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Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM
1. While in prison Pollard began spinning the reason for why spied on the US as having a greater duty to the Jewish people than to the US, fueled by anger over America having known about concentration camps long before it did anything about it and having refused to take in Jewish refugees before WWII.
2. Never underestimate the siege mentality and Moral Myopia/Protagonist-Centered Morality on the part of Israel. If you're not backing Israel up every second of every day, then you're not really on their side as far as many of them are concerned. Of course, if their own actions injure you, that's just not the same...
edited 20th Nov '15 2:51:08 PM by TheWanderer
| Wandering, but not lost. | If people bring so much courage to this world...◊ |It would be one thing if he was an Israeli patriot who infiltrated the CIA, I would still say the US should keep his ass locked up, but I would understand why the Israeli's would consider him a hero. But this dude apparently had to be paid a shit ton to work for the Israeli's.
I Bring Doom,and a bit of gloom, but mostly gloom.On the topic of the Syrian refugees, Rochester's Catholic Family Center has an interesting statistic to cite
- namely, that out of ~750,000 refugees taken in over the past 15 years, not one has been charged with domestic terrorism, thanks largely to the 7-step, continent-spanning vetting system we've got in place.
Oh, and even they're calling "bullshit" on the proposals to deny refugees or only accept the Christian ones, which I think is pretty notable given the source.
"Why would I inflict myself on somebody else?"![]()
Europe has always been more openminded in regards to race,or really anything,than this country. Just compare how long it took most European nations to abolish slavery, and compare it to how long it took the US to get rid of it. Their is also the fact that their was apparently no segregation in Europe, and you would often take in black intellectuals who fled from the US. Plus we all know you guys aren't racist, your xenophobic
Regarding Pollard, he spent 30 years in prison. That's usually enough for someone to be considered to have paid their due.
"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"![]()
Considering how in much of history punishment for a spy consisted of being executed on the spot or tortured and then executed, Pollard and his supporters have absolutely nothing to complain about here, and should be pretty damn grateful, in fact. Especially considering espionage and treason are still capital offenses under the Federal Code.
Had Pollard done what he did for any other country than Israel, there's a decent chance that he would have been executed sometime in the 90s after his appeals ran out instead of having an entire country and lobbying group arguing for his release and then trying to integrate him into society in a comfy manner complete with being lauded and having work and lodging arranged for him when he did get released.
edited 21st Nov '15 9:05:21 AM by TheWanderer
| Wandering, but not lost. | If people bring so much courage to this world...◊ |@Jack
Taking slavery as an indicator of openness regarding race and absence of xenophobia isn't the best metric. Aside from the various Sibling Rivalry-level snark between various European nations, you've got overt xenophobia represented in a few political parties with said xenophobia as its main plank.
And on a completely unrelated note, I've wanted to say this for a while but never found occasion to - it's "definitely", not "defiantly"
In this case, those two are the same thing. The people objecting to the refugees are absolutely afraid of letting terrorists into the country. But they're so afraid of letting terrorists in because they automatically associate brown-skinned Muslims with terrorism.
![]()
You deceive yourself. They've been looking for ways to keep brown-skinned people out of the country because of racism, and terrorism gives them the excuse they wanted.
edited 21st Nov '15 9:18:34 AM by Fighteer
"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"I don't think Pollard would have been executed if he had been spying for, say, the Cubans or something. Post-Rosenburg, the death penalty for spies doesn't really seem to stick, especially when it's not over something as critical as the atomic bomb.
The dumb thing is that yeah, he was probably motivated by money. Most people who are "turned" are motivated by material concerns, not out of some sense of ethnic or idealistic solidarity.

Case in point, the reporter who basically got forced into retirement after saying Israel "should get out of Palestine". Expressing a personal opinion, but basically got blackballed for it.
edited 20th Nov '15 1:28:32 PM by ironballs16
"Why would I inflict myself on somebody else?"