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Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM

Silasw A procrastination in of itself from A handcart to hell (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
A procrastination in of itself
#102026: Sep 27th 2015 at 2:46:28 AM

I suspect it's in part because poor people are normally to poor to bring legal challenges. Also ID laws have been challenged, I'd be surprised if that wasn't part of the argument being used against them.

“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran
Ramidel Since: Jan, 2001
#102027: Sep 27th 2015 at 3:25:22 AM

The counter-argument that "Everyone should have an ID for any number of reasons, and the number of people without ID is insignificant - this isn't an actual barrier to voting" is persuasive enough if you have a vested interest in voter suppression.

Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#102028: Sep 27th 2015 at 4:53:02 AM

That a single American cannot get an ID, and therefore cannot vote, is a dominant argument against such laws.

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
TheyCallMeTomu Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#102029: Sep 27th 2015 at 8:25:24 AM

The people who support voter ID laws can't be reasoned with like that. They dismiss anyone too poor to get their own I Ds as the same people who want to raise the minimum wage: people who need to "better themselves." It's a moral issue for them, where a position of weakness in society is a moral failing to be punished.

tclittle Professional Forum Ninja from Somewhere Down in Texas Since: Apr, 2010
NativeJovian Jupiterian Local from Orlando, FL Since: Mar, 2014 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
Jupiterian Local
#102031: Sep 27th 2015 at 10:50:23 AM

Man attempts suicide by cop by shooting at random people at a gas station, deliberately taking aggressive posture toward responding officers. He was tased and arrested without further incident. And yes, for the record, he's black.

This showed up on my local news recently. It's never going to make the national news, because "man not killed by police" isn't newsworthy on a national scale. But this sort of thing happens all the time, and it annoys the shit out of me when people act like cops are all rabid power-mad psychopaths just waiting for an excuse to kill someone and get away with it.

Yeah, there's a problem that needs to be addressed in regards to police shootings, but it's not "cops are all goddamn wannabe murderers, fuck da police!", and I see that sentiment far too often.

Really from Jupiter, but not an alien.
Parable Since: Aug, 2009
#102032: Sep 27th 2015 at 10:50:23 AM

“The Bible says beware of false prophets. There are people out there spreading noise about how much can get done. I mean, this whole idea that we are going to shut down the government to get rid of Obamacare in 2013 – this plan never had a chance.”

“We’ve got groups here in town, members of the House and Senate here in town, who whip people into a frenzy believing that they can accomplish things that they know — they know! — are never gonna happen.”

Thus sayeth John Boehner, who no longer sees the need to pretend he agrees with the Tea Party on anything anymore.

He defended his record, saying he achieved “the largest deficit reduction deal in the history of the country” and the first major entitlement reforms in two decades — “all done over the last 4 1/2 years with a Democrat president and all voted against by my most conservative members because it wasn’t good enough. Really!?”

FFShinra Since: Jan, 2001
#102033: Sep 27th 2015 at 11:05:19 AM

Saw that article earlier. Kinda like how Boehner is like "I don't give a damn anymore."

Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#102034: Sep 27th 2015 at 11:09:06 AM

You know, that's more or less what everyone thought Boehner was thinking during those times. It's rather gratifying to see it confirmed. Boehner is a man who has, over the course of his career, watched his caucus go down the slippery slope from conservative to insane reactionary.

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
Mopman43 Since: Nov, 2013
#102035: Sep 27th 2015 at 11:18:18 AM

Reading an article on the responses of the candidates to his resignation, I was struck by something; Santorum's running?

Kostya (Unlucky Thirteen)
#102036: Sep 27th 2015 at 11:21:16 AM

Why wouldn't he? He was right behind Romney for most of the 2012 cycle.

TheyCallMeTomu Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#102037: Sep 27th 2015 at 11:24:09 AM

In fact, if you assumed it worked like it historically does, the fact that he was the runner up would suggest he get the nomination this time.

However, he's not the establishment candidate, so I have my doubts.

FFShinra Since: Jan, 2001
#102038: Sep 27th 2015 at 11:24:20 AM

[up][up][up]Along with Jindal, Pataki, Graham, and Gilmore.

edited 27th Sep '15 11:24:26 AM by FFShinra

Memers Since: Aug, 2013
#102039: Sep 27th 2015 at 12:16:00 PM

[up]x5

And that's why it is so incredibly bad that he is leaving.

TheyCallMeTomu Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#102040: Sep 27th 2015 at 12:23:10 PM

Poor Boehner, never truly appreciated until you're halfway out the door~

Greenmantle V from Greater Wessex, Britannia Since: Feb, 2010 Relationship Status: Hiding
Memers Since: Aug, 2013
#102042: Sep 27th 2015 at 12:38:35 PM

[up][up] And yet the conservatives who drove him to quit are dancing and holding parties...

Also the Dems and the moderate and even old school conservative Republicans knew the man was literally the Only Sane Man dealing with the freaks.

edited 27th Sep '15 12:38:54 PM by Memers

TheyCallMeTomu Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#102043: Sep 27th 2015 at 12:45:38 PM

Well, maybe if the establishment doesn't want lunatics running the asylum, driving the sane guys out, they should stop funding them!

