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Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM

BAFFU Since: Dec, 2012
#98526: Aug 12th 2015 at 3:30:34 PM

Here. I translated the whole editorial so you guys can see how the discourse is over here.

Its titled "Trump & Co"

What Donald Trump says now has always been the same thing that all the American Presidents have thought about, and sometimes also said out loud. The multimillionaire Donald Tramp, candidate for the Republican Party to the presidency of the United States insults Mexican immigrants: “Mexico sends us drugs, crime and rapists” he says. And he announces that when he is president he will build in the border a wall so that those undesirables can no longer keep on coming, whom he is also going to force to build said wall. As a response, from our side our cartoonists laugh at trump, the editorialists become outraged, the singers complain, the diplomatic envoys are shocked, and the beauty queens threaten retaliation. All Latin Americans feel collectively identified, humiliated and offended. As if Trump was an intolerable novelty. • Intolerable he may be. But this has always been tolerated, and has never been novel. What Donald Trump says now is the same thing all American presidents have thought about, and sometimes also said out loud. And saying it, or keeping it shut, all have behaved according to the same mentality. It was James Monroe who defined Latin America as the “backyard” of the United States. But ever since Washington in the XVIII century to Obama today, all presidents have treated it as if it were. Washington supported in Haiti, with guns and money the French plantation owners against the revolution of black slaves, fearing that freedom would spread. Lincoln wanted to, but wasn’t able to, get rid of the emancipated slaves by sending them to colonize Central America. Obama continues to use his base in Guantanamo Cuba as his illegal deposit of political prisoners. ¿Why don’t they do the same in other continents where they also dispose of military bases? ¿In Japan, for example, or in the UK? As for the wall that Mr. Trump talks about, it has already been built mostly by President Bush (junior).

In their secular hatred of their southern neighbors the presidents are not alone: they are accompanied by their whole nation. Because the United States is an immigrant country, yes: but of rapidly assimilated immigrants (which as everything is both good and bad at the same time). Assimilated to the point of considering themselves, trough the American Dream, true WASPS (white Anglo-Saxon Protestants) from the second generation onwards, having arrived as Irish, polish, Italians or Russians, but always being white in every sense: not black or red. As a demonstrations we can look at two of the other candidates that are competing with Trump for the Republican Nominations: The Cuban-Americans Ted Cruz and Marco Rubio, who’s announced policy on immigrations consists, as they usually do, in denying others the ladder they themselves used to obtain the “American Dream”. Xenophobia is the first national sentiment that assimilates new immigrants.

Nevertheless, leaving aside the emotional side and focusing on the reality of the situation, what Donald Trump says is only half true: the Latin drug traffickers that are in the United States are the ones they themselves have claimed in extradition and, after giving over their vast fortunes to the American Treasury, have remained there to live. The opposite is more notorious; it’s the “good” northern neighbors who have historically sent pirates and bandits to their bad “southern” neighbors. And not only drug traffickers, but the drug trafficking business itself, created by their drug dependency and their drug prohibition, without which this wouldn’t be a business.

But saying it like it is would be unpopular, even if it were true. So the echo chamber choses to focus on the xenophobic insults of Mr Trump, even if it awakens the ire of Puerto Rican singer Ricky Martin or Mexican industrialist Carlos Slim. So it is possible that the next president of the United States will be Donald Trump and that he will make us pay for his sanitary contention wall. It wouldn’t be anything out of the ordinary.

edited 12th Aug '15 3:31:23 PM by BAFFU

SciFiSlasher from Absolutely none of your business. Since: Dec, 2011 Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
#98527: Aug 12th 2015 at 5:22:07 PM

Dumbass Trump seriously thinks Mexico will move an inch to pay for his little wall. He seriously thinks all Mexican immigrants just cross the border. Does he not know about coyotes? Or boats to bypass the border altogether? Or people with Visas-real or fake-that overstay them?

Not to mention that a wall will be even worse. Immigrants who want to go back south would have no way to do so (mind you, a big reason for going back is because prescription medicines can just be bought off the shelf in Mexico).

