Nov 2023 Mod notice:
There may be other, more specific, threads about some aspects of US politics, but this one tends to act as a hub for all sorts of related news and information, so it's usually one of the busiest OTC threads.
If you're new to OTC, it's worth reading the Introduction to On-Topic Conversations
and the On-Topic Conversations debate guidelines
before posting here.
Rumor-based, fear-mongering and/or inflammatory statements that damage the quality of the thread will be thumped. Off-topic posts will also be thumped. Repeat offenders may be suspended.
If time spent moderating this thread remains a distraction from moderation of the wiki itself, the thread will need to be locked. We want to avoid that, so please follow the forum rules
when posting here.
In line with the general forum rules, 'gravedancing' is prohibited here. If you're celebrating someone's death or hoping that they die, your post will get thumped. This rule applies regardless of what the person you're discussing has said or done.
Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM
![]()
![]()
Those are loaded questions if I ever saw one.
Somehow I completely glossed over those questions. The first two are what the fuck, I agree with them on the third but they probably want to ax them entirely instead of reforming the system, and I'm confused by the next two. They agree that the Republicans won't win if Trump runs third party but half say they'll vote for him anyway? What?
So, I got this list of Obama's "accomplisments" from my mom on Facebook today. I was trying to convince her Obama had some good accomplishments, but she wasn't having any of it. Luckily, I don't have family who will hate me because I don't believe the same they do, but it gets annoying sometimes. She also sent it while I was at work (not intentionally) so I can't do any research right now. Can anyone help me here?
1. First President to be photographed smoking a joint.
2. First President to apply for college aid as a foreign student, then deny he was a foreigner.
3. First President to have a social security number from a state he has never lived in.
4. First President to preside over a cut to the credit-rating of the United States.
5. First President to violate the War Powers Act.
6. First President to be held in contempt of court for illegally obstructing oil drilling in the Gulf of Mexico.
7. First President to require all Americans to purchase a product from a third party.
8. First President to spend a trillion dollars on "shovel-ready" jobs when there was no such thing as "shovel-ready" jobs.
9. First President to abrogate bankruptcy law to turn over control of companies to his union supporters.
10. First President to by-pass Congress and implement the Dream Act through executive fiat.
11. First President to order a secret amnesty program that stopped the deportation of illegal immigrants across the U.S., including those with criminal convictions.
12. First President to demand a company hand-over $20 billion to one of his political appointees.
13. First President to tell a CEO of a major corporation (Chrysler) to resign.
14. First President to terminate America’s ability to put a man in space.
15. First President to cancel the National Day of Prayer and to say that America is no longer a Christian nation.
16. First President to have a law signed by an auto-pen without being present.
17. First President to arbitrarily declare an existing law unconstitutional and refuse to enforce it.
18. First President to threaten insurance companies if they publicly spoke out on the reasons for their rate increases.
19. First President to tell a major manufacturing company in which state it is allowed to locate a factory.
20. First President to file lawsuits against the states he swore an oath to protect (AZ, WI, OH, IN).
21. First President to withdraw an existing coal permit that had been properly issued years ago.
22. First President to actively try to bankrupt an American industry (coal).
23. First President to fire an inspector general of Ameri Corps for catching one of his friends in a corruption case.
24. First President to appoint 45 czars to replace elected officials in his office.
25. First President to surround himself with radical left wing anarchists.
26. First President to golf more than 150 separate times in his five years in office.
27. First President to hide his birth, medical, educational and travel records.
28. First President to win a Nobel Peace Prize for doing NOTHING to earn it.
29. First President to go on multiple "global apology tours" and concurrent "insult our friends" tours.
30. First President to go on over 17 lavish vacations, in addition to date nights and Wednesday evening White House parties for his friends paid for by the taxpayers.
31. First President to have personal servants (taxpayer funded) for his wife.
32. First President to keep a dog trainer on retainer for $102,000 a year at taxpayer expense.
33. First President to fly in a personal trainer from Chicago at least once a week at taxpayer expense.
34. First President to repeat the Quran and tell us the early morning call of the Azan (Islamic call to worship) is the most beautiful sound on earth.
35. First President to side with a foreign nation over one of the American 50 states (Mexico vs Arizona).
36. First President to tell the military men and women that they should pay for their own private insurance because they "volunteered to go to war and knew the consequences."
37. Then he was the First President to tell the members of the military that THEY were UNPATRIOTIC for balking at the last suggestion.
I feel much better now. I had been under the impression he hadn't been doing ANYTHING... Such an accomplished individual... in the eyes of the ignorant maybe.!.
Fixed the wall of text. Sorry.
edited 24th Jul '15 6:59:00 PM by tclittle
"We're all paper, we're all scissors, we're all fightin' with our mirrors, scared we'll never find somebody to love."I don't believe the first one. There's gotta be pictures of Bill smoking weed.
There just has to be.
