far is "not Trump."

AceofSpades Since: Apr, 2009 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
#106928: Dec 16th 2015 at 2:30:05 PM

He is, perhaps, not at all wowed by any of them. With as many as there are it's a bit difficult to for anyone that isn't Trump to stand out. Although I'm watching the news now and it seems like Jeb actually took an effective shot or two at Trump.

Man, remember when we thought it was going to be a weird dynastic fight between Clinton and Bush? Instead of this outlandish repeat and escalation of last time's Republican candidacy? I'm starting to wonder if this is going to be the start of a new pattern with the Republicans.

Also, voting does indeed matter. If it didn't matter there wouldn't be such a strong push to restrict voting rights. I have stated before that I think the Electoral College is outdated, but I don't think it's on anyone's major radar as a thing that needs to be reformed. If it's on anyone's radar at all.

Skycobra51 A suitable case for treatment from The US of A Since: Nov, 2013 Relationship Status: Only knew I loved her when I let her go
A suitable case for treatment
#106929: Dec 16th 2015 at 2:35:48 PM

The only votes that really matter are those from the swing states.

Look upon my privilege ye mighty and despair.
Bense Since: Aug, 2010
#106930: Dec 16th 2015 at 2:37:21 PM

I'm going to vote for whoever I eventually find "least bad." Unfortunately, right now Trump is pretty much drowning everyone else out. Once he implodes I'm hoping I can take a better look at the candidates who are left.

My state's primary is still six months away. Most of the people on the stage last night will be out by the time I get to vote.

And those of us who live in the less populated states are quite happy with the Electoral College the way it is, thank you. If it didn't exist we wouldn't get any "face time" with the candidates at all.

LogoP Party Crasher from the Land of Deep Blue Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: You can be my wingman any time
Party Crasher
#106931: Dec 16th 2015 at 2:37:45 PM

[up][up][up] Political dynasties are always bad news.

edited 16th Dec '15 2:38:04 PM by LogoP

It is sometimes an appropriate response to reality to go insane.
Rationalinsanity from Halifax, Canada Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
#106932: Dec 16th 2015 at 2:38:16 PM

[up][up][up]And that's why the RNC is terrified about Cruz or Trump winning the nomination; because those are exactly the types of states they A) can't win and B) are likely to hurt the party in already close races for Senator/Governor.

edited 16th Dec '15 2:38:29 PM by Rationalinsanity

Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.
Skycobra51 A suitable case for treatment from The US of A Since: Nov, 2013 Relationship Status: Only knew I loved her when I let her go
A suitable case for treatment
#106933: Dec 16th 2015 at 2:41:56 PM

I was under the impression it was because they're not the ideal Republican canidates and refuse to avoid rocking the boat.

[up][up][up] No face time? Try living in Maryland then talk about face time with canidates.

edited 16th Dec '15 2:48:17 PM by Skycobra51

Look upon my privilege ye mighty and despair.
Rationalinsanity from Halifax, Canada Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
#106934: Dec 16th 2015 at 2:50:16 PM

The boat rocking is what's killing the GOP in the White House/Senate (slowly).

Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.
AceofSpades Since: Apr, 2009 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
#106935: Dec 16th 2015 at 2:54:10 PM

I was under the impression that Cruz had built his senatorial career on boat rocking, IE; ticking off his fellow party members by not respecting the concept of seniority and leading the whole charge on the government shutdown incident.

TheyCallMeTomu Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#106936: Dec 16th 2015 at 3:06:40 PM

The electoral college actually gives MOST small states NO face time, because they're fairly heavily red or blue.

edited 16th Dec '15 3:11:18 PM by TheyCallMeTomu

Bense Since: Aug, 2010
#106937: Dec 16th 2015 at 3:07:22 PM

Correct, but if it was a strict popular vote then they wouldn't get any at all.

TheyCallMeTomu Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#106938: Dec 16th 2015 at 3:11:46 PM

That's insane troll logic does not follow. Please elaborate.

edited 16th Dec '15 3:12:32 PM by TheyCallMeTomu

sgamer82 Since: Jan, 2001
#106939: Dec 16th 2015 at 3:20:50 PM

I don't know much about the EC, but it strikes me as similar to why we have a House and a Senate. Purely popular votes favor the interests of the more populous states. EC voting keeps things a bit more even. State-by-State popular voting may be a middle ground.

Kostya (Unlucky Thirteen)
#106940: Dec 16th 2015 at 3:23:16 PM

States with bigger populations have more electoral votes. They'll get a larger focus anyway.

