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Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM

Pykrete NOT THE BEES from Viridian Forest Since: Sep, 2009
NOT THE BEES
#56626: Jun 18th 2013 at 11:11:03 AM

That, and a good part of the Revolution was rooted in farming communities getting fucked by legislation rammed through by more populous states. It was kind of a key concern, and frankly, still is even if they're causing their own problems too.

Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#56627: Jun 18th 2013 at 11:14:39 AM

The rural tail wagging the city dog. Yes, that is an issue, but not nearly as much as it used to be. The worst I hear about these days is those communities griping about getting "liberal moral values" and "social welfare" pushed on them when they are happy being poor and bigoted.

edited 18th Jun '13 11:14:57 AM by Fighteer

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
CaptainKatsura Decoy from    Poland    Since: Jul, 2011
Decoy
#56628: Jun 18th 2013 at 11:44:11 AM

Little off-topic: I contributed in some way to US Politics as I translated letter to US Ambassador in Poland for my Institute in which I'm intern currently cool

My President is Funny Valentine.
RavenWilder Since: Apr, 2009
#56629: Jun 18th 2013 at 11:49:21 AM

The electoral college was implemented at a time when a) the states had a lot more sense of individual identity, more like the modern day European Union than parts of an actual nation, and b) poor communication technology meant most people weren't likely to be well-informed about presidential candidates, so instead of voting for presidents directly, they voted for electors, knowledgable people they trusted to make the right decision in this matter.

Those reasons have since become obsolete. However, most of the time the Electoral vote and the popular vote coincide; only three Presidents have ever won the Electoral vote but lost the popular vote, and, before George W., it hadn't happened at all since the 19th century. As such, most people don't care all that much about the Electoral College, and it persists largely due to apathy.

GlennMagusHarvey Since: Jan, 2001
#56630: Jun 18th 2013 at 11:52:04 AM

There is a National Popular Vote thing going around, and the bill that's being circulated through state legislatures is that if enough states have signed on such that they have more than a majority of electoral votes in total, then they will all cast their electoral votes for the popular vote winner.

Pykrete NOT THE BEES from Viridian Forest Since: Sep, 2009
NOT THE BEES
#56631: Jun 18th 2013 at 11:52:24 AM

The rural tail wagging the city dog. Yes, that is an issue, but not nearly as much as it used to be. The worst I hear about these days is those communities griping about getting "liberal moral values" and "social welfare" pushed on them when they are happy being poor and bigoted.

I was talking more about actual farms getting fucked over by regulatory laws passed by people who have no goddamn idea how to run a farm and how little a profit margin small ones already turn.

For instance, the Food Safety Modernization Act — written and passed largely by city Democrats who've never set foot on anything more than a tourist trap dude ranch — is halfway workable for larger corporate farms that make money best quantified in "shit tons", but smaller ones that already turn almost no profit are hit with about $13,000 a year in compliance costs.

edited 18th Jun '13 12:03:14 PM by Pykrete

DrunkGirlfriend from Castle Geekhaven Since: Jan, 2011
#56632: Jun 18th 2013 at 12:07:18 PM

[up] You pretty much just described the awful disconnect between small and large business in general.

"I don't know how I do it. I'm like the Mr. Bean of sex." -Drunkscriblerian
GlennMagusHarvey Since: Jan, 2001
#56633: Jun 18th 2013 at 12:30:25 PM

I think there's a disconnect between rural and urban understanding and also a big distinction between small and big business operational needs.

edited 18th Jun '13 12:31:01 PM by GlennMagusHarvey

Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#56634: Jun 18th 2013 at 12:36:37 PM

@Pykrete: I suspect that we're going to find that the "mom & pop" farming model is obsolete in our society. I don't want to sound like I have no compassion for the lifestyle, but "agribusiness" can produce food far more efficiently, and that matters when you're trying to feed three hundred million (or seven billion) people.

This is not to say that I won't happily support the local farmer's markets and such when they are around. The food they provide tends to be of higher quality and freshness. That is a regulatory issue of sorts and one that we should address — but consider that one of the reasons why grocery store produce isn't as tasty as the local stuff is that it's picked "green" and shipped halfway around the world to supply our desire for, say, strawberries in January.

