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Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM
The Iranians still get something like two weeks notice before inspections, and the weapons embargo on them will be lifted after ten years, and most of the limits on their nuclear program will expire after a short time, leaving them free to go for the bomb if they so chose. Mind you some kind of deal had to be reached,nothing short of an all out ground invasion could have stopped the program. But we could have gotten a better deal just by Obama not making it clear how badly he wanted this thing in public. The Iranians needed this. If Obama had not made it seem like his administration needed it more we could have wrung concessions out of them. Of course saying this makes me some kind of evil neoconservative warmonger.
I Bring Doom,and a bit of gloom, but mostly gloom.Not sure how foreign policy is better under republicans. Media outside the U.S cringes, specially latin ones, when any republican is elected.
I assume other nations are just as familiarized with the U.S political system as latinos are.
Not necesarily a warmonger but this just leaves me wondering why Iran owes the U.S anything when elaborating a nuclear energy program.
edited 2nd Sep '15 4:02:48 PM by Aszur
It has always been the prerogative of children and half-wits to point out that the emperor has no clothes
Because all other nations are filled with enlightened champions of knowledge who know how we should do everything, and if only those stupid fat ugly racist Americans weren't allowed to run America the world would be so much better. Seriously though, I agree that the Republicans historically have not been much better than the Democrats, and recently have been a hell of a lot worse, on foreign policy. But just because foreigners don't like or foreign policy doesn't necessarily mean it's a bad one, the fact that it's just plain idiotic means it's bad policy.
I don't think the Iranian leaders are stupid. If they ever try to launch nukes at Israel, Israel would flatten them in retaliation. Hell, Israel has that horrifying Samson Option thing where they'll launch at everyone else in the region if someone goes after them in a way they can't defend against.
But the thing is that Iran isn't exactly liked by Saudi Arabia or Syria, and especially not by Israel or America, so their leaders have a rather justified fear of what might happen if they have nothing to deter attacks in the future.
edited 2nd Sep '15 4:03:48 PM by Zendervai
I think Iran doesn't want a bomb, or that they realize they can't afford one. They wanted the sanctions done.
What they want, probably, is breakout capacity: to have a pile of fuel ready to dump in a year if need be, but they're not North Korea. Their people won't tolerate their country becoming a pariah.
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Call me simplistic, because I am simplifying foreign relationships a lot, but if the result of foreign policies end up with half of the world doubting/hating ya, I am not sure how that is by any measure, a "good" foreign policy.
edited 2nd Sep '15 4:05:31 PM by Aszur
It has always been the prerogative of children and half-wits to point out that the emperor has no clothes![]()
Depends what the results are. Russia for instance, saw their international reputation plummet after the seizure of Crimea, and yet they view the goal as worth it, and have achieved most of their objectives, and are now on their way to normalizing the situation. The US by contrast was hated, but failed to get any gain for that hatred, only getting thousands of dead, spreading Iranian influence, and a massive war debt. Foreign policy isn't a popularity contest, it's all about costs and benefits.
Well how a country is viewed is important. It's just good PR isn't the end all be all people make it out to be, though bad PR is far more damaging for liberal democracies.
edited 2nd Sep '15 4:12:59 PM by JackOLantern1337
I Bring Doom,and a bit of gloom, but mostly gloom.Last I heard, Russia was mired in a recession with Putin trying and failing all the usual "ruthless supply-side/neo-con measures" to the problem.
edited 2nd Sep '15 4:24:44 PM by Fighteer
"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"The entirely gratuitous nature of that hardship notwithstanding...
"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"I don't know, but some of the Russians in the Russia thread were claiming that things aren't as dire as the West makes them out to be, and a large part of it is alarmist propaganda. Still, the fact remains that Putin's poll numbers are through the roof, Crimea is Russia's, and Ukraine just recently granted autonomy to the Separatists. In short, foreign policy is not a popularity contest, though one should never downplay the value of good PR.
I Bring Doom,and a bit of gloom, but mostly gloom.So the reason why some Republicans have been publicly admiring Putin over Obama is that they believe wholeheartedly that international affairs is about being the biggest bully in the playground? Nice to know.
"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
Isn't that how its always been?
Look at the the Great Powers before WW 1, or more recently the Cold War.
Look upon my privilege ye mighty and despair.Not with the US they didn't. The U.S. always had to make a deal, regardless of Obama's domestic wants, because in the end the Iranians didn't need a deal with the US, just one with Russia that would break the UN sanctions. If the US had tried to play any harder then the Russians would have just made a deal without the US and the U.S. would have gotten nothing and been left imposing worthless sanctions against a regime that could easily resist them, as the UN sanctions would disappear without Russian and Chinese support.
@Skycobra, it's not just anyone you guys managed to piss of, one of your best allies now has a public hatred for your foreign policy, you dragged us into a war for profit that resulted in the death of a fair number of our soilder, all because Dick Chaney wanted to blow shit up and get money for his friends. You guys might be able to survive pissing off a lot of the world, but if you keep turning your allies against you by lying to them and getting their soilders killed you'll quickly find yourselves without friends.
Not about being the biggest bully, the bullies fell, look at Imperial Germany and Nazi Germany's for what happens when you just tell everyone that they can go fuck themselves and that you're the biggest kid on the block. The big power survived precisely because even when they pissed of their enemies they ensured that they still had strong friends willing to back them up, the Republicans aren't just angering the US's enemies, their driving away its friends.
edited 2nd Sep '15 4:51:25 PM by Silasw
“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ CyranYeah in the end Iran is worried about the U.S. one day deciding to randomly install an oppressive dictatorship at the request of BP, something the U.S. (alongside the UK) did do once before.
That or the Israeli government deciding to nuke Terran for shits and giggles.
edited 2nd Sep '15 4:54:20 PM by Silasw
“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran

I'll believe it when I see it. Until then...
Actually in my opinion Dems excel at domestic policy(shocking I know.), foreign policy, well, it leaves something to be desired.
Republicans are the flipside, strong in Foreign, abysmal in Domestic.
Its a trade off.
edited 2nd Sep '15 3:54:56 PM by Skycobra51
Look upon my privilege ye mighty and despair.