Achaemenid HGW XX/7 from Ruschestraße 103, Haus 1 Since: Dec, 2011 Relationship Status: Giving love a bad name
HGW XX/7
#106941: Dec 16th 2015 at 3:23:33 PM

[up][up][up]

An example:

Wyoming has a population of 584,153 and 3 electoral votes, which works out to 1 electoral vote per 194,717 electors. California has a population of 38,800,000 and 55 electoral votes, which works out to 1 electoral vote per 704,455 electors.

edited 16th Dec '15 3:25:24 PM by Achaemenid

Schild und Schwert der Partei
Skycobra51 A suitable case for treatment from The US of A Since: Nov, 2013 Relationship Status: Only knew I loved her when I let her go
A suitable case for treatment
#106942: Dec 16th 2015 at 3:23:46 PM

[up][up][up]That's assuming an entire state votes Republican or Democrat.

edited 16th Dec '15 3:24:54 PM by Skycobra51

Look upon my privilege ye mighty and despair.
sgamer82 Since: Jan, 2001
#106943: Dec 16th 2015 at 3:26:05 PM

Are EC votes based upon the popular vote at all? If the popular vote swings one way, the college votes that way?

I have the impression the answer is no but thought I'd ask

edited 16th Dec '15 3:26:33 PM by sgamer82

Bense Since: Aug, 2010
#106944: Dec 16th 2015 at 3:27:11 PM

If the Presidential election were decided directly by the popular vote then a candidate would only have to get a majority of the voters in the nation as a whole. He would spend all of his time in the most populated states trying to maximize the influence of his limited resources, and could ignore some of the the less populated states completely, because they don't have enough votes to overturn a majority in the more heavily populated states.

Because the electoral college is "all or nothing" in most states and each state has at least 3 votes regardless of population, a successful candidate has to get votes in more total states to win than he would if it were a strict majority vote. Therefore under the electoral college a successful candidate has to pay more attention to more states and spread his resources more.

The Electoral College does exactly what it is designed to do - reduce the influence of the more heavily-populated states on a Presidential election and thereby increase the influence of the less-populated states.

LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#106945: Dec 16th 2015 at 3:27:48 PM

[up][up]They are for all states except Maine and Nebraska. That is, the popular vote in most states determines who all the states electoral votes go to. In Maine and Nebraska, they're distributed based on the popular vote in each congressional district.

edited 16th Dec '15 3:29:01 PM by LSBK

LeGarcon Blowout soon fellow Stalker from Skadovsk Since: Aug, 2013 Relationship Status: Gay for Big Boss
Blowout soon fellow Stalker
#106946: Dec 16th 2015 at 3:28:19 PM

EC votes are decided by popular vote. Technically the electors don't have to vote with the population but that's totally unprecedented.

Hell I don't know how the hell we would handle it if they voted against the population

Oh really when?
Bense Since: Aug, 2010
#106947: Dec 16th 2015 at 3:30:32 PM

In most states it's "all or nothing". The majority vote decides where ALL of the state's EC votes go.

Achaemenid HGW XX/7 from Ruschestraße 103, Haus 1 Since: Dec, 2011 Relationship Status: Giving love a bad name
HGW XX/7
#106948: Dec 16th 2015 at 3:30:46 PM

[up][up]

Not completely unprecedented.

It's never had a discernible impact on the outcome of the election though.

edited 16th Dec '15 3:31:00 PM by Achaemenid

Schild und Schwert der Partei
sgamer82 Since: Jan, 2001
#106949: Dec 16th 2015 at 3:37:02 PM

[up][up][up][up] So those two states have a College within their College almost?

Also it sounds like I had the right idea, it's the same kind of population/voice balance that created Congress as two houses.

edited 16th Dec '15 3:40:23 PM by sgamer82

LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#106950: Dec 16th 2015 at 3:40:55 PM

[up]I guess you could call it that. It doesn't really amount to much considering both Maine and Nebraska both go pretty solidly go Democrat or Republican in presidential elections. 2008 being a very notable exception that was not repeated in 2012.

Edit: I remember it was a big thing for a bit for Republicans in swing states to propose this system to make sure a Republican nominee can get at least some votes out of state that isn't guaranteed to go their way. That might still be a thing some of them are trying, I haven't heard about it in awhile.

edited 16th Dec '15 3:44:39 PM by LSBK


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