"Somehow the hated have to walk a tightrope, while those who hate do not."
tclittle Professional Forum Ninja from Somewhere Down in Texas Since: Apr, 2010
Deadbeatloser22 from Disappeared by Space Magic (Great Old One) Relationship Status: Tsundere'ing
#98529: Aug 12th 2015 at 6:06:45 PM

[up][up]It's a case of "being seen to be doing something".

It doesn't matter whether the idea is practical or not, so long as it looks like he's tough on DEM EVUL FORENURS.

"Yup. That tasted purple."
tclittle Professional Forum Ninja from Somewhere Down in Texas Since: Apr, 2010
Professional Forum Ninja
#98530: Aug 12th 2015 at 7:21:34 PM

Jimmy Carter has cancer.

"We're all paper, we're all scissors, we're all fightin' with our mirrors, scared we'll never find somebody to love."
LeGarcon Blowout soon fellow Stalker from Skadovsk Since: Aug, 2013 Relationship Status: Gay for Big Boss
Blowout soon fellow Stalker
#98531: Aug 12th 2015 at 7:22:12 PM

sad

Oh really when?
Rationalinsanity from Halifax, Canada Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
#98532: Aug 12th 2015 at 9:10:47 PM

Damn. Hell, I recently talked with a friend about how long Carter and Bush Sr. would be around to...

Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.
LeGarcon Blowout soon fellow Stalker from Skadovsk Since: Aug, 2013 Relationship Status: Gay for Big Boss
Blowout soon fellow Stalker
#98533: Aug 12th 2015 at 9:36:47 PM

5 Things I learned infiltrating The Oath Keepers

Bit odd to link to a Cracked article here I know but I thought this was relevant to recent events.

Oh really when?
TheWanderer Student of Story from Somewhere in New England (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: Wishfully thinking
Student of Story
#98534: Aug 12th 2015 at 10:41:42 PM

This is going back a bit in the discussion, but I've been really busy all day and unable to respond despite really wanting to.

@ ~Sci Fi Slasher

...I think we also need to stop being so suspicious of cops.

I know where you're coming from, I really do, because I used to be on the side fo giving cops the benefit of the doubt and such.

But the fact is, law enforcement in our country is deeply fucked. Like, incredibly so. And in no way does a lack of trust for the police cause most of the problems.

For example, lack of trust for police didn't cause police to carry out a no knock warrant (warrant where police storm into a house without identifying themselves or trying to get the suspects to surrender or cooperate) on the wrong house, throw a flash bang grenade into a baby's crib and then refuse to pay the medical bills or even apologize for the mistake.

Lack of faith in the police wasn't what resulted in the killing of a 92 year old black woman during another no knock warrant that was based on bad information.

Lack of trust for the police didn't cause an officer who had failed police exams with 4 different departments to shoot a 12 year old boy playing in a park with a pellet gun, without any warning, not give him any medical attention as he lies bleeding to death on the ground, and throw his 14 year old sister down on the ground when she tries to go to his side.

Lack of trust for the police isn't the problem with them publicly stripping women and searching their privates for marijuana.

Lack of trust in the police wasn't what caused a man to be shot in Walmart without warning for the crime of picking up a bb gun openly on display in the store. It also didn't cause the police to threaten his girlfriend during the course of a 90 minute interrogation or result in officers having any charges or disciplinary actions taken against them.

It's not because of lack of trust in the police that evidence has to be reviewed to see if it was tainted when text messages like the following were found on police phones:

"We got two blacks at my boys [sic] school and they are brother and sister! There cause dad works for the school district and I am watching them like hawks."

In response to a text asking "Do you celebrate quanza [sic] at your school?" Furminger wrote: "Yeah we burn the cross on the field! Then we celebrate Whitemas."

"Its [sic] worth every penny to live here [Walnut Creek] away from the savages."

"Cross burning lowers blood pressure! I did the test myself!"

In response to a text saying "All niggers must fucking hang," Furminger wrote "Ask my 6 year old what he thinks about Obama."

