TVTropes Now available in the app store!
Open

Follow TV Tropes

Following

The General US Politics Thread

Go To

Nov 2023 Mod notice:


There may be other, more specific, threads about some aspects of US politics, but this one tends to act as a hub for all sorts of related news and information, so it's usually one of the busiest OTC threads.

If you're new to OTC, it's worth reading the Introduction to On-Topic Conversations and the On-Topic Conversations debate guidelines before posting here.

Rumor-based, fear-mongering and/or inflammatory statements that damage the quality of the thread will be thumped. Off-topic posts will also be thumped. Repeat offenders may be suspended.

If time spent moderating this thread remains a distraction from moderation of the wiki itself, the thread will need to be locked. We want to avoid that, so please follow the forum rules when posting here.


In line with the general forum rules, 'gravedancing' is prohibited here. If you're celebrating someone's death or hoping that they die, your post will get thumped. This rule applies regardless of what the person you're discussing has said or done.

Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM

TheStarshipMaxima NCC - 1701 Since: Jun, 2009
NCC - 1701
#58001: Jul 10th 2013 at 10:03:49 AM

[up] What is this "nuclear option"?

It was an honor
Ramidel Since: Jan, 2001
#58002: Jul 10th 2013 at 10:04:45 AM

@Fighteer: Which is my point. Ron Paul (despite being a states' rights neo-Confederate) was close enough to "genuine libertarian" to get an amount of grassroots support on both sides of the aisle. But, because he was unwilling to coalition-build, sell out and play politics, he could be marginalized rather than fought head-on. (And getting people to put on their trollfaces and register as Republicans just to bolster him requires a lot more effort out of the footsoldiers than he can count on.)

Though I disagree with your position on his economic liberalism, since I do think he'd have tried to end subsidies as well as regulations, which would not have the effect that you think it would. Namely, it'd completely prevent anything from getting done for the duration of his term, because each and every lobby in Washington would scream about its own ox being gored.

deviantbraeburn Wandering Jew from Dysfunctional California Since: Aug, 2012
Wandering Jew
#58003: Jul 10th 2013 at 10:14:00 AM

House panel approves bill curtailing EPA power on climate regs

Everything is Possible. But some things are more Probable than others. JEBAGEDDON 2016
Ramidel Since: Jan, 2001
#58004: Jul 10th 2013 at 10:25:34 AM

...so, again, the Republicans vote up a bill in full knowledge that it won't pass.

Who do we ask to dock Congress' pay? Oh, right, Congress.

Karkadinn Karkadinn from New Orleans, Louisiana Since: Jul, 2009
Karkadinn
#58005: Jul 10th 2013 at 10:27:10 AM

The nuclear option is an option for getting a vote to pass under a simple majority instead of two-thirds. Reid threatened to use it, then promised not to if the opposition followed certain conditions on non-obstructionism, which apparently they have not done to his satisfaction. (Shocker.)

Furthermore, I think Guantanamo must be destroyed.
deviantbraeburn Wandering Jew from Dysfunctional California Since: Aug, 2012
Wandering Jew
#58006: Jul 10th 2013 at 10:42:02 AM

Bush calls for immigration reform, but says he won't enter political debate on immigration

Everything is Possible. But some things are more Probable than others. JEBAGEDDON 2016
Ogodei Fuck you, Fascist sympathizers from The front lines Since: Jan, 2011
Fuck you, Fascist sympathizers
#58007: Jul 10th 2013 at 10:52:51 AM

Trouble is, doesn't the nuclear option severely weaken the filibuster? Then it makes the "51 US Senators" notion all the more important, then we have yet more destabilization.

midgetsnowman Since: Jan, 2010
#58008: Jul 10th 2013 at 11:00:05 AM

[up]

in all fairness, its already destabilized beyond repair given the current climate is so toxic to compromise on the right that any republican that dares suggest working with democrats will be primaried.

deviantbraeburn Wandering Jew from Dysfunctional California Since: Aug, 2012
Wandering Jew
#58009: Jul 10th 2013 at 11:05:18 AM

John Kerry chokes back tears in first comments on wife’s health scare

Everything is Possible. But some things are more Probable than others. JEBAGEDDON 2016
Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#58010: Jul 10th 2013 at 11:09:57 AM

@Ramidel: "because he was unwilling to coalition-build, sell out and play politics"

That's one of the things about politics: it's a team sport. Charismatic figures with controversial positions and a lack of high profile backers scare the heck out of people. As much as I decry the system that produces our Presidential candidates, I have to acknowledge that it has a certain value in weeding out potentially dangerous mavericks. As amusing as it would have been to see Cain, Bachmann, or even Perry curb-stomped at the polls in November, that they could be front-running candidates at all betrays the disaster that the GOP primary system has become.

Paul's "economic liberalism" is nothing of the sort. He's an old school proponent of classical economics who believes in the gold standard and unrestrained laissez-faire capitalism, which failed abjectly in the 1930s and is failing just as badly in the present day.

