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Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 30th 2023 at 11:03:59 AM

IConfuseMe from Washington, DC Since: Jan, 2010
#52501: Apr 4th 2013 at 3:32:18 PM

It's not my fault Obama can force through Obamacare but won't go after the tax loopholes. It's not my fault the Democrats talk about amnesty for illegals but won't force Big Corp to finally pay their taxes. Doing either one of those, let alone both, would probably allow the US to give its citizens a year off from paying taxes.

A) there is a difference between won't and can't. And do not even begin to imply that the democrats are the only ones too friendly to big corp. That's endemic of all politicians in most of the world.

b) If you think having illegal immigrants pay thier share of taxes (ignoring that most are so low in terms of income thanks to exploitation and are paid below minimum wage and that were they citizens wouldn't be giving that much anyway) that we could fund the nation for a season let alone a year, then I must ask you to look at the Us's annual bills .versus the number of immigrants.

Like I said there is a limit to how much can be cut before the government, and society, stop functioning. W Hat are we going to cut? Education? Cause we're already scrapping the bottom of that barrel. Security? Police? Caase many districts are understaffed and overworked as is. Where are these magical cuts going to come from without causing more harm than just raising the tax rate on thoseeleast affected by it. I'm curious.

edited 4th Apr '13 3:32:56 PM by IConfuseMe

Silasw A procrastination in of itself from A handcart to hell (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
A procrastination in of itself
#52502: Apr 4th 2013 at 3:33:48 PM

[up]X7 To which I say you're underestimating how much a government costs to run. You're wanting a system with government provision with Sweden, massively less taxes on the poor and only slightly higher taxes on the rich. The number won't work.

[up]X6 I don't.

[up]X5 Yeah but the dems are also going after things that they have even less of a chance getting past the GOP (gun control anyone?).

edited 4th Apr '13 3:37:43 PM by Silasw

“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran
DrTentacles Cephalopod Lothario from Land of the Deep Ones Since: Jul, 2012 Relationship Status: Having tea with Cthulhu
Cephalopod Lothario
#52503: Apr 4th 2013 at 3:35:52 PM

Ok, Starship. New approach. What do you consider too high a tax rate? (Not in terms of percent. In terms of effect on the person.)

And the Government has been going after Tax havens. It isn't easy.

TheStarshipMaxima NCC - 1701 Since: Jun, 2009
NCC - 1701
#52504: Apr 4th 2013 at 3:36:47 PM

I never support cutting social programs. Now, how about the government stop giving bloated contracts to its pet contractors (Google MTA and 2nd avenue extension, or NYC City Time). How about we actually invest in things that pay for themselves like the infrastructure projects Obama constantly gives speeches about?

And how about we stop finding these fucking useless endless wars to keep fighting?

What do you consider too high a tax rate? (Not in terms of percent. In terms of effect on the person.)

I don't think that's a valid question. Stealing $20 from a millionaire is still theft. I think the current system of 40% is perfect.

edited 4th Apr '13 3:38:49 PM by TheStarshipMaxima

It was an honor
DrTentacles Cephalopod Lothario from Land of the Deep Ones Since: Jul, 2012 Relationship Status: Having tea with Cthulhu
Cephalopod Lothario
#52505: Apr 4th 2013 at 3:39:43 PM

[up] How is it stealing? And how isn't it a valid question.

Why do you consider taxes bad, if not for the effect they have on the person being taxed?

Zendervai Since: Oct, 2009
#52506: Apr 4th 2013 at 3:39:44 PM

The war thing is partly on the Republicans. The obsession with war is pretty worrying to Canadians actually.