"I hate to tell you this but my wife friend [sic] is over with their kids and her husband is black! If [sic] is an Attorney but should I be worried?" Furminger's friend, an SFPD officer, responded: "Get ur pocket gun. Keep it available in case the monkey returns to his roots. Its [sic] not against the law to put an animal down." Furminger responded, "Well said!"

In response to a text from another SFPD officer regarding the promotion of a black officer to sergeant, Furminger wrote: "Fuckin nigger."

When a cop chokes a man to death for selling untaxed cigarettes and isn't even put on trial, despite the fact that chokeholds are explicitly against department policy, the problem probably isn't that there isn't enough trust in the police.

When a police officer spends a year and a half secretly doing audio recordings of the corruption in his precinct, including things like police quotas for ticketing people, discouraging people from filing charges on serious crimes done to them (in order to avoid making the statistics of the precinct look bad) and orders to lock up any groups of more than 2 black men hanging out together and "we'll make up the charges later" and the reaction from his bosses is to have him involuntarily committed to a psych ward, the problem is probably not the lack of trust in the police.

When the NYPD stop and frisk policy, which is supposed to be used when officers have reason to suspect that a person is carrying a weapon or illegal contraband on them, is used on innocent people about 90% of the time, and the NYPD did more stop and frisks on black males than the number of black males living in the city (police documented stopping 168,000 black males for suspicious activity, only about 154,000 live in the city, so police stopped at least every single black man who lives in the city, frisked them, then started working through the population again in a single year) the problem probably isn't that police aren't trusted enough. (For more fun stop and frisk facts, see here)

When a law like Open Carry is apparently treated entirely differently depending on whether you're black or white, I don't think the main problem is that we don't trust the police enough.

When a black lawyer is almost killed by police in his own driveway and they never give him a chance to pull out his ID to show that he's just sitting in front of his home, and the same lawyer finds cases where police have forced witnesses to testify as part of framing people, I don't think the problem is that we don't trust the police enough.

When police can take your money and possessions without you committing a crime and in at least some cases, they and other figures involved with the law turn around and use those things for their own benefit, the problem isn't that we don't trust the police enough.

Now despite all of this, I'm not one of those maniacs who says that all police are corrupt or the authorities are coming to put us all into camps or anything. But on the list of issues we have with the law in this country, not trusting the police enough is way down on the list of priorities. I think if anything we've spent 30+ years or so giving the police too much leeway and a tendency to automatically take their side most times where there was an encounter between police and a civilian. We need to discourage the idea that police are in a war with everyone not them, that every black and brown person especially is a threat, and we need to address the systematic biases that have us currently incarcerating about 7 times as many black people and 3 times as many Hispanics as we do whites, the pervasive tendency to as children and adults give black people harsher penalties for breaking the law than whites, etc.

Then we can decide about whether we aren't putting enough faith and trust in the police.

| Wandering, but not lost. | If people bring so much courage to this world...◊ |
Greenmantle V from Greater Wessex, Britannia Since: Feb, 2010 Relationship Status: Hiding
V
#98535: Aug 12th 2015 at 11:31:03 PM

[up] What are your views on the Federal Agencies? Are they similar?

Keep Rolling On
LeGarcon Blowout soon fellow Stalker from Skadovsk Since: Aug, 2013 Relationship Status: Gay for Big Boss
Blowout soon fellow Stalker
#98536: Aug 12th 2015 at 11:31:50 PM

Personally I trust the FBI far more than any local entity.

Oh really when?
BlueNinja0 The Mod with the Migraine from Taking a left at Albuquerque Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
The Mod with the Migraine
#98537: Aug 13th 2015 at 2:08:35 AM

Ailes and Trump go to war, declare cease fire, but we can all hope it flares back up again.

Fox News chairman Roger Ailes woke up Monday morning thinking that his network and Donald Trump's campaign had reached an understanding. After a weekend's worth of stressful phone calls, the tacit agreement — he thought — was that Trump would stop attacking Ailes' biggest television star, Megyn Kelly, in interviews and tweets.