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
Karkadinn Karkadinn from New Orleans, Louisiana Since: Jul, 2009
Karkadinn
#58011: Jul 10th 2013 at 11:11:42 AM

Yes, it weakens the filibuster.

That's why I wish Reid had used it when he threatened to in the first goddamned place.

Furthermore, I think Guantanamo must be destroyed.
Ogodei Fuck you, Fascist sympathizers from The front lines Since: Jan, 2011
Fuck you, Fascist sympathizers
#58012: Jul 10th 2013 at 11:18:37 AM

The Classical rebuttal to "But the Great Depression!" seems to be the recession of 1920, where the initial drop was sharper than in 1929, but the government stood firm and prices bounced back quickly. The blame I've heard from hardcore libertarians (ironically) falls on Herbert Hoover, because his very attempts at intervening to help the economy (loudly blamed by liberals then and now for being too little too late) are being blamed by libertarians now as the thing that turned 1929 from another blip on the radar of prosperity into an endless grind (exacerbated by FDR's meddling)

Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#58013: Jul 10th 2013 at 11:20:09 AM

[up]We should move that discussion to the General Economics thread if you want to pursue it further.

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
deviantbraeburn Wandering Jew from Dysfunctional California Since: Aug, 2012
Wandering Jew
#58014: Jul 10th 2013 at 1:28:46 PM

Rapper Mos Def reenacts Gitmo-style force-feeding

Everything is Possible. But some things are more Probable than others. JEBAGEDDON 2016
Barkey Since: Feb, 2010 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
#58015: Jul 10th 2013 at 2:14:49 PM

Oh you big pussy, it's a naso-pharyngeal airway, we have to do something similar to someone when we do pre-deployment training, and have it done to us.

Yeah, it really is uncomfortable as fuck, but if the prisoners decide they can just hunger strike to get whatever they want, what's the point? Religious extremists who often thought they would go out in a blaze of glory rather than be captured often don't have much of a will to live in the first place, and would rather just die.

Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#58016: Jul 10th 2013 at 2:16:04 PM

You know, that's a rather large assumption to be making, Barkey: that all or even most of the Gitmo prisoners are religious fanatics, jihadists, terrorists, etc. In fact a significant portion of them likely are not, and given that we can't get trials for them, we may never find out.

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
Barkey Since: Feb, 2010 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
#58017: Jul 10th 2013 at 2:26:57 PM

Not all of them, no.

But I'm just not as horrified about the whole Gitmo thing as most of you. There's more accountability to having them in a known location such as Gitmo. If we close Gitmo, we'll never know what happens to these people, because we'll scoop them up and send them to black sites in foreign prisons where the CIA rents out space, such as Yemen and certain places in Eastern Europe.

Not that I'm all that sympathetic. If those bastards ever took me in, I'd pretty much just tell the whole truth straight from the start and sing like a canary. Most of these guys do their whole "You can't do shit to me because my faith in Allah is strong!" bit. Ideological extremism of any stripe can hold up to torture for some time, way more than personal resolve.

tclittle Professional Forum Ninja from Somewhere Down in Texas Since: Apr, 2010
Professional Forum Ninja
#58018: Jul 10th 2013 at 2:30:19 PM

Wal-Mart threatened to not open 3 planned stores in D.C. if bill to raise D.C.'d minimum wage passes. Bill passes anyway, but is still waiting on the mayor's approval.

"We're all paper, we're all scissors, we're all fightin' with our mirrors, scared we'll never find somebody to love."
midgetsnowman Since: Jan, 2010
#58019: Jul 10th 2013 at 2:31:15 PM

[up]

I say sign the bill.

Fuck Walmart.

Zendervai Since: Oct, 2009
#58020: Jul 10th 2013 at 2:34:42 PM

So, Walmart pulling out of DC would do what exactly? Cause Target market shares to go up? Last time I checked, D.C. isn't that big, so if anyone really wants to go to Walmart for whatever reason, they can just go into Virginia or something.

midgetsnowman Since: Jan, 2010
#58021: Jul 10th 2013 at 2:36:22 PM

all Walmart generally does is murder the shit out of wages and small businesses , while claiming theyre adding new jobs to the economy (except they dont)

TheStarshipMaxima NCC - 1701 Since: Jun, 2009
NCC - 1701
#58022: Jul 10th 2013 at 2:39:40 PM

Fuck Walmart.

Fuckin' A.

It was an honor
Zendervai Since: Oct, 2009
#58023: Jul 10th 2013 at 2:42:22 PM

I think they threatened that a few years ago when Ontario bumped up the minimum wage actually, as in threatening to pull out of Toronto. The problem was that at the time, they didn't actually have a location in the city of Toronto so their threat was meaningless. Even now, they only really have one location and it's a pain to get to for most people.

deathpigeon Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: One True Dodecahedron
#58024: Jul 10th 2013 at 2:57:49 PM

Yep. Never shoppin' at Wallmart. Ever.

deviantbraeburn Wandering Jew from Dysfunctional California Since: Aug, 2012

Total posts: 417,856
Top