JackOLantern1337 Shameful Display from The Most Miserable Province in the Russian Empir Since: Aug, 2014 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
Shameful Display
#102044: Sep 27th 2015 at 2:32:33 PM

[up] Do the Kochs count as part of the GOP "establishment"?

@ Jovian: No not all cops are rabid power-mad psychopaths. They are all racist sexist greedy and corrupt power-mad psychopathstongue But seriously, it goes against the current narrative so of course it isn't being reported. Plus one could argue it's expecting praise for just doing their jobs.

edited 27th Sep '15 2:37:25 PM by JackOLantern1337

I Bring Doom,and a bit of gloom, but mostly gloom.
Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#102045: Sep 27th 2015 at 3:03:54 PM

[up] I mostly agree. Police don't earn public accolades for doing their jobs correctly. Maybe they should, but that's another issue entirely.

Also, the Kochs are not part of the establishment Republican party. They are, instead, largely responsible for bringing it to its current state, by funding the Tea Party as an astroturf insurgency against the establishment.

edited 27th Sep '15 3:04:39 PM by Fighteer

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
Protagonist506 from Oregon Since: Dec, 2013 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
#102046: Sep 27th 2015 at 3:25:45 PM

The people calling for police reform would probably be more persuasive if they structured their argument less like: "The Police are eeeeevull" and more like: "There's a too-large minority of police officers who have mild racist leanings which cause unacceptable amounts of catastrophes". Mind you, the latter is probably what most of them actually mean.

Personally, I'm a relatively happy with the current state of policing and think that over-enforcing that they be 'PC' could lead to consequences as well (for example, choosing to not arrest a minority in order to avoid appearing bigoted). Mind you, I'm unlikely to be a target of police bigotry myself (which gives me a bias), but my perspective is nonetheless valid.

Leviticus 19:34
JackOLantern1337 Shameful Display from The Most Miserable Province in the Russian Empir Since: Aug, 2014 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
Shameful Display
#102047: Sep 27th 2015 at 3:35:43 PM

[up] It has happened. Apparently in Britain a large number of rape's were committed by Pakistani men and the cops covered it up so as not to appear racist.

Edit: I also find the idea of community's policing themselves to be unhelpful. For one thing some communities would probably use it as an excuse to let off offenders who are popular, like beloved coaches who turn out to be child molestors (looking at you Penn State.) Or enforce their own morality on their members (looking at you FLDS.)

edited 27th Sep '15 3:38:00 PM by JackOLantern1337

I Bring Doom,and a bit of gloom, but mostly gloom.
Silasw A procrastination in of itself from A handcart to hell (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
A procrastination in of itself
#102048: Sep 27th 2015 at 3:41:01 PM

Mind you, the latter is probably what most of them actually mean.

It's also what they're actually saying. I'm not aware of anyone outside of internet comment sections saying "The Police are eeeeevull", beyond that one incident of a bunch of assholes filming a police officer getting attacked and refusing to help.

Also such police are far from a minority in most places, they're the controlling majority in New York, the controlling majority in Ferguson, the leadership in many other counties and likely the controlling majority in other places.

Personally, I'm a relatively happy with the current state of policing

So you're okay with Stop and Frisk? WWB (walking while black) being a real thing people get in trouble for, black kids being shot when they're no risk to anyone? Police being able to kill unarmed black men and facing no criminal charges? Because that's the current state of policing in the US.

over-enforcing that they be 'PC' could lead to consequences as well (for example, choosing to not arrest a minority in order to avoid appearing bigoted).

Maybe it's just me, but even as a white guy I'd much rather minority criminals be allowed to go free rather than non-dangerous minorities be gunned down because of the colour of their skin.

It has happened. Apparently in Britain a large number of rape's were committed by Pakistani men and the cops covered it up so as not to appear racist.

Actually it's the council who refused to investigate, and the whole "we didn't want to look racist" thing is looking very much like a defence they decided upon, with the actual reason being bog standard corruption and incompetence.

edited 27th Sep '15 3:42:50 PM by Silasw

“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran
JackOLantern1337 Shameful Display from The Most Miserable Province in the Russian Empir Since: Aug, 2014 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
Shameful Display
#102049: Sep 27th 2015 at 4:24:24 PM

[up] Ah, thank you for clarifying, I wasn't fully up to date on the situation.

I Bring Doom,and a bit of gloom, but mostly gloom.
Artificius from about a foot and a half away from a monitor. Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Norwegian Wood
#102050: Sep 27th 2015 at 4:32:02 PM

The Koch's are very much establishment, but they don't seem to know how to apply their power and money correctly (something like 90% of Super PAC funds in 2012 went to candidates who lost). They simply miscalculated the enormity of the reactionary well they were tapping into by building the Tea Party. At least we know they're fallible.

edited 27th Sep '15 4:38:52 PM by Artificius

"I have no fear, for fear is the little death that kills me over and over. Without fear, I die but once."

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