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Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM
Try this
. The forum hates Slate links.
Also, fuck, I can't read cursive. The other day I had to write a few sentences in cursive, and it took me a good ten minutes. And I have a Bachelor's degree.
edited 29th Jun '13 11:04:09 PM by Mars444
<waves hand> Worked in a pharmacy once: I can back Joey up about the doctors' Arabic or Sanskrit (sometimes, it's hard to decide which). At least, they are random curves and lines that are vaguely connected. There's meaning there. And, that could be the names of prescription drugs and amounts... aka the meaning of life and death. ![]()
Even the block-capitals-only printers aren't much better than than your a-spider-walked-over-this cursive scribblers. <_<
edited 30th Jun '13 6:10:45 AM by Euodiachloris
I'm not sure whether to be amused or depressed by the fact that that Slate article insinuates that people are dismissive of Jeantel's testimony entirely because she's a poor black girl from the ghetto, while not even mentioning the fact that she's already lied under oath more than once
. She claimed to be a minor (she was 18 at the time) and said that she missed Trayvon Martin's wake because she was in the hospital (she wasn't; she didn't go because she didn't want to view Martin's body). The fact that people are attacking her over stuff like not being able to read cursive or her damn manicure is retarded, but she's done some really stupid things that make it easy for the defense to discredit her in the jury's eyes.
That's the thing, from a personal standpoint I believe that Zimmerman really was looking for a fight because he wanted to play hero, but that Trayvon was a little gangbanger piece of shit who probably didn't handle Zimmermans provocation well, but didn't deserve to die for that.
As for the witness, her lying under oath makes her very suspect as a credible witness from a legal standpoint. I haven't really thrown in with either side on this case.
I just got back from Florida, and all the locals pretty much felt the same about it. All the ones I talked to supported the stand your ground law, but said Zimmerman felt empowered by having a permit, a gun, and that law behind him which is what made him feel confident to run around as self-appointed neighborhood watch. On the other hand, they also all knew that Trayvon was not a little angel. Suspensions from school, pictures of him with unregistered handguns and marijuana, in my opinion he was a little shithead. Didn't deserve to die for that though.
So in this case they are both shitty people, but Zimmerman committed the far greater offense. If I were on the Jury I would have said he was guilty, in my opinion the evidence is pretty solidly pointing in that direction. We don't have proof who attacked first, but we don't really need that. The 911 operator told Zimmerman not to get involved, and he did so anyway and continued to follow Trayvon. I don't consider him protected by Stand Your Ground when he defied instructions from local law enforcement, and the fact that it resulted in a death is why he should be found guilty in my opinion.
From a legal perspective though? The Witness really screwed herself by lying. She's definitely in danger of being discredited as a witness.
edited 30th Jun '13 9:45:15 AM by Barkey
My take is largely the same, except that I think that Zimmerman's actions were covered by Stand Your Ground. Zimmerman claims that Martin was reaching for his (Zimmerman's) gun — I don't know if I believe that or if Martin was just beating Zimmerman's ass, but my understanding is that Florida's Stand Your Ground law covers him either way. Best case scenario, in my mind, is that Zimmerman is found not guilty under Stand Your Ground, and the resulting public uproar gets the law repealed, because it's a stupid fucking law. Incidents labelled "justifiable homicide" have tripled here in Florida since the law was passed. It's idiotic.
Really from Jupiter, but not an alien.I know in Ontario, the amount of force you are allowed to use against an assaulter is the amount of force they are using. For example, if someone is going after you with a baseball bat, you can use a two-by-four. The only time a gun is acceptable is if you are being attacked with a gun.
This makes sense to me.
If somebody is trying to kill me with a knife, and I KNOW he is trying to kill me, can I use a gun? Especially if this is somewhere in the middle of the country where the police are far away and/or I can't get to a phone, I should be able to defend myself anyway possible.
edited 30th Jun '13 10:22:09 AM by Ringsea
The most edgy person on the Internet.In Scotland, there is also a duty of easy retreat; you must retreat if it is safe to do so, though this does not (necessarily) apply on your own property, or if another is threatened (because the law recognizes that it is in the public interest for people to come to one another's aid). Generally, though, you are expected to meet like with like; so lethal force (or force sufficient to maim) can be met with lethal force.
Schild und Schwert der ParteiIf I'm being attacked by someone, I want to be allowed to be armed better than him within reason. If a dude came at me with a knife, I probably could fend him off with a broom or a big stick or something, but it would be really, really risky and I could end up dead if he anticipates my strike.
At the same time, "duty to retreat" is a joke. Police take forever to arrive on the scene (around here it's upwards of 15-20 minutes if you're in town), so if the criminal pursues you, you're dead. If he doesn't, you now have a violent criminal on the run who's going to act like a cornered animal and be even more aggressive and unpredictable because he knows you called the authorities. If I have a reasonable chance at putting him on the floor before it comes to that, I'm gonna do it.
edited 30th Jun '13 1:25:02 PM by Pykrete
@Barkey: Please tell me you are aware that Zimmerman's crime was killing an unarmed teenager walking home from a convenience store, not ignoring the orders of police. The second isn't a great thing, the first is murder.
Share it so that people can get into this conversation, 'cause we're not the only ones who think like this.Personally, I don't know how y'all feel about so-called social issues, but I find economic issues (such as poverty, lack of economic opportunity, socioeconomic injustice) and related "issues that could actually affect all of us in really big ways" (such as environmental degradation and political conflicts) more salient at the present time. I oppose anti-abortion nuts and I'm happy to help support gay rights, but I find myself caring more about climate and carbon policy, alternative energy technologies, issues of racism and prejudice/discrimination and genocide, voting rights, social justice (around the world), and appropriate balance of economic forces (i.e. stuff like labor issues, etc.). Then again one could say that the "flagship" specific social issues of abortion and gay marriage are kinda subsets of these broader topics...
Re Slate links: The forum doesn't hate Slate in particular; what it hates is long UR Ls. It will insert a dash and a space into them. Remove the dash and space to get the right URL.

Justin Peters on Rachel Jeantel's testimony - and the reactions to it - in the George Zimmerman trial
.
EDIT: Slate links are always fucked up: Here it is again, either click through or C 'n' P into the searchbar:
http://www.slate.com/blogs/crime/2013/06/28/rachel_jeantel_witness_in_george_zimmerman_trial_gets_the_trayvon_martin.html
edited 29th Jun '13 10:56:17 PM by Achaemenid
Schild und Schwert der Partei