And at the risk of sounding rude just don't bother. The people who draw up these lists live in their own fantasy world, facts will not deter them. Just ignore them and move on.
edited 24th Jul '15 6:58:14 PM by LeGarcon
Oh really when?Seems like a petty thing to get mad over though, considering it's not like anyone can put their own name into the peace prize voting pool. Was there ever an explanation given for that, by the way?
Anyway, most of that list is either clearly not sourced (and I would suggest asking sources for things that sound particularly outlandish) or are things he did that liberals consider to be good things and are just the usual extremist spin on things he actually did. In which case it's going to be hard to argue with them because they clearly think it's a bad thing.
For fuck's sake, the birther thing is on that list, so it's clearly biased from that alone.
edited 25th Jul '15 2:00:30 AM by AceofSpades
There's also a trivially false "America is a Christian Nation WAS a Christian Nation until that Commie-Nazi-Liebural-Athiest-Muslim declared war on Christians" bit. Trivially false, as the United States is not, and has never been a "Christian nation". Don't believe me? Take it up with the Founding Fathers who, in addition to not actually mentioning any specific religion in the Constitution, Declaration of Independence (though this does contain mention of a monotheistic god and creator, it does not specify which), or Articles of Confederation, signed the Treaty of Tripoli and specifically included article 11, the full text of which follows:
Also, the vacation and golf facts are false, as Dubya took far more vacation, including at least 65 trips to the family retreat totalling at least 407 days and spending more time over more trips (more than three times as many trips and over four times as many days) to Camp David even if that's technically exempted from "vacation". Woodrow Wilson played more than 1,200 rounds in his 8 years, which almost certainly beats Obama unless that was REALLY backloaded. Also, Eisenhower played more than 800 rounds while in office and JFK loved the game.
edited 25th Jul '15 2:22:55 AM by Balmung
Considering that Jefferson was about as openly deist as he could get away with I would say his concept of the Creator was different from that of people trying to use his statement as "proof" that the United States is a Christian nation. Not to mention that the Declaration was just that, a declaration of intent, not a government document.
edited 25th Jul '15 6:00:49 AM by tricksterson
Trump delenda estThe explanation I got regarding Trump from someone that supports him is that he speaks what's on his mind, and damned be the consequences. I had to agree with that, but pointed out that he's been making a lot of blanket statements.
"Why would I inflict myself on somebody else?"Naked, stream-of-consciousness honesty is a wee tad of a liability in politics. Just sayin'.
"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"Annoyed over an editorial, Trump bans an Iowa newpaper from his Iowa events
.
Of course, he's also still battling lawsuits over his
"university."
The suit also alleges that the University would "upsell" students in its initial free seminar to buy a $1,495 "one year apprenticeship" — which was effectively a three-day seminar. Then if they bought that, the teachers would upsell them again to buy "mentorships" at a cost of $10,000 and up. The most expensive, the Gold Elite program, cost $35,000. "Even then, after investing nearly $36,500, students still do not receive Defendant Trump's 'secrets' they were promised, but are constantly subjected to upsell of additional Live Events, products and books," the Cohen suit said.
Yeah, here's a few quotes you can throw out whenever someone makes the argument that the US is or ever was intended to be a "Christian nation".
- George Washington, letter to the United Baptist Chamber of Virginia (1789)
- Thomas Jefferson, letter to Peter Carr (1787)
- Samuel Adams, The Rights of the Colonists (1771)
- Thomas Paine, The Rights of Man (1791)
- Roger Sherman, Congress (1789)
- Benjamin Franklin, Poor Richard's Almanack (1758)
- Thomas Jefferson, letter to the Danbury Baptists (1802)
- Thomas Paine, The American Crisis No. V (1776)
(If you want to read Paine's whole pamphlet, where he expresses his atheistic beliefs, click here
)
- Thomas Jefferson, A Bill for Establishing Religious Freedom (1779)
- James Madison, letter to William Bradford, Jr. (1774)
- James Madison, General Assembly of the Commonwealth of Virginia (1785)
edited 25th Jul '15 6:35:09 AM by TheWanderer
| Wandering, but not lost. | If people bring so much courage to this world...◊ |

We don't favor anyone. At best I'll vote Graham as an FU to Trump, Walker, Cruz, and their ilk. Then vote Hillary Clinton in the national election.
Some interesting poll questions from Fox Nation, most of them generally had a little over 2000 participants. Gives you an idea of what's on their minds:
Do you think it outrageous that President Obama went to the U.N. first to endorse his nuclear deal with Iran before hearing from the United States Congress? (96% Yes)
Does this administration work for everyone except the American people? (96% Yes)
Donald Trump says the federal government should not be making a profit from college student loans. Do you agree? (92% Yes, 6% No, 2% Don't Know)
Can the Republicans win the presidency if Donald Trump runs as a third party candidate? (82% No)
Would you vote for Donald Trump if he ran as a third party candidate? (52% Yes, 36% No, 12% Maybe)
Should Donald Trump apologize for his remarks about Sen. John Mc Cain? (35% Yes, 65% No)
That last one, despite not being the oldest of all the poll questions, had like five times as many voters.
edited 24th Jul '15 2:51:41 PM by Parable