It's a game of tradeoffs.

edited 18th Jun '13 12:38:31 PM by Fighteer

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
GlennMagusHarvey Since: Jan, 2001
#56635: Jun 18th 2013 at 1:22:28 PM

I do really, really like the idea of urban and community gardens and local farming. Cuts down on transportation costs — financially, environmentally, and probably gustatorally as well. Also makes people more aware of where their food comes from, and gives them a personal stake in it. The only kink left to work out is how to deal with economies of scale and other existing advantages that the huge farms in the great plains already have.

edited 18th Jun '13 1:22:37 PM by GlennMagusHarvey

Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#56636: Jun 18th 2013 at 1:27:09 PM

Economy of scale is a big deal, though. You can't overlook it when you're talking about feeding seven billion people. Personally I think that traditional farming is utterly absurd; it's inefficient in so many ways. Aeroponics and other scientifically advanced methods are things that we should be seriously looking into rather than dabbling in.

edited 18th Jun '13 1:27:31 PM by Fighteer

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
DeviantBraeburn Wandering Jew from Dysfunctional California Since: Aug, 2012
Wandering Jew
#56637: Jun 18th 2013 at 1:46:32 PM

Why the states should have "equal voice" in electing the President is a bit of a mystery to me

What? California has 55 Electoral Votes, while Wyoming only has 3. How is that an equal voice?

Bachmann Takes Shots At Snowden During NSA Hearing: How Could A ‘Traitor’ Do This To The American People?

edited 18th Jun '13 1:46:51 PM by DeviantBraeburn

Everything is Possible. But some things are more Probable than others. JEBAGEDDON 2016
Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#56638: Jun 18th 2013 at 1:58:08 PM

Ignore the state issue and focus on the vote of each individual person. By the math, voters in Wyoming get 5.2 electoral votes per every million people, while California voters get 1.4 votes per million.

Our slaves in the original Constitution had it good by comparison note , counting as three fifths of a person each. California voters count as slightly more than one fourth of a person in this equation.

edited 18th Jun '13 2:08:12 PM by Fighteer

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
DeviantBraeburn Wandering Jew from Dysfunctional California Since: Aug, 2012
Wandering Jew
#56639: Jun 18th 2013 at 2:08:14 PM

Bill Ayers: Obama Presidency Gets ‘Failing Grade,’ He Should Be Tried For ‘War Crimes’

Everything is Possible. But some things are more Probable than others. JEBAGEDDON 2016
Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Greenmantle V from Greater Wessex, Britannia Since: Feb, 2010 Relationship Status: Hiding
V
#56641: Jun 18th 2013 at 2:15:54 PM

[up] Some believe that George W Bush and Tony Blair should be put on trial for War Crimes — and not just on the Left...

edited 18th Jun '13 2:16:08 PM by Greenmantle

Keep Rolling On
Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#56642: Jun 18th 2013 at 2:19:33 PM

Well, I actually agree with that. Who started two wars and initiated the torture of thousands? Wasn't Obama.

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
DeviantBraeburn Wandering Jew from Dysfunctional California Since: Aug, 2012
Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#56644: Jun 18th 2013 at 2:25:31 PM

70 hour week? Sheesh. Why are truckers immune to labor laws affecting the rest of us, especially when road fatigue is a known and very serious problem?

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
Greenmantle V from Greater Wessex, Britannia Since: Feb, 2010 Relationship Status: Hiding
V
#56645: Jun 18th 2013 at 2:31:22 PM

[up]

That's 70 hours over 8 days — and that includes Mandatory Rest. See Hours of Service for the Regulations.

Keep Rolling On
Zendervai Since: Oct, 2009
#56646: Jun 18th 2013 at 2:34:33 PM

The argument against it also points out that it means truckers can't drive when the traffic is lightest.

SeptimusHeap from Switzerland (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Mu
#56647: Jun 18th 2013 at 2:34:59 PM

About the transcripts: So in other words, there was no political targeting? Just some bureaucratic metaphors?

And no smoking gun, either.

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Greenmantle V from Greater Wessex, Britannia Since: Feb, 2010 Relationship Status: Hiding
V
#56649: Jun 18th 2013 at 2:40:50 PM

Working Week. I suggest you'd better read the article — it'll take too long to describe herenote 

Keep Rolling On
RadicalTaoist scratching at .8, just hopin' from the #GUniverse Since: Jan, 2001
scratching at .8, just hopin'
#56650: Jun 18th 2013 at 2:52:13 PM

@Fighteer: Economies of scale also have to take into account logistics and distribution. Right now the biggest leading cause of food insecurity involves getting food to people who need to eat (although transportation is only one dimension to this; "let the poor starve" is another).

Share it so that people can get into this conversation, 'cause we're not the only ones who think like this.

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