Then came an ugly surprise. Trump said on MSNBC's "Morning Joe" that he thought Kelly should apologize to him. "This was the final straw for Roger," according to a source close to the situation. Ailes' office called Trump's office. We "can resolve this now," Ailes said to Trump, "or we can go to war."

As we all know by now, war was averted. There is mutual respect between the two master negotiators. Trump has stopped criticizing Kelly. And Fox has stopped ignoring Trump on its shows. But if this is a truce, it's a tenuous one. In recent days Trump loyalists have leaked unflattering claims about Ailes, and Fox staffers have privately likened Trump to a crazy person. With detente in place, each side is now being more careful with their words. Trump is, to put it kindly, as one high-placed Fox source purposefully did, "a nontraditional candidate."

The candidate is also being kind to Fox; when Trump called into Lou Dobbs' Fox Business show on Wednesday, he said "I love your show and watch it all the time." Given the billionaire's popularity, "Ailes had to make peace," said Roger Stone, a Trump senior adviser who recently left the campaign in disputed circumstances. But no one knows how long the peace will last.

While Trump has been placated, tensions with Fox linger right beneath the surface. Some network executives are said to detest Trump's bombastic behavior. And it hasn't helped that many commentators have portrayed Ailes as buckling or bowing to Trump. (Sample quote via The Washington Post: "Give credit where it's due ? Trump bargained with Fox News, Trump won, and it wasn't close.")

Trump still seems to have a sore spot about coverage of his campaign; he tweeted some gripes to Fox host Eric Bolling on Monday night, for example. And on Wednesday, Trump committed to an exclusive Sunday morning interview with NBC's Chuck Todd this weekend. This could be interpreted as a snub of Fox's Chris Wallace since Fox had been in talks with Trump's campaign about an in-person interview with Wallace for "Fox News Sunday."

Trump won't soon forget the feeling of being beaten up on Fox's debate stage. It remains to be seen if he will show up to Fox's November and January debates. And Ailes won't soon forget that Trump triggered days of references to Kelly's "blood."

I find myself in the very odd and uncomfortable position of supporting Fox News.

That’s the epitome of privilege right there, not considering armed nazis a threat to your life. - Silasw
PotatoesRock Since: Oct, 2012
#98538: Aug 13th 2015 at 3:24:03 AM

In Nevada, Jeb Bush rally interrupted by Black Lives Matter demonstrators

A Jeb Bush town hall meeting Wednesday ended on a testy note, as Black Lives Matter protesters clashed with the presidential candidate’s supporters after he faced a series of challenging questions.

Bush, responding to a woman’s query about the disproportionate number of minorities killed by police and their treatment in the criminal justice system, said there was no question that racism still existed in the United States and that leaders needed to engage in communities that felt disenfranchised. He then turned to his education record as Florida’s governor, saying that achievement scores among minority youths rose during his tenure.

“I have a record of empowering people in communities that” were told “they had no chance,” Bush said, ending the town hall. He did not deliver a closing statement, as he typically does, and quickly made his way to an exit, greeting supporters along the way.

Behind him, a few dozen protesters raised their fists and began chanting, “Black Lives Matter!” A few Bush supporters turned toward them and chanted, “All Lives Matter!” and “White Lives Matter!” Two women — a protester and a Bush supporter — stood a few feet from the candidate with their middle fingers extended in each other’s faces…

AngelusNox Warder of the damned from The guard of the gates of oblivion Since: Dec, 2014 Relationship Status: Married to the job
Warder of the damned
#98539: Aug 13th 2015 at 3:35:07 AM

So Jeb is actually able to provide an answer to the questions, admit a problem and use his governor history to "show" that he has done something about the subject during his mandate.

Meanwhile his following couldn't do nothing but act like a bunch of douchebags.