Eh, it's something that is rather difficult to deal with. It's not a good situation, but it could be so much worse.

edited 4th Apr '13 3:40:44 PM by Zendervai

TheGirlWithPointyEars Never Ask Me the Odds from Outer Space Since: Dec, 2009
Never Ask Me the Odds
#52507: Apr 4th 2013 at 3:39:50 PM

[up][up][up] Um... great, you agree with me and a lot of Democrats on how to cut/what not to? tongue

edited 4th Apr '13 3:40:41 PM by TheGirlWithPointyEars

She of Short Stature & Impeccable Logic My Skating Liveblog
Silasw A procrastination in of itself from A handcart to hell (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
A procrastination in of itself
#52508: Apr 4th 2013 at 3:40:58 PM

[up][up][up][up] Works for me, if you can get the numbers to work then I'm all in. But I doubt you will get them to work. Plus as much as it's nice to hit on the military and the US defense budget, right now we're behind reminded exactly why the US pays out for troops all over the world. So gits like North Kroea can't throw their weight around. Should other nations chip in more? Yes. Should the US military still not be so overgrown, or sent into stupid wars? Yes. But sometimes you gotta fight and you wana be able to win.

edited 4th Apr '13 3:41:18 PM by Silasw

“And the Bunny nails it!” ~ Gabrael “If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we.” ~ Cyran
TheStarshipMaxima NCC - 1701 Since: Jun, 2009
NCC - 1701
#52509: Apr 4th 2013 at 3:41:13 PM

Again, at a certain point we have to stop blaming Republicans for every little thing and accept some responsibility here guys.

It was an honor
DrTentacles Cephalopod Lothario from Land of the Deep Ones Since: Jul, 2012 Relationship Status: Having tea with Cthulhu
Cephalopod Lothario
#52510: Apr 4th 2013 at 3:41:57 PM

[up] The republicans have blocked anything. You want responsibility on the democrats? What should they do?

Our government was not designed for the current situation. And you need to answer my question about what you consider an ideal tax rate in terms of effect on the person being taxed. (Because your argument is that excessive taxation is wrong because of the effect on the person being taxed.)

edited 4th Apr '13 3:43:13 PM by DrTentacles

Wildcard Since: Jun, 2012
#52511: Apr 4th 2013 at 3:42:59 PM

Stealing $20 from a millionaire is still theft

What does this have to do with political leanings? Taxing people is not the same as stealing money.

terlwyth Since: Oct, 2010
#52512: Apr 4th 2013 at 3:42:59 PM

@Starship Concerning stopping useless wars

You'll have to elect a Jimmy Carter style candidate if you want a lack of wars,...if there is one thing that the extremist conservatives in the 50's (think Robert Taft) had over everyone else correct,it was that interventionalism was a stupid idea.

But ever since Truman,...every president except for Jimmy Carter seemed to go out of their way to get into a war somewhere that wasn't their business.

For if there is one dangerous ideology both parties currently espouse and no sane politican can elected without,...it's a neoconservative foreign policy

edited 4th Apr '13 3:44:47 PM by terlwyth

DeviantBraeburn Wandering Jew from Dysfunctional California Since: Aug, 2012
Wandering Jew
#52513: Apr 4th 2013 at 3:43:42 PM

A 40% Marginal Tax Rate on Regular Income over $250,000 worked for Clinton, so I suppose it could work today.

I personally want 70% so we can pay off our debt and fix Social Security.

edited 4th Apr '13 3:44:35 PM by DeviantBraeburn

Everything is Possible. But some things are more Probable than others. JEBAGEDDON 2016
Ultrayellow Unchanging Avatar. Since: Dec, 2010
Unchanging Avatar.
#52514: Apr 4th 2013 at 3:44:19 PM

Stop aggravating the problem by getting partisan themselves?

I mean, seriously. What are they thinking with half of these gun control bills? Do they honestly believe that's going to make the Republicans want to play nice?

Edit: The penalty of tax evasion for a corporation should be to cut the corporation up and and sell it to its competitors at cut-rate price, for one thing. Close all the loopholes, then bring the corporate tax down.

edited 4th Apr '13 3:46:29 PM by Ultrayellow

Except for 4/1/2011. That day lingers in my memory like...metaphor here...I should go.
DrTentacles Cephalopod Lothario from Land of the Deep Ones Since: Jul, 2012 Relationship Status: Having tea with Cthulhu
Cephalopod Lothario
#52515: Apr 4th 2013 at 3:45:26 PM

The republicans were being obstructionist long before Sandy Hook was a thing. You can't argue that it had any effect.