Inter arma enim silent leges
JackOLantern1337 Shameful Display from The Most Miserable Province in the Russian Empir Since: Aug, 2014 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
Shameful Display
#98540: Aug 13th 2015 at 5:03:00 AM

A Q&A with Jimmy Carter I know such a thing would have been unthinkable to say when he left office, and my mother will probably strangle me to death for saying this, but the country will sorely miss Jimmy Carter when he is gone.sad

[up] Well Bernie Sanders's supporters didn't react all that positively to their candidate being interrupted, though I don't believe they shouted "white lives matter." I would hardly expect any crowd to react positively in such circumstances, especially int he case of the Sanders crowd where they were all called racists.

edited 13th Aug '15 5:04:39 AM by JackOLantern1337

I Bring Doom,and a bit of gloom, but mostly gloom.
tclittle Professional Forum Ninja from Somewhere Down in Texas Since: Apr, 2010
Morgikit Mikon :3 from War Drobe, Spare Oom Since: Jul, 2012 Relationship Status: What's love got to do with it?
Mikon :3
#98542: Aug 13th 2015 at 7:46:34 AM

[up]I'm reminded of Bush standing under a banner reading "Mission Accomplished". Couldn't all the celebrating have waited until the battle was actually over?

Aszur A nice butterfly from Pagliacci's Since: Apr, 2014 Relationship Status: Don't hug me; I'm scared
A nice butterfly
#98543: Aug 13th 2015 at 9:09:26 AM

Happy Birthday Fidel Castro!

He just asks for several millions as a present. After all, the U.S owes it to Cuba

(Only English one I found. The Spanish one is much longer)

edited 13th Aug '15 9:09:46 AM by Aszur

It has always been the prerogative of children and half-wits to point out that the emperor has no clothes
Ogodei Fuck you, Fascist sympathizers from The front lines Since: Jan, 2011
Fuck you, Fascist sympathizers
#98544: Aug 13th 2015 at 9:24:56 AM

Isn't that county clerk one of few holdouts across the country? Otherwise we'd be hearing about a mass of them, not just this one in Kentucky.

If it's this much trouble for her, just resign.

Morgikit Mikon :3 from War Drobe, Spare Oom Since: Jul, 2012 Relationship Status: What's love got to do with it?
Mikon :3
#98545: Aug 13th 2015 at 10:44:54 AM

To some they may be isolated incidents. I think they're a sign of a bigger problem: employees of the government engaging in blatant discrimination. This goes beyond bakeries and photographers screwing themselves over by refusing business. Government employees serve the American people as a whole, and we're arguing over whether they have the right to play favorites? When we should be saying "do the job you were hired to do, or we'll find someone who will".

edited 13th Aug '15 10:45:56 AM by Morgikit

JackOLantern1337 Shameful Display from The Most Miserable Province in the Russian Empir Since: Aug, 2014 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
Shameful Display
#98546: Aug 13th 2015 at 11:02:36 AM

[up] Believe me, this is nothing new, a while ago some judge in the South tried to deny an interracial couple their marriage license, and then tried to explain to everyone how he wasn't racist. Also I'm pretty sure that school with the segregated prom was a public school.

I Bring Doom,and a bit of gloom, but mostly gloom.
Ramidel Since: Jan, 2001
#98547: Aug 13th 2015 at 11:23:33 AM

[up][up]Who's "we," though? The voters of Kentucky?

Rationalinsanity from Halifax, Canada Since: Aug, 2010 Relationship Status: It's complicated
#98548: Aug 13th 2015 at 11:27:05 AM

Eventually these appeals will reach the higher courts, who are basically going to say "Follow the law and get back to work".

Politics is the skilled use of blunt objects.
Protagonist506 from Oregon Since: Dec, 2013 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
#98549: Aug 13th 2015 at 11:27:53 AM

The Bush "mission accomplished" thing wasn't something he put there. It was the crew of the ship celebrating something tangentially related.

Leviticus 19:34
Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#98550: Aug 13th 2015 at 11:30:29 AM

[up] Either way, he staged it so that it looked like he was celebrating victory in the Iraq war. I'm not sure whether it would make him look worse to have initiated the event or co-opted an existing event for his own purposes.

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"

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