IConfuseMe from Washington, DC Since: Jan, 2010
#52516: Apr 4th 2013 at 3:47:12 PM

Please, (and I am being completely sincere) tell me how exactly congress, either side of congress for that matter, can actually get anything done at the moment? What steps would you advise the democrats to take to get through laws and proposals? Last I checked, the opposition has blatantly said it was no longer interested in cooperation.

So lease, tell me, what do you think the solution is.

If, by the way, find out how to generate the trillion some odd dollars short we fall in terms of expedinture without cutting social benefits, everyone would like to know.

Ultrayellow Unchanging Avatar. Since: Dec, 2010
Unchanging Avatar.
#52517: Apr 4th 2013 at 3:47:32 PM

I'm saying gun control is symptomatic, not the source of the problem. And it's the reason why the GOP won't get any less obstructionist over time.

Edit: I think the corporate tax thing I proposed could work.

edited 4th Apr '13 3:48:23 PM by Ultrayellow

Except for 4/1/2011. That day lingers in my memory like...metaphor here...I should go.
TheStarshipMaxima NCC - 1701 Since: Jun, 2009
NCC - 1701
#52518: Apr 4th 2013 at 3:48:31 PM

No Doctor. My reasoning is that if you are already getting increased taxes from increased income, then leave it be, and don't jack up the rates simply because someone is making more. That's the part that's not fair.

A guy making $4 million and a woman making $50 million should be taxed the same 40%. The government is getting $1.6 off the first guy, and $20 million of the lady. Crying poverty still...that makes no sense to me.

EDIT: I assure you if you got the companies that see billions a year like Citigroup, BP, and the rest to actually open up their books, we'd close the deficit in three years flat. Word.

edited 4th Apr '13 3:50:02 PM by TheStarshipMaxima

It was an honor
Wildcard Since: Jun, 2012
#52519: Apr 4th 2013 at 3:50:00 PM

It takes a lot of money to run the government. and the country, and to do diplomatic relations with other countries.

Of course you tax the companies too. That was a question? Like people were debating not to?

edited 4th Apr '13 3:53:09 PM by Wildcard

Medinoc from France (Before Recorded History)
#52520: Apr 4th 2013 at 3:50:06 PM

You don't jack up the rates because someone is making more. You jack up the rates because you need more, and they're the ones whom it'll hurt the least. Even cumulatively.

edited 4th Apr '13 3:50:12 PM by Medinoc

"And as long as a sack of shit is not a good thing to be, chivalry will never die."
RTaco Since: Jul, 2009
#52521: Apr 4th 2013 at 3:52:29 PM

Like others have said, you seem to be underestimating the money a government needs. You say you support social programs, but at present we can't keep the ones we have (which arguably aren't sufficient to begin with) without much higher tax rates for high earners.

edited 4th Apr '13 3:53:07 PM by RTaco

TheStarshipMaxima NCC - 1701 Since: Jun, 2009
NCC - 1701
#52522: Apr 4th 2013 at 3:53:48 PM

Why do you suddenly need more? Tell me? You just took $1.6 million from someone making $4 millon and then you took $20 million from somebody making $50 million. Why do you still need to take more from the guy making $50 million??

Why?

It was an honor
Wildcard Since: Jun, 2012
#52523: Apr 4th 2013 at 3:54:49 PM

Because it takes a lot of money to run a country. What more do you need? An estimate?

DeviantBraeburn Wandering Jew from Dysfunctional California Since: Aug, 2012
Wandering Jew
#52524: Apr 4th 2013 at 3:55:10 PM

Obama presses donors to help return Pelosi to Speakership

EDIT: How much money does it take to run the country? Either way we managed to get a surplus back in the 1990s, and the Marginal Tax Rate on Regular Income over $250, 000 was only 40%.

I still want 70%

edited 4th Apr '13 3:58:16 PM by DeviantBraeburn

Everything is Possible. But some things are more Probable than others. JEBAGEDDON 2016
terlwyth Since: Oct, 2010
#52525: Apr 4th 2013 at 3:55:51 PM

More people that come into this country out the womb or across the border,...the more that have to be accounted for,simple as that.


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